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Unclebuck
06-13-2004, 10:44 AM
http://www.suntimes.com/output/slezak/cst-spt-carol13.html




No kidding -- Harrington best bet at No. 3

June 13, 2004

BY CAROL SLEZAK SUN-TIMES COLUMNIST Advertisement






Emeka Okafor, who gathered with other NBA hopefuls Saturday at the Wyndham Hotel to meet the press, took a look around the room.



''I see a lot of young faces out there,'' he said.

Only at an NBA predraft event could a 21-year-old kid feel old.

While a slew of stringbean high school boys slouched in their chairs, the strong-shouldered, 6-10 Okafor sat straight and tall.

While 18-year-old Dwight Howard, the country's top high school player, spoke in a barely audible whisper, Okafor's voice was loud and assertive.

As Kris Humphries, the freshman from Minnesota, was saying he just does ''what my agent tells me to do, and hopefully it will work out'' Okafor was remarking that ''the older you get, the more you learn the ropes.''

Okafor, who left Connecticut after his junior season, has won a national championship and earned his college diploma. Of all the players who have declared for the draft, he is the most ready to play immediately and make an impact. Too bad, he won't be around when the Bulls pick at No. 3.

So what should Bulls operations head John Paxson do?

He should trade the pick for a quality veteran starter. Because the Bulls cannot afford to get any younger or any more inexperienced.

Luol Deng, the Duke freshman who should be available at No. 3, might become an excellent NBA player. He is smart and talented and, he says, ''driven to achieve.'' If the Bulls had a solid foundation, Deng would be a solid pick for them.

Ah, but Deng also is refreshingly honest. Asked whether he was ready to play in the NBA, the 6-8 forward said, ''I think I'm ready to compete, but I also believe I have a lot to work on. My game is not there yet. There is a lot of room for improvement.''

The Bulls can't wait.

Which brings me to the Pacers' Al Harrington. The 6-9 small forward averaged 13.3 points and 6.4 rebounds in 31 minutes a game last season. This season's runner-up (to the Mavericks' Antawn Jamison) for the sixth man award, Harrington believes he's earned the right to start. At present, the Pacers don't have room for Harrington in their starting lineup. And they won't, so long as Ron Artest remains on the team.

You think Harrington could start for the Bulls? Yeah, me too. He is worth the No. 3 pick, which is useless to the Bulls as a pick. If the Pacers will take Eddie Robinson along with the pick, the deal will get sweeter still.

In 1998, when Harrington went straight from high school to the NBA, many teams didn't dare use a lottery pick on high school kids. Indiana took Harrington with the 25th pick. If Harrington were coming out of high school today, he would be a lottery pick. Oh, how times have changed.

Will the top kiddies in this year's draft eventually develop into stars? Shaun Livingston, the point forward who was bound for Duke until changing his mind Friday, is a great talent. Andre Iguodala, the Arizona sophomore, has impressed every team he has worked out for. Josh Smith, a 6-9 forward out of Oak Hill Academy, reminds some of Harrington and is projected to be a top-10 pick.

No one knows how long it will take for their bony bodies to fill out. No one knows if they ever will develop into All-Stars, or how long that process might take. There's too much guess work involved, particularly with the high school players. But don't take my word for it. Listen to Howard's response when he was asked about the uncertainty of drafting based on potential.

''You can't judge someone and know how good they're going to be 10 years down the road,'' he whispered.

Listen to what Deng had to say on the subject.

''Everybody who comes into the league wants [to be one of the best players],'' Deng said. ''Some achieve it, some don't.''

The Bulls desperately need a sure thing. Harrington didn't average double figures in scoring until 2001-02, his fourth season in the league. His rebound average has held steady at about six per game since then. He's a six-year veteran. He might have topped out. Then again, he's still only 24 years old.

Is there a veteran available for the Bulls better than Harrington? Tracy McGrady doesn't want to play in Chicago. Antoine Walker, Vince Carter, Chris Webber? Bigger salaries and bigger potential conflicts. (Defense, anyone?) They don't fit into Paxson's and coach Scott Skiles' rebuilding vision.

