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4040
05-02-2008, 03:57 PM
Just saw it on ESPN. Details are scant. Apparently it involved a gun Marvin owned, but he wasn't otherwise involved.

More to come.

ESPN guy is reporting his sources said Marvin Harrison was involved in a fight outside a bar on Tuesday morning in Philly that he is a part owner of. He might have beat someone up pretty bad, and shorty afterwords shots were fired. It's a custom made gun that Marvin owns. He said he didn't fire any shots, but Penn. state law says the owner is charged if a gun they own is used in a crime.

No wittinesses are naming Marvin the shooter right now, but it's possible someone will. He hasn't been arrested or charged yet. 2 people were shot.

aero
05-02-2008, 04:03 PM
man oh man.....

Ownagedood
05-02-2008, 04:07 PM
I am so scared right now.. I just saw that too.. But they didn't say that it was just his gun.. They said the guy he was fighting with got shot and they don't know who the shooter was.. Maybe Marvin.

This isn't what we would think of as Marvin like..

tdubb03
05-02-2008, 04:08 PM
Marvin apparently has 25 registered guns in his name. Allegedly, there are witnesses potentially ID'ing Marvin Harrison as the shooter.

WHAT THE HELL

Jonathan
05-02-2008, 04:14 PM
No need to jump to conclusions on this story just yet. Let's worry if he gets arrested.

btowncolt
05-02-2008, 04:14 PM
Report: Police probe Harrison in Philadelphia shooting

ESPN.com news services

<!-- end page tools --><!-- begin story body --> <!-- template inline -->Indianapolis Colts wide receiver Marvin Harrison is under investigation in his hometown of Philadelphia in a shooting that took place late Tuesday afternoon, a source close to the investigation told Anthony Gargano of Philadelphia's WIP Radio.

The shooting reportedly occurred outside a North Philadelphia bar owned by Harrison. Harrison has yet to be arrested or charged with the crime. The source said the alleged victim came into the bar, Playmakers, around 5 p.m. and engaged in an argument with Harrison, who was at the bar. The victim then left the bar, heading to his car, with Harrison following. Gunfire broke out, the victim was hit in the hand, and a young girl was slightly injured by flying glass from a car that apparently was hit by a bullet.

Police came to scene, but the victim did not identify a shooter. On Wednesday, according to the source, ballistic tests showed that the gun that had fired the shots was a custom-made Belgian weapon, and police determined that Harrison owned such a gun. Police then went to a Philadelphia car wash owned by Harrison to question him about the gun. Harrison admitted owning such a weapon, but claimed it never left his suburban Philadelphia home.

However, the source said the gun was discovered in a bucket at the car wash, and tests showed that it had fired seven bullets that matched those found at the scene. The source said police were contacted Friday by an attorney representing a second alleged victim in the shooting, and police are now waiting for that individual to come forward.

Calls from ESPN to reach Harrison, his agent and the Colts for comment had not been returned.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3378829

Moses
05-02-2008, 04:14 PM
Nothing wrong with being armed imo but 25 guns is quite a bit. My guess is that some guys were making trouble in his club and they were carrying heat and they probably fired on some people so Marvin/armed bodyguards at the club with Marvins gun returned fire in self defense..although that is pure speculation. I just can't see Marvin starting trouble for no good reason as he is a high character guy.

Hopefully nobody was killed.

Rotoworld:

ESPN and WIP Radio Host Anthony Gargano are reporting that detectives are investigating a shooting potentially involving Marvin Harrison. They are investigating whether Harrison was the shooter.
Harrison owns a tavern called "Playmakers" in Philadelphia. Gargano claims that witnesses allege Harrison and a bar patron got into an altercation. As the fight ensued, gunfire was exchanged outside with the victim reportedly shot in the hand. Harrison, who owns 25 guns, reportedly acknowledged owning the type of gun that was used in the shooting. Harrison has met with detectives multiple times, and after initially denying the gun was in the area, now admits it's his gun, but says he wasn't the shooter. Gargano is the sole source here, but this sure looks ugly. No witnesses have come forward saying Harrison was the shooter, although Gargano claims they are coming. No files have been charged. May. 2 - 4:02 pm et

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NFL&hl=115917&id=1502

Bball
05-02-2008, 04:16 PM
Marvin Harrison Accused in Shooting

Michael David SmithPosted May 2nd 2008 3:53PM by Michael David Smith

Filed under: Colts, Indianapolis, Philadelphia, NFL Police Blotter, Breaking News, The Word

Anthony Gargano of WIP radio in Philadelphia is on ESPN this afternoon reporting that Indianapolis Colts wide receiver Marvin Harrison is accused of being involved in a recent shooting at a bar Harrison owns in his home town of Philadelphia.

