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Basketball Fan
04-23-2008, 02:48 PM
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-benny-bull-suedapr22,1,2429632.story


Oral surgeon says in suit that he was injured in high-five with Chicago Bulls mascot
Benny the Bull hurt Naperville dentist's arm during game, claim says
By Michael Higgins | Tribune reporter
10:43 PM CDT, April 21, 2008
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Digg Del.icio.us Facebook Fark Google Newsvine Reddit Yahoo Print Reprints Post comment Text size: A Naperville dentist called a flagrant foul on Chicago Bulls' mascot Benny the Bull on Monday, suing the team over a high-five gone awry.

Dr. Don Kalant Sr. alleged he was sitting near courtside on Feb. 12 when he raised his arm to get a high-five from Barry Anderson, who portrays the exuberant mascot in a bright red fuzzy costume.

But Kalant, an oral surgeon, may now wish he had settled for a fist-bump instead.

Instead of merely slapping Kalant's palm, Anderson grabbed his arm as he fell forward, hyperextending Kalant's arm and rupturing his biceps muscle, according to the lawsuit filed in Cook County Circuit Court.


"Benny's flying down the aisle, giving everybody high-fives," Kalant's attorney, Shawn Kasserman, said Monday in a telephone interview. "When he gets to Dr. Kalant, he either inadvertently trips or, as part of the shtick, trips. . . . He grabbed Kalant's arm and fell forward."

Neither Chicago Bulls officials nor Anderson could be reached Monday evening for comment.

Kalant stayed for the rest of the game but later had surgery and could miss as much as four months of work, Kasserman said. Kalant is seeking unspecified damages for medical bills, physical pain and lost earnings. The lawsuit claims Anderson was negligent in either "falling forward while grabbing a fan's hand" or "running out of control" through the crowd.

The Bulls are legally responsible as Anderson's employer, the suit alleged.

Anderson made news in 2006 when, dressed as Benny, he was arrested for allegedly punching an off-duty Cook County sheriff's deputy who tried to stop him from riding a mini-motorcycle through Grant Park. The charges were later dropped.

mjhiggins@tribune.com

Kstat
04-23-2008, 03:14 PM
That Bull needs to be stopped at all costs.

duke dynamite
04-23-2008, 03:23 PM
Just someone wanting to earn a quick buck, (or bull), even though it seems like he is well-to-do.

tdubb03
04-23-2008, 04:09 PM
A Benny for Boomer trade is eminent

Twes
04-23-2008, 04:43 PM
THAT IS BULL$&^T!

Hicks
04-23-2008, 04:54 PM
That Bull needs to be stopped at all costs.

They could hire this guy to take care of him.

http://smartcine.com/images/no_country_for_old_men_still.jpg

Cobol Sam
04-23-2008, 06:37 PM
Just someone wanting to earn a quick buck, (or bull), even though it seems like he is well-to-do.

The guy, an oral surgeon, had surgery and missed 4 months of work as a result of the injury. What about that makes it seem like he is out to make a quick buck? :confused:

MyFavMartin
04-23-2008, 06:45 PM
Yeah, a ruptured bicep is so easy to fake... it's right up there with a neck cast. :rolleyes:


Accidents happen and I would think the Bulls have some kind of insurance policy that would cover this.

Robertmto
04-23-2008, 08:25 PM
I'm damn near 100% positive that on all tickets to sporting events, there is a little phrase in the fine print that says that the team and arena are not liable for any and all injuries, including death.

duke dynamite
04-23-2008, 08:33 PM
I'm damn near 100% positive that on all tickets to sporting events, there is a little phrase in the fine print that says that the team and arena are not liable for any and all injuries, including death.
Can we say "loophole"? Looks like that guy is SOL. Benny the Bull dodges another bullet.

duke dynamite
04-23-2008, 08:39 PM
The guy, an oral surgeon, had surgery and missed 4 months of work as a result of the injury. What about that makes it seem like he is out to make a quick buck? :confused:

According to Salary.com (http://swz.salary.com/salarywizard/layouthtmls/swzl_compresult_national_HC07000352.html), the average oral surgeon makes about $260,000 a year. Okay, based on how many patients he has, how well he is doing (and if he has been going to Bulls games sitting near the court, I assume he is at least in this average bracket), and how much he spends, I think it would be the least of his worries to take a few months off.