Tyson Chandler might yet develop into an All-Star. But right now, Harrington is better than any player the Bulls have. He also has playoff experience. And only two years and $13.3 million remain on his contract. Paxson already has talked to the Pacers about Harrington. Here's hoping he makes the deal.

sweabs
06-13-2004, 10:53 AM
Please, please, please don't pull this trade Donnie.

I am really apprehensive about trading Harrington for an unproven rookie + Eddie Robinson (:puke:). I think we could definitely get a better deal than this and I hope D.W. and Larry find it.

able
06-13-2004, 10:55 AM
IF we do this deal, then it is a part of a bigger deal.

As simple as that, everyone kows Al can get us more then a 3d pick and a bad contract.
Henceforth, that 3d pick should be going somewhere else in that case.

What we get back remains a question mark

bulletproof
06-13-2004, 11:32 AM
So what should Bulls operations head John Paxson do?

He should trade the pick for a quality veteran starter. Because the Bulls cannot afford to get any younger or any more inexperienced.

Like we need to get any younger.

Jose Slaughter
06-13-2004, 11:54 AM
I know the Pacers have been able to watch some of the top talent while at Chicago but the lottery guys don't play there.

Have the Pacers brought in anyone for an individual workout that might lead us to believe they "could" move up in the draft?

Arcadian
06-13-2004, 12:03 PM
I think this is just Chicago media wishful thinking. Trades aren't this well known before they happen.

No one in the draft fills our needs-a starting caliber shooting guard or a true center.

If Harrington can get us more than a third pick why would a thrid pick get us Harrington

beast23
06-13-2004, 12:05 PM
So what should Bulls operations head John Paxson do?

He should trade the pick for a quality veteran starter. Because the Bulls cannot afford to get any younger or any more inexperienced.

Like we need to get any younger.Big time agreement from me.

And Eddie Robinson? Please!!!

But what if the Bulls want someone with Harrington's abilities, energy and defensive aggression so badly that they would so something crazy like give up Chandler or Curry and the #3?

How would we feel then?

Shade
06-13-2004, 12:15 PM
IF we do this deal, then it is a part of a bigger deal.

As simple as that, everyone kows Al can get us more then a 3d pick and a bad contract.
Henceforth, that 3d pick should be going somewhere else in that case.

What we get back remains a question mark

I concur. Maybe Orlando would be interested in trading TMac for the #3 and some filler players? Then they'd have the #1 and #3 picks and could go into full rebuilding mode.

Kstat
06-13-2004, 12:18 PM
IF we do this deal, then it is a part of a bigger deal.

As simple as that, everyone kows Al can get us more then a 3d pick and a bad contract.
Henceforth, that 3d pick should be going somewhere else in that case.

What we get back remains a question mark

I concur. Maybe Orlando would be interested in trading TMac for the #3 and some filler players? Then they'd have the #1 and #3 picks and could go into full rebuilding mode.

Nobody's GM is THAT dumb.

TMac is a better player han Orlando can get at #3. Its that simple.

Will Galen
06-13-2004, 12:32 PM
I don't know why we would want the #3 over a vet, but if we do what is a good trade for both teams?

I think Harrington and the #29 is sufficient. I think teams have always wanted and given up to much for draft choices.

Think about it, Harrington is 24 years old. He's been in the league 5 years, and he's just now becoming a player. In other words Chicago won't have to wait until he develops, and they won't have to cross their fingers and hope he develops.

It's like Chicago is being told, 'you can have Al and what's behind door #29 for what's behind door #3.

I think Chicago is a bit Leary about trading with Indiana because of the way the last trade worked out so they are asking for tooooo much.

Hicks
06-13-2004, 12:59 PM
Harrington to Chicago
#3, #29, Bender, Pollard to Orlando
McGrady to Indiana

bulletproof
06-13-2004, 01:02 PM
Harrington to Chicago
#3, #29, Bender, Pollard to Orlando
McGrady to Indiana

Works for me. I love how everyone is trying to figure out deals for McGrady without giving up big-name talent.