According to Gargano, police have uncovered a gun registered to Harrison in connection with the incident. His report further states that a fistfight broke out when Harrison escorted a man out of his bar, called Playmakers. When the man fled, gunfire was exchanged. The man's car was struck by a bullet and his hand was grazed, Gargano reported.

Neither Harrison nor anyone else has been arrested in connection with the incident. Gargano reports that police are awaiting witnesses coming forward, but that one witness is prepared to testify that Harrison was the shooter.

Harrison is generally known as a quiet, reserved person who does not get involved in off-field trouble.

http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2008/05/02/marvin-harrison-accused-in-shooting/

Lord Helmet
05-02-2008, 04:23 PM
I'm not going to jump to conclusions, but good lord, I get more than my fair share of this stuff every basketball season.......

Unclebuck
05-02-2008, 04:26 PM
They must mean David Harrison. All the Colts players are perfect.

Seriously though, why does that article just throw in there, that Indianapolis is also home of the Indiana Pacers

Bball
05-02-2008, 04:31 PM
They must mean David Harrison. All the Colts players are perfect.

Seriously though, why does that article just throw in there, that Indianapolis is also home of the Indiana Pacers


It was a poorly executed attempt at levity... but since this story could turn out to be fairly serious I have deleted that reference.

-Bball

Cactus Jax
05-02-2008, 04:33 PM
Jamaal Tinsley was probably the gunner, and robbed poor Marvin.

Seriously I hope whatever the truth is to come out.

d_c
05-02-2008, 04:38 PM
They must mean David Harrison. All the Colts players are perfect.


LOL.

Loved it how people talk about how they can't stand watching the NBA anymore because it's all about thuggery.

Then meanwhile these people are perfectly fine with the NFL despite the likes of Rae Carruth, Lawrence Phillips, Michael Vick, the Cinncinati Bengals et al...

Didn't Dominic Rhodes get a DUI right after the Superbowl? We know the kind of hell that would raise if he was a Pacer player but he's an NFL guy playing for the Colts so no biggie.

btowncolt
05-02-2008, 04:42 PM
Didn't Dominic Rhodes get a DUI right after the Superbowl? We know the kind of hell that would raise if he was a Pacer player but he's an NFL guy playing for the Colts so no biggie.

Rhodes was charged with a DUI a week before his contract with the Colts technically expired, though weeks after the season was over and his locker was cleaned out. He was not re-signed.

The drunk driving charges were later dropped when Rhodes plead guilty to reckless driving.

d_c
05-02-2008, 04:49 PM
Rhodes got a DUI after his contract with the Colts had expired. He was not re-signed.

Yes, because the Superbowl was his last game with the Colts and he probably wasn't going to be re-signed because of the cap situation. Still, my point stands. The guy skated. It's hardly a big deal at all when an NFL player gets a DUI.

btowncolt
05-02-2008, 04:54 PM
Yes, because the Superbowl was his last game with the Colts and he probably wasn't going to be re-signed because of the cap situation. Still, my point stands. The guy skated. It's hardly a big deal at all when an NFL player gets a DUI.

He did not skate. He had no previous record of anything of that nature, the police had issues in handling his evidence, and his BAC at the time of arrest was .09 - .01 over the legal limit. The DUI charge against him was dropped in exchange for a reckless driving plea. He was fined $1,000 in exchange for the guilty plea during a brief appearance in Marion County Criminal Court. Rhodes also was sentenced to 180 days in jail, but 178 were suspended and he received credit for two days. The prosecutor handling the case was pleased with the result - typically not a reaction when prosecutors think anyone is getting a break.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2807151

Certainly have no interest in defending Rhodes as anyone driving drunk or recklessly should face some sort of legal consequence - but it's not really entirely fair to compare his one situation to the litany of involvements the Pacers have had with law enforcement the last few years.

Now, if people bring up the OTHER Colts who have been involved - then have it - there have definitely been a few. But it's just not fair to bring up a guy who the team parted ways with after his legal entanglement and reckless driving and says it's the same as what's been going in Larry and Donnie's House of Crazy.




On topic - this might be quite an interesting day for the Colts.

Lord Helmet
05-02-2008, 05:04 PM
He did not skate. He had no previous record of anything of that nature, the police had issues in handling his evidence, and his BAC at the time of arrest was .09 - .01 over the legal limit. The DUI charge against him was dropped in exchange for a reckless driving plea. He was fined $1,000 in exchange for the guilty plea during a brief appearance in Marion County Criminal Court. Rhodes also was sentenced to 180 days in jail, but 178 were suspended and he received credit for two days. The prosecutor handling the case was pleased with the result - typically not a reaction when prosecutors think anyone is getting a break.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2807151

Certainly have no interest in defending Rhodes as anyone driving drunk or recklessly should face some sort of legal consequence - but it's not really entirely fair to compare his one situation to the litany of involvements the Pacers have had with law enforcement the last few years.