Most people in this occupation have their own health coverage that covers them in case of an accident. I'm sure as well he had a little vacation time, too.

My mother works in a dentist office and her doctor takes at least 4 vacations a year, has 2 Corvettes, and a daughter in Dental School. He is still well-to-do, and doesn't see as many patients especially since Bloomington is only 20 minutes away, and swarming with dentists.

I am sure that this guy did not lose much being out of work.

My conclusion is that people are so sue happy now, they will do anything to make a little extra scrill.

Trader Joe
04-23-2008, 09:39 PM
I'm damn near 100% positive that on all tickets to sporting events, there is a little phrase in the fine print that says that the team and arena are not liable for any and all injuries, including death.

Um, no.

Robertmto
04-23-2008, 09:42 PM
Um, no.

u sure? go look at the back of a ticket u have lying around, i don't have any

Trader Joe
04-23-2008, 09:48 PM
There is a disclaimer, on my IU student tickets. However it reads to me as a suggestion that any injury resulting directly from the game is a risk assumed by the ticket holder. I don't believe it would apply to a mascot caused injury, at least the way it is worded on my IU tickets.
They could possibly argue that the oral surgeon bears just as much responsibility as Benny because he also held out his hand for a high five. Either way, I don't think the Bulls have much of a leg to stand on, and I would imagine they do have an insurance policy for them.

Hicks
04-23-2008, 09:50 PM
My ticket says the following related to this issue:

--------------------
THE HOLDER OF THIS TICKET VOLUNTARILY ASSUMES ALL RISK AND DANGER of personal injury (including death) and all hazards arising from, or related in any way to, the Event, whether occurring prior to, during, or after the Event, howsoever caused and whether by negligence or otherwise.
--------------------

Seems a bit shady to me (if you want to get into minor conspiracy theory, or the potential of it), but that is what they say. That is, if they assume "all hazards...related in any way to the Event" to include the dead-ball stuff.

count55
04-23-2008, 09:51 PM
According to Salary.com (http://swz.salary.com/salarywizard/layouthtmls/swzl_compresult_national_HC07000352.html), the average oral surgeon makes about $260,000 a year. Okay, based on how many patients he has, how well he is doing (and if he has been going to Bulls games sitting near the court, I assume he is at least in this average bracket), and how much he spends, I think it would be the least of his worries to take a few months off.

Most people in this occupation have their own health coverage that covers them in case of an accident. I'm sure as well he had a little vacation time, too.

My mother works in a dentist office and her doctor takes at least 4 vacations a year, has 2 Corvettes, and a daughter in Dental School. He is still well-to-do, and doesn't see as many patients especially since Bloomington is only 20 minutes away, and swarming with dentists.

I am sure that this guy did not lose much being out of work.

My conclusion is that people are so sue happy now, they will do anything to make a little extra scrill.

Of course this would indicate that four months of lost work would cost him almost $87,000 in income...theoretically.

Robertmto
04-23-2008, 09:51 PM
to me, the Bulls will probably just say the mascot and his antics are part of the game and the guy was playing along with him when he got injured

Robertmto
04-23-2008, 09:52 PM
My ticket says the following related to this issue:

--------------------
THE HOLDER OF THIS TICKET VOLUNTARILY ASSUMES ALL RISK AND DANGER of personal injury (including death) and all hazards arising from, or related in any way to, the Event, whether occurring prior to, during, or after the Event, howsoever caused and whether by negligence or otherwise.
--------------------

Seems a bit shady to me (if you want to get into minor conspiracy theory, or the potential of it), but that is what they say. That is, if they assume "all hazards...related in any way to the Event" to include the dead-ball stuff.

I knew I had seen stuff like that.

duke dynamite
04-23-2008, 09:56 PM
Of course this would indicate that four months of lost work would cost him almost $87,000 in income...theoretically.
Yeah, but I bet he has been doing it for years. This guy just wants money.



to me, the Bulls will probably just say the mascot and his antics are part of the game and the guy was playing along with him when he got injured
The mascot is a part of the team. This guy didn't get acosted by the mascot. He participated in an activity with the mascot in result he "injured" himself. He maybe is just a weak man.

Trader Joe
04-23-2008, 09:57 PM
Right so because the guy has made a lot of money and done well for his life he shouldn't be able to sue? What the hell is that? Lets see a surgeon suffers a severe arm injury and misses four months of work, I'd say he has every right to recover his lost wages. Not to mention who knows what kind of complications may arise for him in his career in the future.

Trader Joe
04-23-2008, 10:00 PM
Yeah, but I bet he has been doing it for years. This guy just wants money.



The mascot is a part of the team. This guy didn't get acosted by the mascot. He participated in an activity with the mascot in result he "injured" himself. He maybe is just a weak man.

Yeah, because we have never seen anyone get injured in a freak play or something of that nature. Anyone who suffers a freak injury must just be weak.

Robertmto
04-23-2008, 10:06 PM
Right so because the guy has made a lot of money and done well for his life he shouldn't be able to sue? What the hell is that? Lets see a surgeon suffers a severe arm injury and misses four months of work, I'd say he has every right to recover his lost wages. Not to mention who knows what kind of complications may arise for him in his career in the future.

theres no way he wins this lawsuit. i gurantee the bulls ticket have that same claim as the pacers' do

Trader Joe
04-23-2008, 10:30 PM
I bet you it never even makes it to court. I'd bet money that the Bulls settle with him out of court. They don't need the bad press.

duke dynamite
04-23-2008, 10:54 PM
This guy doesn't have a leg to stand on if the back of the Bulls tickets look like this.


http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c276/tlaurenzana/ticket001.jpg

THE HOLDER OF THIS TICKET VOLUNTARILY ASSUMES ALL RISK AND DANGER of personal injury (including death) and all hazards arising from, or related in any way to, the Event, whether occuring prior to, during, or after the Event, howsoever caused and whether by neglegence or otherwise.

Roaming Gnome
04-24-2008, 12:11 AM
You can put anything you want on a sign or on the back of a ticket, it doesn't mean jack squat if a court finds you negligent.

You know how on the back of dump trucks they have a sign that says, "Not responsible for windshields"? Well, Indiana State Law states otherwise!

As I mentioned, you can put whatever you want on a sign...that is just a deterent to keep people from seeking what their legal rights are.

Trader Joe
04-24-2008, 12:23 AM
I agree with Gnome, and I still say it won't even make it to court. They'll settle outside IMO.

sweabs
04-24-2008, 09:54 AM
When it comes down to it, Roaming Gnome is correct. That stuff doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. There are cases out there where the negligent party was found 75%+ negligent even when the other party signed a waiver form (and waivers are generally considered much more reliable and appropriate than a simple caution sign/phrase).

Where's btown when you need him?

btowncolt
04-24-2008, 10:07 AM
When it comes down to it, Roaming Gnome is correct. That stuff doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. There are cases out there where the negligent party was found 75%+ negligent even when the other party signed a waiver form (and waivers are generally considered much more reliable and appropriate than a simple caution sign/phrase).

Where's btown when you need him?

Around...but I prefer entertaining back-and-forths to easy issue resolution.

Major Cold
04-24-2008, 11:32 AM
Gnome is spot on. If I had an in ground pool with no fence and a kid fell in while trespassing I would be liable.

Los Angeles
04-24-2008, 12:11 PM
I'm damn near 100% positive that on all tickets to sporting events, there is a little phrase in the fine print that says that the team and arena are not liable for any and all injuries, including death.