Hicks
06-13-2004, 01:09 PM
Harrington to Chicago
#3, #29, Bender, Pollard to Orlando
McGrady to Indiana

Works for me. I love how everyone is trying to figure out deals for McGrady without giving up big-name talent.

You got something better?

bulletproof
06-13-2004, 01:12 PM
Harrington to Chicago
#3, #29, Bender, Pollard to Orlando
McGrady to Indiana

Works for me. I love how everyone is trying to figure out deals for McGrady without giving up big-name talent.

You got something better?

Hey, I like that deal, but let's try to be real for a minute. If it went down the way you propose, I'd be giddy. I just think it's unrealistic.

Shade
06-13-2004, 01:35 PM
IF we do this deal, then it is a part of a bigger deal.

As simple as that, everyone kows Al can get us more then a 3d pick and a bad contract.
Henceforth, that 3d pick should be going somewhere else in that case.

What we get back remains a question mark

I concur. Maybe Orlando would be interested in trading TMac for the #3 and some filler players? Then they'd have the #1 and #3 picks and could go into full rebuilding mode.

Nobody's GM is THAT dumb.

TMac is a better player han Orlando can get at #3. Its that simple.

But I think they'd rather get the #3 and a couple good bench players for TMac than nothing if he decides to leave.

Kstat
06-13-2004, 01:38 PM
IF we do this deal, then it is a part of a bigger deal.

As simple as that, everyone kows Al can get us more then a 3d pick and a bad contract.
Henceforth, that 3d pick should be going somewhere else in that case.

What we get back remains a question mark

I concur. Maybe Orlando would be interested in trading TMac for the #3 and some filler players? Then they'd have the #1 and #3 picks and could go into full rebuilding mode.

Nobody's GM is THAT dumb.

TMac is a better player han Orlando can get at #3. Its that simple.

But I think they'd rather get the #3 and a couple good bench players for TMac than nothing if he decides to leave.

Problem is, they can get MORE for TMac than that if they decide to open bidding for him. You think the Clips would think twice about giving up Brand and #2 for him?

Cactus Jax
06-13-2004, 01:42 PM
IF we do this deal, then it is a part of a bigger deal.

As simple as that, everyone kows Al can get us more then a 3d pick and a bad contract.
Henceforth, that 3d pick should be going somewhere else in that case.

What we get back remains a question mark

I concur. Maybe Orlando would be interested in trading TMac for the #3 and some filler players? Then they'd have the #1 and #3 picks and could go into full rebuilding mode.

Nobody's GM is THAT dumb.

TMac is a better player han Orlando can get at #3. Its that simple.

But I think they'd rather get the #3 and a couple good bench players for TMac than nothing if he decides to leave.

Problem is, they can get MORE for TMac than that if they decide to open bidding for him. You think the Clips would think twice about giving up Brand and #2 for him?

Yeah they would actually. They already have Maggette, and a chance to lock up Richardson, so really they don't need T-Mac. If anything it would be as a possibility, T-Mac for Richardson (S&T), Maggette, and the #2 pick. I doubt the Clips do that as both guys they are giving up are extremely talented.

Hicks
06-13-2004, 01:45 PM
Can't T-Mac deny trades? Doesn't he have a voice in where he goes? I thought so. And even if officially he doesn't, I wouldn't be surprised if unofficially he does (Meaning the GM will try to appease him. Donnie does that to an extent for his guys)

Arcadian
06-13-2004, 01:51 PM
It will take a all-star or a young, close to all star to get Mcgrady-- Houston offering a deal including Francis or Phoenix a deal with Marion.

It's deals like those that are going to be made not bench players and a third pick in a weak draft.

Shade
06-13-2004, 01:55 PM
IF we do this deal, then it is a part of a bigger deal.

As simple as that, everyone kows Al can get us more then a 3d pick and a bad contract.
Henceforth, that 3d pick should be going somewhere else in that case.

What we get back remains a question mark

I concur. Maybe Orlando would be interested in trading TMac for the #3 and some filler players? Then they'd have the #1 and #3 picks and could go into full rebuilding mode.

Nobody's GM is THAT dumb.

TMac is a better player han Orlando can get at #3. Its that simple.

But I think they'd rather get the #3 and a couple good bench players for TMac than nothing if he decides to leave.

Problem is, they can get MORE for TMac than that if they decide to open bidding for him. You think the Clips would think twice about giving up Brand and #2 for him?

I somehow doubt that Sterling would trade for a max salary player like TMac. :shrug:

Kstat
06-13-2004, 02:01 PM
IF we do this deal, then it is a part of a bigger deal.

As simple as that, everyone kows Al can get us more then a 3d pick and a bad contract.
Henceforth, that 3d pick should be going somewhere else in that case.

What we get back remains a question mark

I concur. Maybe Orlando would be interested in trading TMac for the #3 and some filler players? Then they'd have the #1 and #3 picks and could go into full rebuilding mode.

Nobody's GM is THAT dumb.

TMac is a better player han Orlando can get at #3. Its that simple.

But I think they'd rather get the #3 and a couple good bench players for TMac than nothing if he decides to leave.

Problem is, they can get MORE for TMac than that if they decide to open bidding for him. You think the Clips would think twice about giving up Brand and #2 for him?

I somehow doubt that Sterling would trade for a max salary player like TMac. :shrug:

COnsidering Brand is a max salary player? :laugh:

bulletproof
06-13-2004, 02:03 PM
I somehow doubt that Sterling would trade for a max salary player like TMac. :shrug:

Or Donnie and the Simons for that matter.

Unclebuck
06-13-2004, 02:03 PM
I think teams have always wanted and given up to much for draft choices.

.


Truer words have never been spoken

Right now draft picks are grossly overvalued.

Kstat
06-13-2004, 02:04 PM
I think teams have always wanted and given up to much for draft choices.

.


Truer words have never been spoken

Right now draft picks are grossly overvalued.

Especially THIS year's draft, which only has 3 players I see with any real promise, and 2 of those 3 are years away from developing into NBA players.

Hicks
06-13-2004, 02:26 PM
Harrington to Chicago
#3, #29, Bender, Pollard to Orlando
McGrady to Indiana

Works for me. I love how everyone is trying to figure out deals for McGrady without giving up big-name talent.

You got something better?

Hey, I like that deal, but let's try to be real for a minute. If it went down the way you propose, I'd be giddy. I just think it's unrealistic.

So, let's hear a realistic one.

BigDawg44
06-13-2004, 02:29 PM
say, we do do a 3 way with Orlando and Chicago, and Orlando does get the #3 and #29 picks. They could get: Okafur, Livingston (or another big man), and Martin. Not a bad start if you are rebuilding...

Kstat
06-13-2004, 02:33 PM
say, we do do a 3 way with Orlando and Chicago, and Orlando does get the #3 and #29 picks. They could get: Okafur, Livingston (or another big man), and Martin. Not a bad start if you are rebuilding...Orlando already HAS Okafor if they want him. Stop acting like they'd be getting him in a deal.

as for the #3 pick.....no amount of picks is going to pry TMac away from Orlando.

You're going to have to give up additional value. Bender and Tins, or artest.

BigDawg44
06-13-2004, 02:41 PM
say, we do do a 3 way with Orlando and Chicago, and Orlando does get the #3 and #29 picks. They could get: Okafur, Livingston (or another big man), and Martin. Not a bad start if you are rebuilding...Orlando already HAS Okafor if they want him. Stop acting like they'd be getting him in a deal.

as for the #3 pick.....no amount of picks is going to pry TMac away from Orlando.

You're going to have to give up additional value. Bender and Tins, or artest.