Now, if people bring up the OTHER Colts who have been involved - then have it - there have definitely been a few. But it's just not fair to bring up a guy who the team parted ways with after his legal entanglement and reckless driving and says it's the same as what's been going in Larry and Donnie's House of Crazy.




On topic - this might be quite an interesting day for the Colts.
But probably not a good interesting......:(

d_c
05-02-2008, 05:07 PM
He did not skate. .

As far as public perception goes, he did. That's all I'm saying. I'm not singling him out among any other athlete who's gotten in some kind of trouble, minor or major.

I guess my point is this:

When an NBA player gets in some kind of trouble, it's cause for peoples' eyes to roll everywhere and give them an excuse to say "I can't watch this league anymore because of these spoiled thugs."

When an NFL player gets in similar trouble (and NFL players have gotten in far worse trouble), people no doubt also see them as spoiled thugs, but of course it
does absolutely NOTHING to hinder them from still watching the football and the NFL.

The NFL really has emerged as the nation's new past time. It's truly part of the nation's psyche. It's a monster league, and people are more readily willing to overlook the kinds of off the field problems these players get into moreso than other sports leagues. They talk about wishing athletes weren't such spoiled thugs, but they'll never stop watching this particular league no matter how many thugs there are.

And hell, I'm one of these people. I still watch the NFL despite all that thuggery. Just pointing out the obvious hypocrisy a lot of society demonstrates when talking about the NBA and their image problems.

btowncolt
05-02-2008, 05:09 PM
Okay, fair enough. I can't speak to the NBA as I pay no attention to it anymore.

I just don't like the idea that people think athletes usually get these huge breaks because they're celebrities - it's usually quite the opposite. Most people in Rhodes' situation would not have been fined near $1,000 - and might have had to plead to anything because of all the issues with the case and borderline BAC.

There's just a societal disconnect it seems between what we think people deserve and what most people actually get.

tdubb03
05-02-2008, 05:16 PM
The weapon being a custom Belgian piece, coupled with him owning 25 guns, makes me think he's a collector. Nothing wrong with that I suppose.

The victim who was shot in the hand was specifically questioned if Harrison shot him, to which he replied no. It's been over 72 hours and the victim who can allegedly ID Marvin as the shooter still has not come forward. Seems fishy.

Of course, if this were Pac Man I readily admit I would have a different opinion.

indygeezer
05-02-2008, 05:17 PM
Okay, fair enough. I can't speak to the NBA as I pay no attention to it anymore.

I just don't like the idea that people think athletes usually get these huge breaks because they're celebrities - it's usually quite the opposite. Most people in Rhodes' situation would not have been fined near $1,000 - and might have had to plead to anything because of all the issues with the case and borderline BAC.

There's just a societal disconnect it seems between what we think people deserve and what most people actually get.

My son got a tube to blow in to start the car ($100/mo rental) a three month suspended term, and a Fine all of which totalled $3000.00 for a FIRST OFFENSE where he was pulled over immediately upon leaving his job and his car was towed by the brother of the deputy that nabbed him. Cost him his job and eventually his marriage (money trouble). He tested 1.0 back when that was the limit.

btowncolt
05-02-2008, 05:22 PM
Okay. And he was found guilty of/plead to what? And this was when?

Way off topic at this point.

btowncolt
05-02-2008, 05:25 PM
Nevermind, this is going way too far to right field.

indygeezer
05-02-2008, 05:38 PM
Nevermind, this is going way too far to right field.

DUI but........agreed

grace
05-02-2008, 06:31 PM
UB, I dont' think anyone is claiming the Colts are perfect. If they are they have a short memory. Every time I see Tony Saragosa on TV the first thing I think of is when he got caught at White Castle with a gun. And then there was Jack Trudeau's fight at a bar. Art Schlester has spent more time in the Hamilton County jail than he spend wearing a Colts uniform. Don't even get me started on Mustafah Muhammad.

As for Marvin Harrison I guess it's true that it's the quiet ones you have to watch out for.

SoupIsGood
05-02-2008, 06:38 PM
If this goes really bad for Marvin, is there any way the Colts can get out from under his contract? Because honestly it's a monster.

(Emphasis on the 'if,' here. I'm not actually hoping for that....)

Basketball Fan
05-02-2008, 06:55 PM
UB, I dont' think anyone is claiming the Colts are perfect. If they are they have a short memory. Every time I see Tony Saragosa on TV the first thing I think of is when he got caught at White Castle with a gun. And then there was Jack Trudeau's fight at a bar. Art Schlester has spent more time in the Hamilton County jail than he spend wearing a Colts uniform. Don't even get me started on Mustafah Muhammad.

As for Marvin Harrison I guess it's true that it's the quiet ones you have to watch out for.


Not everyone who is quiet is going to end up doing something illegal I'm quiet doesn't mean I'll be involved in a shooting incident.

And as for Marvin's contract the Colts could get out of it possibly if a morality clause is involved.

Gamble1
05-02-2008, 07:07 PM
Do you guys remember the fan incident in Hawaii involving Marvin? I wonder if we could kind of see something like this coming?

I am not saying its his fault yet but man he could get some serious jail time.

One question I had is why the victim didn't identify him? Makes me think that there is alot more to this than what is being reported.

THe other thing is the bucket gun. Man is that a problem for Marv.

Gamble1
05-02-2008, 07:09 PM
Not everyone who is quiet is going to end up doing something illegal I'm quiet doesn't mean I'll be involved in a shooting incident.

And as for Marvin's contract the Colts could get out of it possibly if a morality clause is involved.

I don't think you have to have a morality clause. I think its more of a union ownership thing. I could be wrong but Vick isn't getting paid is he.

Shade
05-02-2008, 07:10 PM
:wtf: is up with Indiana sports teams?!?! :shakehead

Gamble1
05-02-2008, 07:12 PM
HEYYY WE COULD BE CINCINNATI........Count your blessings.

Shade
05-02-2008, 07:13 PM
HEYYY IT COULD BE CINCINNATI........

We're getting there. They're only one state away, you know.

Gamble1
05-02-2008, 07:16 PM
If this goes really bad for Marvin, is there any way the Colts can get out from under his contract? Because honestly it's a monster.

(Emphasis on the 'if,' here. I'm not actually hoping for that....)

Any contract in the NFL you can get out of. That is why the players like signing bonuses. My question is whether it would count against the cap or not in 2008. IF thats the case I'd be pissed.

THis may open the door for Chad Johnson though I think the COlts would steer clear of that mouth piece.

Gamble1
05-02-2008, 07:19 PM
We're getting there. They're only one state away, you know.

Last time I checked we didn't have some child sex addicts on our team and CINCy has had many more red/blue light specials than we have had.

We can always hang our hats on no steroid use.

Shade
05-02-2008, 07:27 PM
Last time I checked we didn't have some child sex addicts on our team and CINCy has had many more red/blue light specials than we have had.

We can always hang our hates on no steroid use.

...yet. :innocent:

Trader Joe
05-02-2008, 07:27 PM
Well if Marvin did do this, then I expect everyone to be calling for his head. It cost the Pacers Stephen Jackson.

Gamble1
05-02-2008, 07:36 PM
...yet. :innocent:

Who stole your bike. Man Shade! You can be a season killer when you get into that mood.

Don't worry you seem well prepared for summer! :D

Bball
05-02-2008, 08:35 PM
Well if Marvin did do this, then I expect everyone to be calling for his head. It cost the Pacers Stephen Jackson.


I have to reply to this:
The shooting incident alone didn't cost Stephen Jackson a spot on the Pacers. Actually, Stephen Jackson cost Stephen Jackson a spot on the Pacers.

Marvin doesn't have a history of bringing a negative spotlight onto the Colts. In fact, it's been the exact opposite. Maybe that has earned him a few benefit of the doubt points along the way. Maybe that's a factor in why the Hawaii incident faded so quickly. I don't really know. What I do know is he has been a superb player and representative for the Colts throughout his career, was not part of a brawl that sullied his whole sport, and doesn't have a (known) history of getting into nightclub fights... missing practice (unexcused)... or otherwise embarrassing his team, fans or city.

None of this is to defend him from these particular charges (or allegations as they are currently) but it is to point out there is a vast ocean of difference between the reputations of Stephen Jackson and Marvin Harrison that people are looking at.

Stephen Jackson had made his own bed long before the shooting incident. It's totally understandable how people might be less reluctant to quickly judge Marvin than they were to judge Stephen Jackson.

Individually, these incidents may be a lot alike.... but Marvin and Stephen certainly aren't alike as individuals.

.02
-Bball

Suaveness
05-02-2008, 09:56 PM
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/8098778?MSNHPHMA

Sorry if it's repeating info



Lt. Frank Vanore said the investigation of Tuesday's shooting was continuing. Harrison has not been arrested or charged.

"He was interviewed," Vanore said Friday. "Why he was interviewed, that is all part of the investigation. No one is a suspect."

Harrison's agent, Tom Condon, insisted Friday that his client did not play a role in the incident.

"Marvin Harrison was not involved in any shooting. The report is erroneous," Condon told FOXSports.com's Jay Glazer.
While Condon would not comment on Harrison's interview with police, he maintained that Harrison was not the subject of the investigation.

The Toxic Avenger
05-02-2008, 10:38 PM
:cry:

Gamble1
05-02-2008, 10:49 PM
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/8098778?MSNHPHMA

Sorry if it's repeating info



Lt. Frank Vanore said the investigation of Tuesday's shooting was continuing. Harrison has not been arrested or charged.

"He was interviewed," Vanore said Friday. "Why he was interviewed, that is all part of the investigation. No one is a suspect."

Harrison's agent, Tom Condon, insisted Friday that his client did not play a role in the incident.

"Marvin Harrison was not involved in any shooting. The report is erroneous," Condon told FOXSports.com's Jay Glazer.
While Condon would not comment on Harrison's interview with police, he maintained that Harrison was not the subject of the investigation.

What do you expect from an agent? It could go either way. Either the source is lying or the agent.

jeffg-body
05-02-2008, 11:33 PM
When I got home this afternoon from work my wife told me about it all and my first thought was she must be confused and it had to be the Pacers and David Harrison.

Merz
05-02-2008, 11:53 PM
THe other thing is the bucket gun. Man is that a problem for Marv.

I hear now that that is a fabrication, Marv turned his gun in to the police when questioned.

There seems to be a whole lot of differences from the original story.


http://coltfreaks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4613&page=28

May 2, 2008 (WPVI) -- Police are investigating a possible connection between a North Philadelphia shooting and pro-bowl wide receiver Marvin Harrison.
Sources tell Action News a group of men got into a fight at Harrison's bar, Playmakers, at 25th and Thompson Streets last weekend.
On Tuesday, one of the men allegedly went to Harrison's brother's detail shop where another fight broke out. Shots were fired and two men were injured. Harrison showed up at the scene a short time later.
Police called him in for questioning. Harrison turned over a gun that produces unique bullet casings similar to ones found at the scene.

Basketball Fan
05-02-2008, 11:55 PM
What do you expect from an agent? It could go either way. Either the source is lying or the agent.



We'll soon find out

Eindar
05-03-2008, 12:28 AM
I have to reply to this:
The shooting incident alone didn't cost Stephen Jackson a spot on the Pacers. Actually, Stephen Jackson cost Stephen Jackson a spot on the Pacers.

Marvin doesn't have a history of bringing a negative spotlight onto the Colts. In fact, it's been the exact opposite. Maybe that has earned him a few benefit of the doubt points along the way. Maybe that's a factor in why the Hawaii incident faded so quickly. I don't really know. What I do know is he has been a superb player and representative for the Colts throughout his career, was not part of a brawl that sullied his whole sport, and doesn't have a (known) history of getting into nightclub fights... missing practice (unexcused)... or otherwise embarrassing his team, fans or city.

None of this is to defend him from these particular charges (or allegations as they are currently) but it is to point out there is a vast ocean of difference between the reputations of Stephen Jackson and Marvin Harrison that people are looking at.

Stephen Jackson had made his own bed long before the shooting incident. It's totally understandable how people might be less reluctant to quickly judge Marvin than they were to judge Stephen Jackson.

Individually, these incidents may be a lot alike.... but Marvin and Stephen certainly aren't alike as individuals.

.02
-Bball

Revisionist history. The Brawl was a black eye for the franchise, but there was no "history" of night club fights for Stephen Jackson that I'm aware of. In fact, if you count the brawl as an "on-court" incident, Club Rio is the *only* off-court incident Stephen Jackson was involved in that I'm aware of, unless I'm missing something.

Even in a best-case scenario, what Marvin did was right up there with what Shawne Williams did this year. Exactly how many custom-made Belgian guns are there in Philly, anyways? Either Marvin was the shooter, or he gave the gun to his brother, who then tried to kill someone with it.

Maybe Marvin Harrison doesn't like talking about what he does during the offseason because it's not something Colts fans would like to hear.

grace
05-03-2008, 12:32 AM
Either the source is lying or the agent.

Personally I don't trust either of them.

idioteque
05-03-2008, 01:17 AM
I am willing to wait for all of the information to come out. THAT BEING SAID...

There is no reason for Marvin Harrison to have 25 guns registered to him. There is no reason for Marvin Harrison to own a custom Belgian-rifle or whatever the hell it is. There is absolutely no reason for it. Marvin seems to have transformed himself into his own well-regulated militia. Him owning all of these guns makes him look very negative to the media.