Those disclaimers never EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER hold up. Never ever.

If you run a business and want to rely on this writing, get out your checkbook and get ready to write a number that includes lot of zeros. In my line of work, this is referred to as the idiot tax.

Los Angeles
04-24-2008, 12:20 PM
This guy doesn't have a leg to stand on if the back of the Bulls tickets look like this.


http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c276/tlaurenzana/ticket001.jpg

THE HOLDER OF THIS TICKET VOLUNTARILY ASSUMES ALL RISK AND DANGER of personal injury (including death) and all hazards arising from, or related in any way to, the Event, whether occuring prior to, during, or after the Event, howsoever caused abd whether by neglegence or otherwise.

So, is there a signature on there somewhere?

Was it reviewed by an attorney?

Does it constitute a legal contract?

NO.


Sorry to be so obnoxious, but that writing isn't worth it's weight in toilet paper, and meets the same fate.

Judge wipes his butt with it, judge flushes it down the toilet. Every time.

Trader Joe
04-24-2008, 12:25 PM
What LA said.

duke dynamite
04-24-2008, 03:06 PM
Right so because the guy has made a lot of money and done well for his life he shouldn't be able to sue? What the hell is that? Lets see a surgeon suffers a severe arm injury and misses four months of work, I'd say he has every right to recover his lost wages. Not to mention who knows what kind of complications may arise for him in his career in the future.
I never said he was not allowed to sue. You are reading what I say and taking it the wrong way. I say he won't be hurting for money. I'm sure of it.

duke dynamite
04-24-2008, 03:07 PM
Right so because the guy has made a lot of money and done well for his life he shouldn't be able to sue? What the hell is that? Lets see a surgeon suffers a severe arm injury and misses four months of work, I'd say he has every right to recover his lost wages. Not to mention who knows what kind of complications may arise for him in his career in the future.


So, is there a signature on there somewhere?

Was it reviewed by an attorney?

Does it constitute a legal contract?

NO.


Sorry to be so obnoxious, but that writing isn't worth it's weight in toilet paper, and meets the same fate.

Judge wipes his butt with it, judge flushes it down the toilet. Every time.
But it says by purchasing this ticket you assume all risks involved. If he didn't read it that is his problem.

Hicks
04-24-2008, 05:53 PM
But it says by purchasing this ticket you assume all risks involved. If he didn't read it that is his problem.

Wouldn't that still be legally weak considering the first time someone ever buys that ticket, the chances of that someone knowing that is printed on it PRIOR to purchase is close to none?

Also, just because I write something down, that doesn't make it legal.

Trader Joe
04-25-2008, 02:30 AM
Yes, it would be legally weak. I don't know enough legal mumbo jumbo to make a compelling case (yet), but from what I can remember from the law class I took in H.S. and the business law class I took last semester at Kelley, the disclaimer on the back of that ticket isn't very strong.

And, DD, sorry if I misinterpreted you, but it seemed to me like you were saying that since he is well off he is just wasting everyone's time by suing.

Also, DD, I'm guessing that if something like this happened to you, you would not consider suing?

tdubb03
04-25-2008, 04:53 AM
Fearless prediction: next season team mascots are not permitted outside the out of bounds line.

OK, maybe it's not so fearless.

Major Cold
04-25-2008, 11:03 AM
If I was Benny I would have given the dude beef stew.

duke dynamite
04-25-2008, 11:58 AM
Also, DD, I'm guessing that if something like this happened to you, you would not consider suing?

2006-2007 season, I was attending the Pacers/Raptors game at Conseco Fieldhouse. I was going back to my seat, and all the drunk people would not stand up to give me room to walk.

Result: I fell down one row over the seats and bashed my shin so hard on the top of the seat that I fell onto, and had to have people help me walk the rest of the night.

Granted it didn't cost me anytime off work or anything, but I knew I didn't have a leg to stand on. (No pun intended) If I would have made a big deal about it, "I could have got hurt anywhere."

Los Angeles
04-25-2008, 12:11 PM
Duke Dynamite, I mean this only with utmost respect.

Please step back and recognize this opportunity. This is an opportunity to learn something that will apply to all of your personal business dealings from this day forward.

Posting a sign does not create a law. Writing a "legal" disclaimer on printed materials does not create an agreement. Saying "we warned you" does not instantly forgive negligence.

Some people here know a little bit about how I make my living. Put simply, I am a litigation consultant. I help lawyers mold their arguments and I develop visual aids to help them along the way.

In my business, I run into arguments like yours all the time. Lawyers made up the language on the back of that ticket. You see, lawyers are taught that if it's written, then it MUST be important. They are also taught to scrutinize every bit of parchment for details that will get their clients out of a bind.

A lawsuit pops up and there's always some junior attorney that gets SUPER excited to announce to the world that "WE WROTE A DISCLAIMER ON THE BACK!!! WE'RE GONNA WIN!!! YIPEEE!!!"

I didn't tell you the reason WHY judges usually throw the "hiding behind the disclaimer" defense out. Setting the issue of wether or not it is legally binding aside, I believe that judges are actually protecting the people who want to hide behind this language from themselves.

It's simple. If you hide behind a b.s. disclaimer like this in court, you are going to seriously honk off the jury. Man, they are going to be pissed at you. "Ladies and gentlemen, not only did we warn them that they could get decapitated by the tshirt gun, they agreed to not sue us when they walked in!"

You see, the jury doesn't like it when lawyers try to make up their OWN rules and then enforce them willy-nilly. The jury prefers to use the actual evidence and actual laws. When a lawyer comes in and says "we made up our own rules and printed it in super-small print on the back of a small piece of cardboard and it YOUR OWN DAMN FAULT if you didn't read it!" well, let's just say that the jury is now going to send their OWN little message. They do this by adding zeros. What was going to be a 1.5 Million dollar loss is now a $150,000,000 anally delivered notice to Small Writing on Tickets R Us, Incorporated.

So, I'm sure you are wondering, if all of this is true, why does it keep getting printed on the back of stuff like this? Because they know that it keeps the number of lawsuits down. They are counting on the public to believe that it has weight, that it actually means something. They use it to hood-wink you. And your story proves that you fell for it. That doesn't mean you had a case, just that you didn't understand your rights to follow due process.

If the disclaimer doesn't work and the company actually DOES get sued, then they would be wise to not bring the disclaimer up. I don't know for sure, but I doubt that the disclaimer language is even mentioned in this particular lawsuit.

bellisimo
04-25-2008, 01:16 PM
regarding the disclaimer...if it was signed...then it would be another case...where it has weight...correct?

sweabs
04-25-2008, 01:30 PM
regarding the disclaimer...if it was signed...then it would be another case...where it has weight...correct?
Nope...not always. I can only speak for Canadian law though.

duke dynamite
04-25-2008, 01:46 PM
Duke Dynamite, I mean this only with utmost respect.

Don't waste your time, I'm done fighting about it. It doesn't matter to me anyway. My opinion apparently doesn't matter, I am wrong. You all win.

Putnam
04-25-2008, 02:20 PM
Los Angeles, that is a great post.

There is, however, a perplexing misspelling (I hope) in the 3rd paragraph up from the bottom. If, on the other hand, you meant what you wrote, then I finally understand what is meant by the term "money laundering."

sweabs
04-25-2008, 02:23 PM
Los Angeles, that is a great post.

There is, however, a perplexing misspelling (I hope) in the 3rd paragraph up from the bottom. If, on the other hand, you meant what you wrote, then I finally understand what is meant by the term "money laundering."

:spitout::laugh:

Well done, Putty.

Los Angeles
04-25-2008, 03:56 PM
The word is correctly typed, as in "up the rear"

Edit - and regarding signing contracts, there are a million ways from sunday to break those things even if they are signed. There are a lot of rules and guidelines that need to be followed in contract law and even if you do have agreements, there are a lot of disclosure standards as well such as the concept of "good faith and fair dealing" etc..

I've never seen a contract that couldn't be broken.

Trader Joe
04-25-2008, 04:21 PM
2006-2007 season, I was attending the Pacers/Raptors game at Conseco Fieldhouse. I was going back to my seat, and all the drunk people would not stand up to give me room to walk.

Result: I fell down one row over the seats and bashed my shin so hard on the top of the seat that I fell onto, and had to have people help me walk the rest of the night.

Granted it didn't cost me anytime off work or anything, but I knew I didn't have a leg to stand on. (No pun intended) If I would have made a big deal about it, "I could have got hurt anywhere."

I don't see how you're situation and the one that happened to the oral surgeon are at all comparable.

Infinite MAN_force
04-25-2008, 06:38 PM
The word is correctly typed, as in "up the rear"

Edit - and regarding signing contracts, there are a million ways from sunday to break those things even if they are signed. There are a lot of rules and guidelines that need to be followed in contract law and even if you do have agreements, there are a lot of disclosure standards as well such as the concept of "good faith and fair dealing" etc..

I've never seen a contract that couldn't be broken.

Why don't you go ahead and take a look at Jammal Tinsley's contract for us, If you can figure out a way to get out of that one you will be doing pacer nation a big favor. :dance:

Los Angeles
04-25-2008, 06:52 PM
Sure. Got $5 Million or so to pay the attorneys? :D

If the "it's not really sinusitis" rumors were true (I'm not saying they are, though I did make up my mind about it years ago), and there were actual proof to that effect, the Pacers may have had an opportunity to sue for breach of contract. In the end, that would have done tremendous damage to team chemistry (OK, I even laughed typing that) and it would have been a huge burden to prove and would have resulted in a very bloody fight with the union.

Twes
04-25-2008, 07:21 PM
The Bulls should give the guy first class medical treatment, give him the key to the city including courtside tickets all season next to the owner.

They should write him up in the paper as a superfan wounded in battle etc etc.

Make him feel like he practically played with Jordan and Pippen.

Then when things quiet down they take him out and whack him. No loose ends.

duke dynamite
04-26-2008, 12:46 AM
I don't see how you're situation and the one that happened to the oral surgeon are at all comparable.
I still got hurt. That's all that matters.

Trader Joe
04-26-2008, 03:37 AM
I still got hurt. That's all that matters.

You got hurt because some people didn't stand up for you. Its a totally different scenario, so unless you were to sue the Pacers for being negligent in selling the alcohol to them or not having a mandatory stand up if someone is passing rule, the situations are not comparable legally. And even though they would then be comparable legally there is a big difference between a limp for the rest of the night and a ruptured(torn?) bicep.

duke dynamite
04-26-2008, 08:32 AM
I limped for days. I had to be carried downstairs.

I was just saying that things like this and getting hurt/injured goes unnoticed all the time at sporting events.

Geeze, get off my case. I told you I was done arguing about this topic.

Trader Joe
04-26-2008, 12:45 PM
I limped for days. I had to be carried downstairs.

I was just saying that things like this and getting hurt/injured goes unnoticed all the time at sporting events.

Geeze, get off my case. I told you I was done arguing about this topic.

Yeah, I can tell. :rolleyes:

duke dynamite
04-26-2008, 01:15 PM
I wasn't arguing about the topic. I was stating a point. As a matter of fact, an entirely different point that I am arguing now. There is no need for this...

I am not pleased.

Trader Joe
04-26-2008, 04:57 PM
I wasn't arguing about the topic. I was stating a point. As a matter of fact, an entirely different point that I am arguing now. There is no need for this...

I am not pleased.

About what?

tdubb03
04-26-2008, 05:11 PM
Can't we all get along?

grace
04-26-2008, 05:30 PM
Well, not we have a new excuse for why no one will go to any Pacers games. We're all afraid of what Boomer, Bowser, and the Power Pack might do to us.

:maniac: