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Willbo
06-09-2004, 12:34 PM
Sorry guys not sure if this has been mentioned (I believe mayhaps sometime ago) and I might need someone to confirm it, but apparently his Fordness (chad that is) has suggested in the most recent insider that the Pacers have offered Harrington and #29 to the bulls for #3 and the juicy contract of Scottie Pippen.

While i dont generally place to much stake in what ford has to say it might be an interesting talking point....

While most on here would prefer a ready made SG there are apparently some ready to contribute prospects this early in the draft (Gordon, Igudala (sp?)) off the top of my head, however gordon would appear to be more of a tweener and Iguodala has no outside shot to speak of hmmmm....

Maybe part of a larger deal? Interesting to note thouh all this talk of trading up (I believe a rumour did the orunds for awhile concerning washingtons #5) maybe few teams are biting at a Harrington for SG swap

Or maybe Barry is available for the MLE......

TheSauceMaster
06-09-2004, 12:37 PM
Yeah kinda a old rumor , I beleive there is a thread around here discussing it .... but I don't see it happening.

Willbo
06-09-2004, 12:38 PM
sorry read somewhere that it cropped up again in todays insider

TheSauceMaster
06-09-2004, 12:43 PM
No Problem , alot of trade threads and some get lost in the shuffle :laugh:

I was reading a article today and paxon said this :

Paxson is interested in all three of the top draft prospects -- Connecticut junior forward Emeka Okafor, Duke freshman forward Luol Deng and Howard -- but said he might trade the Bulls' picks to get the players he feels will help his team the most.

''We've had several calls from other teams expressing interest in our picks,'' Paxson said Monday. ''It's all interesting. But the way this thing works is that nobody plays his hand early and offers specifics. People just express that they do have interest in it.


Right now it's who can play the best hand of poker basically :cool:

Bball
06-09-2004, 02:21 PM
I don't believe it. I don't think at this point in our development they would trade a major contributor for a draft pick. We need immediate scoring help if we move Al. There are no Wade type scorers worthy of the #3 pick and we don't need a big man project.

Walsh did it in '99.... therefore... it is now a possibility that I wouldn't have believed otherwise.

-Bball

Cactus Jax
06-09-2004, 09:30 PM
How about this proposal? I think the sheer size of it, and the fact that salaries would have to be thrown in for this to work but here goes.

Pacers trade: Al Harrington, Fred Jones or Jonathan Bender, 29th pick
Pacers get: Scottie Pippen, #6 pick, Jason Terry

Bulls trade: #3 pick, Scottie Pippen, Jerome Williams
Bulls Get: Al Harrington, #29 pick

Magic Trade: #1 Pick
Magic Get: #3 Pick, #16 pick, Jerome Williams

Hawks trade: #6 Pick, #16 Pick, Jason Terry
Hawks Get: #1 Pick, Jonathan Bender or Fred Jones

The Pacers get a Soild player who can play the 1 and 2 spots, plus a high draft pick, and some slight cap space.

The Bulls get rid of Williams' contract, plus get Al Harrington.

The Magic, get a solid veteran in Williams and get the 3 and 16 picks.

The Hawks really want the #1 pick to get Howard, and get him plus either Bender or Fred Jones and really get to start over with a local prep star.

Kstat
06-09-2004, 09:43 PM
Pacers trade: Al Harrington, Fred Jones or Jonathan Bender, 29th pick
Pacers get: Scottie Pippen, #6 pick, Jason Terry

The Pacers actually give up quite a bit in that deal for the #6 pick of a weak draft and a hopelessly undersized SG.

Bulls trade: #3 pick, Scottie Pippen, Jerome Williams
Bulls Get: Al Harrington, #29 pick

If I'm Chicago I can't wait to do this deal. They have enough kids on that team already.

Magic Trade: #1 Pick
Magic Get: #3 Pick, #16 pick, Jerome Williams

Sorry, but no way is Orlando going to drop two spots in the draft when there are no sure-fire big men after #2, for JYD and the 16th pick. Thats simply not going to happen.

Hawks trade: #6 Pick, #16 Pick, Jason Terry
Hawks Get: #1 Pick, Jonathan Bender or Fred Jones

Th Hawks would NEVER do this trade. Why? Because its TOO DAMN SMART. The Hawks are idiots and this trade would make them look like bandits. Shoot, just the #1 pick ALONE for that crap is highway robbery.

Cactus Jax
06-09-2004, 09:57 PM
Pacers trade: Al Harrington, Fred Jones or Jonathan Bender, 29th pick
Pacers get: Scottie Pippen, #6 pick, Jason Terry

The Pacers actually give up quite a bit in that deal for the #6 pick of a weak draft and a hopelessly undersized SG.

Bulls trade: #3 pick, Scottie Pippen, Jerome Williams
Bulls Get: Al Harrington, #29 pick

If I'm Chicago I can't wait to do this deal. They have enough kids on that team already.

Magic Trade: #1 Pick
Magic Get: #3 Pick, #16 pick, Jerome Williams

Sorry, but no way is Orlando going to drop two spots in the draft when there are no sure-fire big men after #2, for JYD and the 16th pick. Thats simply not going to happen.

Hawks trade: #6 Pick, #16 Pick, Jason Terry
Hawks Get: #1 Pick, Jonathan Bender or Fred Jones

Th Hawks would NEVER do this trade. Why? Because its TOO DAMN SMART. The Hawks are idiots and this trade would make them look like bandits. Shoot, just the #1 pick ALONE for that crap is highway robbery.

It wan't a perfect deal by any means, but I think saying Terry is "hopeless" is a little much. The Magic could be replaced with the Clippers with the 2 pick going to Atlanta, Terry to the Clippers, and Quintin Richardson in a S&T to Indiana.

It was mostly just a stab in the dark as I was bored as hell.

wintermute
06-10-2004, 05:43 AM
I don't believe it. I don't think at this point in our development they would trade a major contributor for a draft pick. We need immediate scoring help if we move Al. There are no Wade type scorers worthy of the #3 pick and we don't need a big man project.

Walsh did it in '99.... therefore... it is now a possibility that I wouldn't have believed otherwise.

-Bball

Not. That was an OLD team in 99. They NEEDED to risk trying to develop a new young star.
not QUITE the same situation right now, eh?? :idea:

quite agree.

the best theory i've heard about acquiring the #3 (or other high pick) is to use it as trade bait for someone like t-mac. that makes some sense at least, since a rebuilding team would value high picks more.

Bball
06-10-2004, 10:34 AM
I don't believe it. I don't think at this point in our development they would trade a major contributor for a draft pick. We need immediate scoring help if we move Al. There are no Wade type scorers worthy of the #3 pick and we don't need a big man project.

Walsh did it in '99.... therefore... it is now a possibility that I wouldn't have believed otherwise.

-Bball

Not. That was an OLD team in 99. They NEEDED to risk trying to develop a new young star.
not QUITE the same situation right now, eh?? :idea:

They didn't 'need' to 'risk' anything at that point IMHO. Of the members who you might consider 'old' that trade did nothing to minimize their importance to the team. As a matter of fact, it put more emphassis on the old players. I'll never see trading away a team strength for a project as a smart move... not when you are inside a championship window. There had to be much smarter moves available besides the fact of who we could've had in that draft. We got burned so bad that I have to wonder if Walsh would do that again.

Let's not forget, we had projects even then (Al Harrington for one).

I know all the arguments. I've heard them 1000 times and I still don't buy it. Not when the player you get is Bender.

Didn't Walsh say last year he was thru babysitting? Hopefully that is a sign he doesn't want anymore projects taking up bench space. ....Or maybe he was just signaling us that Bird would be coming aboard and it would be his problem.

Anyway.... I believe it should be a 'near certainty' whatever player we'd trade for will have a role with this team. I don't want to see another team lessened by a Bender II.

Trading up for a high pick and then trading it away for a vet sounds intriguing though.

-Bball

Bball
06-10-2004, 10:39 PM
As to the 99 draft, what would YOU have done? You've got no young stars and the bottom of the barrel in picks. So they rolled the dice on a 7' high school kid with long arms and a 40" vertical jump. Gee what a bunch of idiots. ;) :idea:

2. Steve Francis Maryland Vancouver
3. Baron Davis UCLA Charlotte
4. Lamar Odom Rhode Island LA Clippers
5. Jonathan Bender Picayune (MS) HS Toronto
6. Wally Szczerbiak Miami (OH) Minnesota
7. Richard Hamilton Connecticut Washington
8. Andre Miller Utah Cleveland
9. Shawn Marion Nevada-Las Vegas Phoenix
10. Jason Terry Arizona Atlanta
11. Trajan Langdon Duke Cleveland
12. Aleksander Radojevic Barton County (KS) CC Toronto
13. Corey Maggette Duke Seattle
14. William Avery Duke Minnesota
15. Frederic Weis Limoges (France) New York
16. Ron Artest St John's Chicago
17. Cal Bowdler Old Dominion Atlanta
18. James Posey Xavier Denver
19. Quincy Lewis Minnesota Utah
20. Dion Glover Georgia Tech Atlanta
21. Jeff Foster Southwest Texas State Golden State
22. Kenny Thomas New Mexico Houston
23. Devean George Augsburg LA Lakers
24. Andrei Kirilenko CSKA Moscow (Russia) Utah
25. Tim James Miami (FL) Miami
26. Vonteego Cummings Pittsburgh Indiana
27. Jumaine Jones Georgia Atlanta
28. Scott Padgett Kentucky Utah
29. Leon Smith King (IL) HS San Antonio

------
Would you still pick Bender 5th?

-Bball

ChicagoJ
06-10-2004, 10:53 PM
Man, after the top-four, that is a *lousy* draft.

If my math is correct, six first-rounders have already played their way out of the league, and one of them will never be invited to the Knicks training camp.

Hicks
06-10-2004, 10:58 PM
Imagine if we had took Rip?

Snickers
06-10-2004, 11:06 PM
Imagine if we had took Rip?

Or Artest....

That draft, like all drafts in this age, are all about "pick the raw talent with superstar potential" rather than "pick someone who'll be a solid contributor." Nobody wants to look back and see a name like Kobe Bryant or Pau Gasol one slot below their pick.

Cactus Jax
06-12-2004, 02:13 PM
Man, after the top-four, that is a *lousy* draft.

If my math is correct, six first-rounders have already played their way out of the league, and one of them will never be invited to the Knicks training camp.

Rip Hamilton
Andre Miller
Shawn Marion
Jason Terry
Corey Maggette
Ron Artest
James Posey
Andrei Kirilenko

You better being kidding on that being a lousy draft. I'm a big Bender supporter but those are all very solid to almost superstar type players. That draft has secretly been a spectacular draft.

ChicagoJ
06-12-2004, 10:36 PM
Man, after the top-four, that is a *lousy* draft.

If my math is correct, six first-rounders have already played their way out of the league, and one of them will never be invited to the Knicks training camp.

Rip Hamilton
Andre Miller
Shawn Marion
Jason Terry
Corey Maggette
Ron Artest
James Posey
Andrei Kirilenko

You better being kidding on that being a lousy draft. I'm a big Bender supporter but those are all very solid to almost superstar type players. That draft has secretly been a spectacular draft.

Once you get beyond #10, that draft was awful.

A few of those guys you mentioned (Artest, Posey, Kirilenko) have proven they should have been taken in front of all these guys.

11. Trajan Langdon Duke Cleveland
12. Aleksander Radojevic Barton County (KS) CC Toronto
14. William Avery Duke Minnesota
15. Frederic Weis Limoges (France) New York
17. Cal Bowdler Old Dominion Atlanta
19. Quincy Lewis Minnesota Utah
20. Dion Glover Georgia Tech Atlanta
25. Tim James Miami (FL) Miami
26. Vonteego Cummings Pittsburgh Indiana
27. Jumaine Jones Georgia Atlanta
28. Scott Padgett Kentucky Utah
29. Leon Smith King (IL) HS San Antonio

This draft was so bad that Foster probably should have been in the lottery.

:pepper:

Anthem
06-12-2004, 10:45 PM
Rip Hamilton
Andre Miller
Shawn Marion
Jason Terry
Corey Maggette
Ron Artest
James Posey
Andrei Kirilenko

You better being kidding on that being a lousy draft. I'm a big Bender supporter but those are all very solid to almost superstar type players. That draft has secretly been a spectacular draft.

I notice you left off WallyWorld....

I feel the same way.