If Marvin Harrison ran after some guy with a gun shooting, if it turns out that that is what happened, then that is worse than ANYTHING anyone on the Pacers has ever done and Harrison should be moved immediately or even cut if necessary. We've seen what this type of behavior has done to one once beloved franchise. It doesn't need to happen again. A zero tolerance policy should be in effect.

tdubb03
05-03-2008, 01:27 AM
I am willing to wait for all of the information to come out. THAT BEING SAID...

There is no reason for Marvin Harrison to have 25 guns registered to him. There is no reason for Marvin Harrison to own a custom Belgian-rifle or whatever the hell it is. There is absolutely no reason for it. Marvin seems to have transformed himself into his own well-regulated militia. Him owning all of these guns makes him look very negative to the media.

They're all legally registered, none of them were (as far as I know) illegally obtained. He likes them, he collects them. It's a perfectly legal hobby thanks to the 2nd Amendment. To hell with the media, the day ESPN and their ilk wait for due process to run its course before jumping on a story just to be the first to break it is the day I start rooting for the Patriots and Cubs. He can pursue whatever hobby he enjoys.

Eindar
05-03-2008, 01:45 AM
They're all legally registered, none of them were (as far as I know) illegally obtained. He likes them, he collects them. It's a perfectly legal hobby thanks to the 2nd Amendment. To hell with the media, the day ESPN and their ilk wait for due process to run its course before jumping on a story just to be the first to break it is the day I start rooting for the Patriots and Cubs. He can pursue whatever hobby he enjoys.

All true...until one of them is used in a felony. At that point, you're more than a "collector".

tdubb03
05-03-2008, 01:56 AM
All true...until one of them is used in a felony. At that point, you're more than a "collector".

Touche. However, no felonies have been filed.

BoomBaby31
05-03-2008, 02:06 AM
I was in and out all day and kept seeing "Harrison" and something about a shooting. Immediately I thought it was Harrison off the Steelers -for some reason- then, I was making a bet at a casino and saw it again, then a mention of Indiana. So, I thought it was Hulk; but now I found out it is Marvin Harrison!!! Wtf? Marvin Harrison, #88 WR with the colts, the quiet guy, class act Marv? WTF?? What is going on with our sports organizations? I was reading a report, and supposedly he had an incident back in 05 where he choked out a minor, when they were trying to get an autograph. I don't remember that, do you?

Isaac
05-03-2008, 02:12 AM
They're all legally registered, none of them were (as far as I know) illegally obtained. He likes them, he collects them. It's a perfectly legal hobby thanks to the 2nd Amendment. To hell with the media, the day ESPN and their ilk wait for due process to run its course before jumping on a story just to be the first to break it is the day I start rooting for the Patriots and Cubs. He can pursue whatever hobby he enjoys.


Great post, and as a White Sox and Colts fan, I like the way you think.

I really hope Marvin didn't do anything outside of beating up a guy he knew would bring problems in to the bar. Even though I certainly wouldn't hope for that to happen, I like that aspect of the story. I like Marv's mysterious and shy but tough on the inside image and attitude. I'm sure he didn't fire at the guy, I think he's smarter then that.

No matter what comes out of this though, I'll always love and appreciate what Marv has done for us on the field, that's what I care most about.

I've also always known Marv had a much rougher side that I've always been surprised more people didn't see. I've never looked at him as a lot of people did as an innocent model citizen.

Bball
05-03-2008, 03:28 AM
Revisionist history.

Revisionist? Please explain.

-Bball

Eindar
05-03-2008, 05:58 AM
Revisionist? Please explain.

-Bball

You're trying to make what Stephen Jackson look worse, so that what Marvin Harrison did will look better. You can also call it a straw man fallacy.


The facts are that Stephen Jackson was involved in one incident, one less than Marvin Harrison, once you throw in the '05 incident mentioned earlier, and Jackson only fired a weapon to protect his own safety. It's not like he was, you know actually trying to kill someone . That's the worst case scenario, but even the best case scenario has Harrison loaning out guns to relatives to shoot people with and getting into fistfights. That is, unless you think there are several custom-made Belgian handguns floating around the streets of Philly.

Bball
05-03-2008, 06:46 AM
You're trying to make what Stephen Jackson look worse, so that what Marvin Harrison did will look better. You can also call it a straw man fallacy.


The facts are that Stephen Jackson was involved in one incident, one less than Marvin Harrison, once you throw in the '05 incident mentioned earlier, and Jackson only fired a weapon to protect his own safety. It's not like he was, you know actually trying to kill someone . That's the worst case scenario, but even the best case scenario has Harrison loaning out guns to relatives to shoot people with and getting into fistfights. That is, unless you think there are several custom-made Belgian handguns floating around the streets of Philly.

You need to re-read what I said and the statement it was replying to.

-Bball

Eindar
05-03-2008, 06:53 AM
You need to re-read what I said and the statement it was replying to.

-Bball

Doesn't change the fact that you're trying to judge two men based on reputation, when Stephen Jackson's reputation should be the same as Harrison's, if we're looking at it objectively, and not looking at Jackson's cornrows and bling vs. Harrison's serial killer demeanor. :)

duke dynamite
05-03-2008, 09:26 AM
Slaps forehead.

Make it stop!

Doug
05-03-2008, 10:16 AM
My sons question when somebody just brought up the fact that there was a shooting at Harrison's bar and he might be involved:

"Is he a Pacer?"



Sigh....

grace
05-03-2008, 02:19 PM
My sons question when somebody just brought up the fact that there was a shooting at Harrison's bar and he might be involved:

"Is he a Pacer?"



Sigh....

Which disappointed you more, the fact that your son didn't realize Marvin was a member of a Super Bowl team or that he assumed he was a Pacer?

duke dynamite
05-03-2008, 03:31 PM
Agent: Harrison not subject of investigation

Player's bar in Philly scene of shooting


http://cmsimg.indystar.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/persbilde?Avis=BG&ID=mchappell&MaxW=60&MaxH=60
By Mike Chappell (mike.chappell@indystar.com)
Posted: May 3, 2008


Marvin Harrison’s agent said the Indianapolis Colts wide receiver is not the subject of an investigation into a shooting in Philadelphia earlier this week, contrary to Internet reports citing unnamed sources.
Tom Condon, Harrison’s agent, told ESPN’s Chris Mortensen: “I’ve spoken with Marvin and I’ve spoken with his attorney, and they say the reports are erroneous. Marvin was not involved in any shooting, and he is not the subject of this investigation.’’

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080503/SPORTS03/805030459








This really adds a twist to the situation.

Lord Helmet
05-03-2008, 03:33 PM
Agent: Harrison not subject of investigation

Player's bar in Philly scene of shooting


http://cmsimg.indystar.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/persbilde?Avis=BG&ID=mchappell&MaxW=60&MaxH=60
By Mike Chappell (mike.chappell@indystar.com)
Posted: May 3, 2008


Marvin Harrisonís agent said the Indianapolis Colts wide receiver is not the subject of an investigation into a shooting in Philadelphia earlier this week, contrary to Internet reports citing unnamed sources.
Tom Condon, Harrisonís agent, told ESPNís Chris Mortensen: ďIíve spoken with Marvin and Iíve spoken with his attorney, and they say the reports are erroneous. Marvin was not involved in any shooting, and he is not the subject of this investigation.íí

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080503/SPORTS03/805030459








This really adds a twist to the situation.
Yeah, you really don't know what to believe. That is why I will wait it out before I judge.

duke dynamite
05-03-2008, 03:56 PM
Yeah, you're right but it's ultimately going to be bad PR either way.


Ha, just a tiny, little bit late there, Mr. Helmet.

:P

Lord Helmet
05-03-2008, 04:05 PM
Yeah, you're right but it's ultimately going to be bad PR either way.


Ha, just a tiny, little bit late there, Mr. Helmet.

:P
Pretty much.

tdubb03
05-04-2008, 04:59 AM
Four days and still no charges...

Eindar
05-04-2008, 06:15 AM
Four days and still no charges...

Good thing the statue of limitations is....never!

Honestly, I don't think Harrison pulled the trigger, but even given that he didn't, it's pretty obvious that someone got shot with one of his guns, near or on his property. It's also been reported that he beat the bejeezus out of this guy the day before, right?

Like I said, best case scenario, this is no better than Club Rio. Worst case scenario, this is on the level of Ray Lewis.

Ownagedood
05-04-2008, 10:49 AM
Another sign Marvin is innocent: ESPN changed their breaking news section so it wasn't breaking news.. It was just a headline and it said Marvin was "interviewed" by police about a shooting..

They just wanted to scare the crap outta us the first day.. Stupid Pats fans. :)

Noodle
05-04-2008, 05:14 PM
**** ESPN

Doug
05-05-2008, 08:15 PM
Which disappointed you more, the fact that your son didn't realize Marvin was a member of a Super Bowl team or that he assumed he was a Pacer?

Oh, he knows who Marvin Harrison is. I've got an 88 jersey.

That's what makes it all the more sad.

Eindar
05-06-2008, 06:57 AM
There's a report on ESPN.com that says police have confirmed the casings as having come from Harrison's gun. Given that Harrison told the police that the gun never left his home, I wonder what else he's lying about.

By the way, what started out as a "wait and see" story, is pretty quickly turning into a witch hunt. You can almost hear the tone of the ESPN story developing that vibe we joke about with the Pacers, where any way they can involve them, they will. For instance, they've got the bit about finding the gun in a bucket of water, even though nobody is sure if that's true, and they also include the Pro Bowl bit, with no reference to what someone else here mentioned that the woman had tried it on another athlete or whatever, which was supposedly the reason for dismissal.

BoomBaby31
05-06-2008, 09:42 PM
Good thing the statue of limitations is....never!

Honestly, I don't think Harrison pulled the trigger, but even given that he didn't, it's pretty obvious that someone got shot with one of his guns, near or on his property. It's also been reported that he beat the bejeezus out of this guy the day before, right?

Like I said, best case scenario, this is no better than Club Rio. Worst case scenario, this is on the level of Ray Lewis.


No better than Club Rio? This is way worse then club Rio, if Harrison has a special type of gun and the bullets to that gun was used, that is involvement. If Harrison wasn't a Top NFL receiver he would be arrested already.

pwee31
05-06-2008, 10:07 PM
Maybe it's a good thing the Colts got use to playing without Harrison last year?

Taterhead
05-07-2008, 04:05 AM
Maybe it's a good thing the Colts got use to playing without Harrison last year?

I do think regardless of his legal standing Harrison will be suspended. John Clayton cited a rule that states that if a player owns a weapon that is used in a crime they can be suspended even without direct involvement in the incident itself.

travmil
05-07-2008, 11:43 AM
I do think regardless of his legal standing Harrison will be suspended. John Clayton cited a rule that states that if a player owns a weapon that is used in a crime they can be suspended even without direct involvement in the incident itself.

While that is true, that's not the whole story of that rule. For sake of this example let's assume that Marvin is telling the truth. Even if the gun is his and was used by someone else, it has to be proven that he conspired in any activity to be suspended. That means that unless the NFL can prove that he gave the weapon to the person who did the shooting, he can't be suspended. He can simply say that the person took the weapon without permission and it's word against word.

Slick Pinkham
05-07-2008, 01:51 PM
I think the point is that it is against the law in Pennsylvania to own a gun that is used in a crime.

Harrison, if not the shooter, could still be found guilty of owning a gun used in a crime, which is I think a misdemeanor.

The NFL could then say "You have been found guilty of committing a crime. You are suspended". I think that the code of conduct bylaws give them lots of leeway to do that. They don't need to investigate-- they can just look at what the judge/jury decided or the plea.

It would be a bit odd, though, since the NFL has (I think?) only applied suspensions to DUIs, assaults, and felonies. If the charge is a misdemeanor then it might not rise to the level of warranting suspension.

Everyone in Indy must be hoping that this is all there is to worry about.

Kravitz is right though in his column today, it's too early to tell.

The only stupid thing about the Kravitz column today was him mentioning the Duke rape case. I guess from now on anyone who claims to be innocent of anything can say "Duke rape case" but that is silly. That was a unique case where false information was propagated by capitalizing on racial tension, economic disparity, and political posturing. None of that applies here.

Taterhead
05-08-2008, 04:03 AM
While that is true, that's not the whole story of that rule. For sake of this example let's assume that Marvin is telling the truth. Even if the gun is his and was used by someone else, it has to be proven that he conspired in any activity to be suspended. That means that unless the NFL can prove that he gave the weapon to the person who did the shooting, he can't be suspended. He can simply say that the person took the weapon without permission and it's word against word.

Let me ask you this, do you think the fact that he was earlier involved in a fistfight with this person hinders his ability to make that case? Because there is eye witness evidence to that. I saw a clip off of local Philly news where an eyewitness came forward that saw Marvin beat this guy up in the bar just before the shooting.

I don't think Marvin should be suspended at all, from what I've heard about the "victim" it's more than likely justified regardless of whether he did or not. But the police have evidence I'm sure the NFL will see and we won't, so it's hard to say right now.

Basketball Fan
05-09-2008, 11:32 AM
I do think regardless of his legal standing Harrison will be suspended. John Clayton cited a rule that states that if a player owns a weapon that is used in a crime they can be suspended even without direct involvement in the incident itself.



For a first time offense?

Taterhead
05-10-2008, 02:10 AM
For a first time offense?

Yeah, from what Clayton was saying history didn't matter.

tdubb03
05-10-2008, 02:15 AM
Yeah, from what Clayton was saying history didn't matter.

Makes sense to me. It's a tie to crime, perhaps by proxy. Not sure of the precedent in this type of thing, 2 games maybe?