I think i put this in the wrong thread. In the thread about deals for TMac, a 3 way was mentioned, sending Al to Chi, Bender, Pollard, #3, #29 to Orlando, and TMac to Indiana. I was merely thinking of the possibilities if that deal did go down. Having a line up potentialy of:
C-Okafur/Pavel/other big man
PF- J. Howard/Okafur
SF- Bender
SG- Martin/whoeverelse
PG-Livingston

The first name is not necessarily the starter, those are just different options at different positions

Roaming Gnome
06-13-2004, 02:50 PM
Hicks touched on this earlier, but it seems like most missed it. T-mac has the power to decide where he goes since he is on a PLAYERS OPTION in his contract! A S&T benefits Orlando, not really T-mac since he is already a max player, right? T-mac could just walk from Orlando if they start talking foolish like Clipper-ville and take a little bit of a pay cut and go to whoever he wants to play for, that will take him.

He is not going to the Clippers, unless they do something to get on HIS short list of teams. Orlando will be dealing with squads that are on McGrady's short list!

JOneal7
06-13-2004, 02:56 PM
For one thing mcgrady doesn't have jack this year. NEXT YEAR is his player option. All this trade talk is if orlando can't get anything to surround him. And judging by our hockey GM, he won't. Tmacs list is VERY SHORT...Houston,NY,Indiana is all I ever heard where he would want to go. This trade stuff is all mute if tmac doesn't ask for a trade towards the end of july. Hopefully for the magic's sake they keep him, or he can come here :-D...anything else and i'll be very dissapointed at the 1 of my 2 favorite players in the L...:(

Roaming Gnome
06-13-2004, 03:14 PM
For one thing mcgrady doesn't have jack this year. NEXT YEAR is his player option. All this trade talk is if orlando can't get anything to surround him. And judging by our hockey GM, he won't. Tmacs list is VERY SHORT...Houston,NY,Indiana is all I ever heard where he would want to go. This trade stuff is all mute if tmac doesn't ask for a trade towards the end of july. Hopefully for the magic's sake they keep him, or he can come here :-D...anything else and i'll be very dissapointed at the 1 of my 2 favorite players in the L...:(

Well, the teams that are not on his short list will have to give the Magic their bounty, while only being able to rent him for a year. GM's will want a S&T or no deal, so...T-mac's world, still!

SkipperZ
06-13-2004, 10:33 PM
IF we do this deal, then it is a part of a bigger deal.

As simple as that, everyone kows Al can get us more then a 3d pick and a bad contract.
Henceforth, that 3d pick should be going somewhere else in that case.

What we get back remains a question mark

I concur. Maybe Orlando would be interested in trading TMac for the #3 and some filler players? Then they'd have the #1 and #3 picks and could go into full rebuilding mode.

Nobody's GM is THAT dumb.

TMac is a better player han Orlando can get at #3. Its that simple.

But I think they'd rather get the #3 and a couple good bench players for TMac than nothing if he decides to leave.

Problem is, they can get MORE for TMac than that if they decide to open bidding for him. You think the Clips would think twice about giving up Brand and #2 for him?

I somehow doubt that Sterling would trade for a max salary player like TMac. :shrug:

COnsidering Brand is a max salary player? :laugh:

Actually I think the bigger problem is i dont think that tmac would go to the clips.

And seriously, brand and dwight howard for tmac? the clippers would be getting ROBBED

indygeezer
06-14-2004, 12:44 AM
It has to be a S&T none of the teams he listed has the cap room to just sign him outright. Now if he wanted to go the Denver, they could do it but not Indiana, or NY, or Houston. No cap space=no leverage. Requires a S&T. So EVERYBODIES leverage is limited here.

Mourning
06-14-2004, 01:00 AM
So what should Bulls operations head John Paxson do?

He should trade the pick for a quality veteran starter. Because the Bulls cannot afford to get any younger or any more inexperienced.

Like we need to get any younger.Big time agreement from me.

And Eddie Robinson? Please!!!

But what if the Bulls want someone with Harrington's abilities, energy and defensive aggression so badly that they would so something crazy like give up Chandler or Curry and the #3?

How would we feel then?

We would be getting away with murder if that went through, but we won't, Harrington is DEFINITELY not even close to that value.

Regards,

Mourning :cool: