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View Full Version : Pacers at Wizards Post-Game: End of the Road



Doddage
04-14-2008, 09:35 PM
<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr align="center"><td> http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/us/sp/v/nba/teams/20080123/80x60/ind.gif (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/ind) (35-46)
</td> <td width="370"> <table border="0" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td class="ysptblbdr2"> <table class="ysptblclbg3" border="0" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td> <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr class="ysptblbdr2"><td colspan="15" height="1"></td></tr> <tr align="center" bgcolor="#dedec6"> <td rowspan="5" class="ysptblbdr2" width="1"></td> <td height="18" width="10"></td> <td></td> <td rowspan="5" class="yspwhitebg" width="1"></td> <td class="yspscores" width="25">1</td> <td rowspan="5" class="yspwhitebg" width="1"></td> <td class="yspscores" width="25">2</td> <td rowspan="5" class="yspwhitebg" width="1"></td> <td class="yspscores" width="25">3</td> <td rowspan="5" class="yspwhitebg" width="1"></td> <td class="yspscores" width="25">4</td> <td rowspan="5" class="yspwhitebg" width="1"></td> <td class="yspscores total" align="right" width="35">Total</td> <td class="yspscores" width="65"></td> <td rowspan="5" class="ysptblbdr2" width="1"></td> </tr> <tr class="yspwhitebg"><td colspan="13" height="1"></td></tr> <tr class="ysptblclbg5" align="center"> <td height="23" width="10"></td> <td class="yspscores team" align="left"> Indiana (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/ind) </td> <td class="yspscores">28</td> <td class="yspscores">26</td> <td class="yspscores">27</td> <td class="yspscores">29</td> <td class="ysptblclbg6 total" align="right"> 110 </td> <td class="ysptblclbg6 total" align="right">Final </td> </tr> <tr class="yspwhitebg"> <td colspan="2"></td> <td colspan="8" height="1"></td> <td colspan="2" class="ysptblclbg6"></td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblclbg5" align="center"> <td height="23" width="10">http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/us/sp/gr/or_arrow.gif</td> <td class="yspscores team" align="left"> Washington (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/was) </td> <td class="yspscores">35</td> <td class="yspscores">31</td> <td class="yspscores">32</td> <td class="yspscores">19</td> <td class="ysptblclbg6 total" align="right"> 117 </td> <td class="ysptblclbg6 total" align="right"></td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblbdr2"> <td colspan="15" height="1"></td> </tr> </tbody></table> </td> </tr> </tbody></table> </td> </tr> </tbody></table> </td> <td> http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/us/sp/v/nba/teams/20080123/80x60/was.gif (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/was) (43-38)
</td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="3" height="7"></td> </tr> </tbody></table> <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td height="7"></td> </tr> </tbody></table> <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr class="yspsctbg"> <td colspan="8" class="ysptblhdr" height="18"> Indiana </td> <td colspan="8" class="ysptblhdr" align="right" height="18"> </td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblthbody1 yspboxscore-columnheader-row" align="right"> <td class="yspdetailttl player" align="left" height="18" width="17%"> Starters </td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="4%"></td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">Min</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">FG</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">3Pt</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">FT</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">+/-</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Off</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Reb</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Ast</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">TO</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Stl</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">BS</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">BA</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">PF</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">Pts </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> M. Dunleavy (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3601) </td> <td class="player"> G </td> <td>44:02</td> <td>9-17</td> <td>2-5</td> <td>6-8</td> <td> -4 </td> <td>0</td> <td>2</td> <td>6</td> <td>3</td> <td>2</td> <td>3</td> <td>1</td> <td>3</td> <td>26 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> R. Murray (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3639) </td> <td class="player"> G </td> <td>24:47</td> <td>2-7</td> <td>0-1</td> <td>7-8</td> <td> -8 </td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>7</td> <td>4</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>11 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> T. Murphy (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3524) </td> <td class="player"> C </td> <td>16:31</td> <td>5-6</td> <td>3-3</td> <td>1-3</td> <td> -6 </td> <td>2</td> <td>3</td> <td>2</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>4</td> <td>14 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> D. Granger (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3943) </td> <td class="player"> F </td> <td>44:52</td> <td>12-23</td> <td>7-11</td> <td>4-6</td> <td> -2 </td> <td>1</td> <td>9</td> <td>3</td> <td>1</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>3</td> <td>35 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> K. Rush (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3618) </td> <td class="player"> F </td> <td>24:35</td> <td>1-4</td> <td>0-3</td> <td>0-0</td> <td> -2 </td> <td>1</td> <td>4</td> <td>3</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>2 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblthbody1 yspboxscore-columnheader-row" align="right"> <td class="yspdetailttl player" align="left" height="18" width="17%"> Bench </td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="4%"></td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">Min</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">FG</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">3Pt</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">FT</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">+/-</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Off</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Reb</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Ast</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">TO</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Stl</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">BS</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">BA</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">PF</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">Pts </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> M. Daniels (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3764) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td>27:23</td> <td>1-4</td> <td>1-3</td> <td>1-2</td> <td> -8 </td> <td>0</td> <td>4</td> <td>1</td> <td>1</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>3</td> <td>4 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> T. Diener (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3964) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td>23:13</td> <td>1-5</td> <td>1-4</td> <td>0-0</td> <td> +1 </td> <td>0</td> <td>2</td> <td>7</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>2</td> <td>3 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> J. O'Neal (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3120) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td>22:58</td> <td>3-9</td> <td>0-0</td> <td>1-2</td> <td> -7 </td> <td>0</td> <td>5</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>1</td> <td>2</td> <td>7 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> D. Harrison (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3846) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td>8:31</td> <td>2-3</td> <td>0-0</td> <td>1-2</td> <td> +6 </td> <td>1</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>3</td> <td>5 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> S. Williams (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4145) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td>3:07</td> <td>1-1</td> <td>0-0</td> <td>1-1</td> <td> -5 </td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>3 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> I. Diogu (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3935) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td class="dnp" colspan="14" align="center">DNP - Coach's Decision</td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> S. Graham (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4012) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td class="dnp" colspan="14" align="center">DNP - Coach's Decision</td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblbdr3"> <td colspan="16" height="1"></td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblclbg5" align="right"> <td class="sum" align="left" height="18"> Totals</td> <td></td> <td></td> <td>37-79</td> <td>14-30</td> <td>22-32</td> <td></td> <td>5</td> <td>31</td> <td>29</td> <td>12</td> <td>6</td> <td>4</td> <td>2</td> <td>22</td> <td>110 </td> </tr> <tr align="right"> <td class="sum" align="left" height="18"> Percentages:</td> <td colspan="2"></td> <td>.468</td> <td>.467</td> <td>.688</td> <td></td> <td colspan="9" class="team-rebounds" align="left">Team Rebounds: 12 </td> </tr> </tbody></table> <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td height="7"></td> </tr> </tbody></table> <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr class="yspsctbg"> <td colspan="8" class="ysptblhdr" height="18"> Washington </td> <td colspan="8" class="ysptblhdr" align="right" height="18"> </td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblthbody1 yspboxscore-columnheader-row" align="right"> <td class="yspdetailttl player" align="left" height="18" width="17%"> Starters </td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="4%"></td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">Min</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">FG</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">3Pt</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">FT</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">+/-</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Off</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Reb</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Ast</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">TO</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Stl</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">BS</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">BA</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">PF</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">Pts </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> A. Daniels (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3175) </td> <td class="player"> G </td> <td>34:19</td> <td>3-9</td> <td>0-3</td> <td>2-2</td> <td> -4 </td> <td>0</td> <td>2</td> <td>4</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>3</td> <td>8 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> D. Stevenson (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3422) </td> <td class="player"> G </td> <td>7:31</td> <td>2-4</td> <td>2-4</td> <td>0-0</td> <td> +4 </td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>6 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> B. Haywood (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3532) </td> <td class="player"> C </td> <td>16:17</td> <td>5-10</td> <td>0-0</td> <td>1-2</td> <td> +10 </td> <td>3</td> <td>4</td> <td>2</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>11 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> A. Jamison (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3247) </td> <td class="player"> F </td> <td>31:12</td> <td>4-13</td> <td>1-3</td> <td>3-6</td> <td> -6 </td> <td>2</td> <td>8</td> <td>2</td> <td>1</td> <td>2</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>4</td> <td>12 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> D. Songaila (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3647) </td> <td class="player"> F </td> <td>30:43</td> <td>5-14</td> <td>0-0</td> <td>0-0</td> <td> 0 </td> <td>2</td> <td>9</td> <td>6</td> <td>2</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>3</td> <td>10 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblthbody1 yspboxscore-columnheader-row" align="right"> <td class="yspdetailttl player" align="left" height="18" width="17%"> Bench </td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="4%"></td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">Min</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">FG</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">3Pt</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">FT</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="6%">+/-</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Off</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Reb</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Ast</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">TO</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">Stl</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">BS</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">BA</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="5%">PF</td> <td class="yspdetailttl" width="7%">Pts </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> R. Mason (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3628) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td>37:24</td> <td>10-16</td> <td>7-9</td> <td>4-4</td> <td> +6 </td> <td>3</td> <td>6</td> <td>4</td> <td>4</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>3</td> <td>31 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> D. McGuire (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4338) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td>30:19</td> <td>3-5</td> <td>0-0</td> <td>3-7</td> <td> +4 </td> <td>3</td> <td>10</td> <td>2</td> <td>1</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>3</td> <td>9 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> A. Blatche (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3975) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td>26:50</td> <td>4-9</td> <td>0-0</td> <td>3-5</td> <td> +4 </td> <td>5</td> <td>11</td> <td>1</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>6</td> <td>11 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> N. Young (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4294) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td>18:58</td> <td>5-10</td> <td>2-3</td> <td>2-4</td> <td> +9 </td> <td>1</td> <td>4</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>1</td> <td>14 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> O. Pecherov (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4146) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td>6:27</td> <td>2-5</td> <td>1-2</td> <td>0-0</td> <td> +8 </td> <td>1</td> <td>3</td> <td>0</td> <td>1</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>2</td> <td>5 </td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow1" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> G. Arenas (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3540) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td class="dnp" colspan="14" align="center">DNP - Coach's Decision</td> </tr> <tr class="ysprow2" align="right"> <td class="player" align="left"> C. Butler (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3608) </td> <td class="player"> </td> <td class="dnp" colspan="14" align="center">DNP - Coach's Decision</td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblbdr3"> <td colspan="16" height="1"></td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblclbg5" align="right"> <td class="sum" align="left" height="18"> Totals</td> <td></td> <td></td> <td>43-95</td> <td>13-24</td> <td>18-30</td> <td></td> <td>20</td> <td>58</td> <td>22</td> <td>12</td> <td>4</td> <td>2</td> <td>4</td> <td>25</td> <td>117 </td> </tr> <tr align="right"> <td class="sum" align="left" height="18"> Percentages:</td> <td colspan="2"></td> <td>.453</td> <td>.542</td> <td>.600</td> <td></td> <td colspan="9" class="team-rebounds" align="left">Team Rebounds: 15 </td> </tr> </tbody></table> <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td height="7"></td> </tr> </tbody></table> <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr class="yspsctbg"> <td class="ysptblhdr" colspan="2" height="18"> Game Info</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="yspnotice" valign="top" width="50%"> Technical Fouls: None
</td> <td class="yspnotice" valign="top" width="50%"> Arena: Verizon Center, Washington D.C.</td></tr></tbody></table>

Hicks
04-14-2008, 09:36 PM
To bring back an old joke:

Danny > Wilt

D-BONE
04-14-2008, 09:36 PM
Need defense, need rebounding. Give up whatever it takes except DG to upgrade that please.

duke dynamite
04-14-2008, 09:36 PM
Danny is now an ELITE player in my book.

duke dynamite
04-14-2008, 09:37 PM
Stacy needs to go to another team. She fraternized with the opponents too much.

AesopRockOn
04-14-2008, 09:39 PM
Philly held on! The announcers finally got excited!

Oh yeah, we're officially out of the playoffs. Sorry, Rick. :(

Kaufman
04-14-2008, 09:40 PM
I was just wondering, for a guy who doesn't go to pacers games anymore due to geographics, as well as can't watch games due to economics - do Danny and MDJ get along pretty well on the court? Do they seem to like each other?

You don't hear as much regarding chemistry with this team like the teams of the 90s where Reggie and Mark and all those pregame dances they did. I was wondering how the team seems to get along on a functional basis.

mrknowname
04-14-2008, 09:41 PM
Danny is now an ELITE player in my book.


not quite there yet imo. if he can play like this next year consisently, then no doubt (not necessarily scoring 30 ppg)

duke dynamite
04-14-2008, 09:44 PM
not quite there yet imo. if he can play like this next year consisently, then no doubt (not necessarily scoring 30 ppg)
In my book means in my own opinion. Just because I say it doesn't mean it's true to everyone.:p

DisapointedPacerFan
04-14-2008, 09:46 PM
The rebounding comparison really cracks me up.

OnlyPacersLeft
04-14-2008, 09:46 PM
lmao the cavs announcers are hillarious

idioteque
04-14-2008, 09:46 PM
Granger is a 19 and 6 guy right now. If he can bring it up to about 24 and 9 next year, he'll be a star in my book.

Doddage
04-14-2008, 09:46 PM
Can we get some mergeage action going

OnlyPacersLeft
04-14-2008, 09:46 PM
the cavs just stole one...LOL
awesome...

Kofi
04-14-2008, 09:47 PM
The way Granger has played since the All-Star break has certainly leads me to believe he could become at least close to an elite player. He's raised his game above other second-string youngsters like Luol Deng and Andre Iguodala.

Kofi
04-14-2008, 09:49 PM
Granger is a 19 and 6 guy right now. If he can bring it up to about 24 and 9 next year, he'll be a star in my book.

9 rebounds per game is unrealistic from a SF. 24/6/2 is more like it. Throw in 1+ block and 1+ steal per game and he's a top-5 SF.

Trader Joe
04-14-2008, 09:51 PM
I've been saying for a long time on here Granger would end up Josh Howard. I'm starting to rethink that. I think I might be selling him a little short.

Hicks
04-14-2008, 09:51 PM
I was just wondering, for a guy who doesn't go to pacers games anymore due to geographics, as well as can't watch games due to economics - do Danny and MDJ get along pretty well on the court? Do they seem to like each other?

You don't hear as much regarding chemistry with this team like the teams of the 90s where Reggie and Mark and all those pregame dances they did. I was wondering how the team seems to get along on a functional basis.

They seem neutral to me. They'll give each other a high five if one of them does something well, but they don't seem like they're good friends, either. On the plus side, there's nothing to suggest they don't like each other.

Hicks
04-14-2008, 09:52 PM
Granger is a 19 and 6 guy right now. If he can bring it up to about 24 and 9 next year, he'll be a star in my book.

I see the 24, but not the 9. He plays on the perimeter too much (which is to be expected when he plays as the 2 or the 3 all the time).

rexnom
04-14-2008, 09:57 PM
Danny just put up 30, 37 and 35 in the three biggest games of the season.

I'm pretty sure he's cast away any doubt about his offense.

Tom White
04-14-2008, 09:58 PM
I was just wondering, for a guy who doesn't go to pacers games anymore due to geographics, as well as can't watch games due to economics - do Danny and MDJ get along pretty well on the court? Do they seem to like each other?

You don't hear as much regarding chemistry with this team like the teams of the 90s where Reggie and Mark and all those pregame dances they did. I was wondering how the team seems to get along on a functional basis.

From what I can see (on TV) it appears they get along fine on the floor. As far as the pregame dance bit, I think you have to remember that Reggie and Mark were both a little more flamboyent than most of the Pacer players are now. Plus, these guys haven't had a lot to dance about.

Jimmy
04-14-2008, 09:59 PM
This is a happy (:dance:) day for David Harrison, within the week he can start smoking as much as he wants. How many of you think he could kill a whole bowl with one bong rip?:angel:

FireTheCoach
04-14-2008, 10:00 PM
.... I've been saying for a long time on here ....


ibsfaltoh

Kaufman
04-14-2008, 10:00 PM
They seem neutral to me. They'll give each other a high five if one of them does something well, but they don't seem like they're good friends, either. On the plus side, there's nothing to suggest they don't like each other.

I wonder if this is bc they both know they play the same position and bring the same things to the table...

I don't know, again, I don't observe them around one another - but my guess is that both of them look over their shoulders and see the other one as competition in a sense. Mal you'd have a better sense of this than me, but given all things I would bet they have an internal rivalry. I mean, MDJ is only 3 years older than Granger - but I agree with what you've said in other posts - Granger scoring in the 30s in 3 straight is impressive. But at the same time MDJ isn't anything to scoff at either.

I think you keep Granger and let MDJ go if it comes to that - but I don't know that its that clear cut which guy is leaps and bounds better than the other one. I think one can argue it has taken MDJ some time to find himself, and that's fine, but he's had a great season as well. 26 tonight, not too shabby.

Trader Joe
04-14-2008, 10:01 PM
ibsfaltoh

:rolleyes:

indygeezer
04-14-2008, 10:02 PM
Beware the best player on a bad team.

Hicks
04-14-2008, 10:04 PM
I wonder if this is bc they both know they play the same position and bring the same things to the table...

I don't know, again, I don't observe them around one another - but my guess is that both of them look over their shoulders and see the other one as competition in a sense. Mal you'd have a better sense of this than me, but given all things I would bet they have an internal rivalry. I mean, MDJ is only 3 years older than Granger - but I agree with what you've said in other posts - Granger scoring in the 30s in 3 straight is impressive. But at the same time MDJ isn't anything to scoff at either.

I think you keep Granger and let MDJ go if it comes to that - but I don't know that its that clear cut which guy is leaps and bounds better than the other one. I think one can argue it has taken MDJ some time to find himself, and that's fine, but he's had a great season as well. 26 tonight, not too shabby.

I'd be looking to trade Mike this summer for the best defensive wing you can get. If the offers are too low, then hang on to him, but hopefully a fair deal comes along. I like Mike too, but I like Danny more and he's a two-way player AND as you said 3 years younger.

It's not that I'm down on Dunleavy and want or demand he leave, but I think our team would benefit from a next-gen version of "Shrempf for McKey" / Offense for Defense trade.

Trader Joe
04-14-2008, 10:06 PM
Yes, I 100% agree that we need to look into moving Dun right now.

Big Smooth
04-14-2008, 10:08 PM
Finally at long last I can enjoy the remainder of the NBA season as the playoff charade is over.

Hicks
04-14-2008, 10:08 PM
Beware the best player on a bad team.

I think that's a very over-used fear. It sometimes can be true, but it's far from 100%. Warts and hindsight aside, Brad Miller and Ron Artest were better for our playoff teams than they were for Chicago.

Secondly, it's not like Danny's being force-fed on offense to put up his numbers. He deserves to play as much as he does, he works for his stats, and his offense is not "well, he's all we've got, lot's have him shoot 25+ shots per game to get his 19 points".

Hicks
04-14-2008, 10:09 PM
:rolleyes:

Clearly I'm missing something. What did that mean?

Trader Joe
04-14-2008, 10:12 PM
Clearly I'm missing something. What did that mean?

I believe he was saying that I was patting myself on the back or something. I'm not sure. I do think it was intended to be a knock on me though.

heywoode
04-14-2008, 10:12 PM
I would rather keep Dun-Dun, but his trade value is high, especially if he has a shot at winning MIP this year. Upgrading the team on the defensive front is a must-have, so if it costs us Mike, then so be it.

I really want to see some improved defensive intensity, a little tweaking of the offense so it doesn't look quite so run-n-gun, and JO and Danny starting together. Can we go out and get a legit center? Probably too much to ask given what we have to trade with...

esabyrn333
04-14-2008, 10:13 PM
I don't know about everyone else but I really like having Danny and MDJ as our wings. If Jermaine is healthy next year and we find a solid starting defensive minded PG that can slash and drive to the basket. I think I need another Post player like maybe a Kevin Love to play next to JO.

I really like the direction this team is going. I hope Larry is patient and take his time fixing this team because I think faster is not always better.

maragin
04-14-2008, 10:15 PM
Granger is playing out of his mind. Dunleavy with 26, 6 assists, and 3 blocks? No Foster hurts, but the Wiz were playing without a couple all stars.

The late surge by the Pacers made my 31 win prediction a bit low. I think they surprised a lot of us, and I appreciated being able to get behind them here at the end of the season. Let's have fun at the Miami game and give the bench some play. I look forward to an active offseason.

If we have the same roster +1 rookie going into training camp, the outrage and apathy would drive me to binge drinking and making bad decisions around women. Really bad decisions.

Kaufman
04-14-2008, 10:22 PM
I don't know that you can't say that MDJ isn't playing clearly out of his mind either though.

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/mike_dunleavy/game_by_game_stats.html

I'm not saying that Granger isn't better, but MDJ has really stepped it up towards the end of the season as well.

Hicks
04-14-2008, 10:27 PM
It's true, Mike's been playing great as well.

Trader Joe
04-14-2008, 10:29 PM
Mike has played well, but I think Danny's ceiling is much, much higher. Mike should be able to fetch us a decent deal this summer.

Shade
04-14-2008, 10:30 PM
Congrats to the Hawks. Enjoy your beating. :D

Shade
04-14-2008, 10:32 PM
Wow, the Bulls put up 151 tonight. :jawdrop:

Infinite MAN_force
04-14-2008, 10:33 PM
I would like to build around the two of them. If we got westbrook, he could bring elite defense and athleticism on the perimeter. Run him at point but let Dunleavy run the offense in a half court set. Add a shotblocking presence in the center and things are looking up...

Westbrook and Robin Lopez in 08!!!!!!

I would also like to add that people are also forgetting Danny was gaurding Jamison tonight and held him to 12 points. I really hope he can develop into a great two way player like this, shut down the other teams best player and still average 20+ points a game.

Kegboy
04-14-2008, 10:35 PM
I think if you want this team to get significantly better, you have to trade Danny or Mike. All the wings in the world won't get you anywhere without a point or a post presence.

I'd trade whichever gets us more in return. And considering Danny's still on his rookie deal, we could probably get rid of one of our crap contracts in the bargain.

Robertmto
04-14-2008, 10:37 PM
Sorry our reserves put you guys out of your misery.

rexnom
04-14-2008, 10:39 PM
I am extremely glad I passed on this game.

I don't need people seeing me cry/doing this in public:
<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Tim5nU3DwIE&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Tim5nU3DwIE&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

heywoode
04-14-2008, 10:46 PM
Sorry our reserves put you guys out of your misery.

Thanks for the input.

avoidingtheclowns
04-14-2008, 10:51 PM
i went and glad i did. i got $48tix for $12 and then my friend knew a guy that was 5 rows from the floor and got us down there for the 4th. so that was sweet.

sloppy game but mike was nice in the 1st and danny was big the rest. it was odd being immersed in wizard fans and listening to them say "What the hell happened to the Pacers? They used to be so good. Who the hell can they build around now?" Then there were some annoying young fans who kept screaming "FRODO!" every time diener touched the ball.

anyway the margin was only a handful of points but the game never felt close. too bad fiesty wasn't out there tonight -- though there was a hulk sighting.

Kegboy
04-14-2008, 10:52 PM
Sorry our reserves put you guys out of your misery.

That's sure what I was thinking while watching. I know people wanted to make the playoffs, but I sure hope nobody feels we should have.

Nice to see Nick Young playing well. I won't lie, if we'd had our pick last year I would have gone for need and taken Law. But I liked Young more as a player.

heywoode
04-14-2008, 10:53 PM
That's AWESOME! I love it!

He's Frodo from now on as far as I'm concerned. If I get to meet him on Wednesday, I'm gonna call him Frodo.......

wooolus
04-14-2008, 10:53 PM
I think Dun Dun is a better passer, while Granger = more athletic and better defender, I can see them co-exist, but if we must move one, I hope it's Dunleavy, unless Granger can land us Oden, Derrick Rose type of player. Granger is just progressing right in front of our eyes every week, he's the last piece on this roster we should move.

Kegboy
04-14-2008, 10:54 PM
"FRODO!"

:laugh:

I'm sorry but that's funny.

Kofi
04-14-2008, 10:56 PM
Sorry our reserves put you guys out of your misery.

The fact that the Wizards have proven to be better without Gilbert Arenas is the surest sign that he's massively overrated. A no D playing, me-first prima donna. If I were the Wizards management, I'd be looking for a sign & trade in the offseason. Bring in some defense so the Wizards will stop with the epic failure in the playoffs every season.

Kegboy
04-14-2008, 11:00 PM
Frankly I'm a bit jealous of MTO. Must be nice to have a team that can take injuries and keep on going strong. Almost makes me rethink my low opinion of Eddie Jordan.

Of course, my biggest problem with Jordan is how he handles Arenas, so maybe Kofi has a point.

RamBo_Lamar
04-14-2008, 11:02 PM
Finally at long last I can enjoy the remainder of the NBA season as the playoff charade is over.

lol

It is sort of a relief, isn't it. I've never looked forward to the end of a
regular season like I have this one before. Feels strange...in a giddy,
happy, yet wrong kind of way.

Kegboy
04-14-2008, 11:04 PM
Feels strange...in a giddy, happy, yet wrong kind of way.

Funny, that's how I feel whenever Btown posts.

:rimshot:

Shade
04-14-2008, 11:08 PM
Betcha guys wish now we had a better draft pick. :tongue:

Kegboy
04-14-2008, 11:10 PM
Betcha guys wish now we had a better draft pick. :tongue:

Eh, who cares if it's the 7th or 11th pick if Larry just uses it on Chase Buddinger.

:runout:

GenlHooker
04-14-2008, 11:19 PM
:p Thank goodnes its finally over, and I for one am glad we are out of the playoffs. Now we can get on with cleaning house. Please start with Bird. HE was a great player but merciful heavens let him out as GM. Coach O is fine but we need to change about half the roster. Tinsley, O'Neal,Daniels,Harrison,Diogu, Graham, and Owens good bye!

Hicks
04-14-2008, 11:23 PM
Then there were some annoying young fans who kept screaming "FRODO!" every time diener touched the ball
:laugh: I love it! That's what I'm going to call him now.

NorCal_Pacerfan
04-14-2008, 11:27 PM
Well, we made a valiant effort these past 15 games or so. Just barely fell short but we have something to feel good about and build on. Granger is the man and is going to be an allstar. Maybe we'll get a decent draft pick. Will be interesting to see what Bird does in the offseason.

Thanks Pacers - see you next season!!
(I know there's one more game left)

avoidingtheclowns
04-14-2008, 11:30 PM
yeah i should clarify... the frodo part was funny but the kids were heinously annoying. diener wasn't nearly as amused by the name as i was.

Kegboy
04-14-2008, 11:40 PM
yeah i should clarify... the frodo part was funny but the kids were heinously annoying. diener wasn't nearly as amused by the name as i was.

Would he have preferred if I were there making Stanko's Russian Diner jokes? Frankly I think he'd just be confused.

FireTheCoach
04-14-2008, 11:45 PM
I believe he was saying that I was patting myself on the back or something. I'm not sure. I do think it was intended to be a knock on me though.

well are ya? LOL....

IBSFALTOH is a phase that gets used around here sometimes... some people have a keen insight to the game that other less savy fans cant comprehend.

And you thought I was just poking fun at you... now do I seem like the kind of guy that would do that.

Doddage
04-14-2008, 11:48 PM
Wow, the Bulls put up 151 tonight. :jawdrop:
Ramon Sessions dropping 24 assists is SICK.... the Bucks may have struck some gold when signing him

Kegboy
04-14-2008, 11:48 PM
Okay, I just googled IBSFALTOH and got one entry:

http://www.pacersdigest.com/apache2-default/showthread.php?t=38501

FireTheCoach
04-14-2008, 11:53 PM
Okay, I just googled IBSFALTOH and got one entry:

http://www.pacersdigest.com/apache2-default/showthread.php?t=38501

sweet.. I just coined a new anagram.

ibsfaltoh = Ive been saying for a long time on here

I *used to smoke weed.... whenever I was stoned and submitted a post I would put s.i.g.h. at the end for smoke it get high .... Ive been asked a hundred times what that meant and never said... well, now ya know.

Trader Joe
04-15-2008, 12:04 AM
Well now we know the rest of the story...

dal9
04-15-2008, 12:06 AM
:p Thank goodnes its finally over, and I for one am glad we are out of the playoffs. Now we can get on with cleaning house. Please start with Bird. HE was a great player but merciful heavens let him out as GM. Coach O is fine but we need to change about half the roster. Tinsley, O'Neal,Daniels,Harrison,Diogu, Graham, and Owens good bye!

what did poor Graham ever do wrong?

duke dynamite
04-15-2008, 12:07 AM
what did poor Graham ever do wrong?
Not that it was his fault, but not playing is his wrong doing.

Infinite MAN_force
04-15-2008, 12:58 AM
Graham is actually still signed next year. I would guess we have a team option though. Still, I think we should keep him. As bad as the contract situation is, I think he could be a rotation player, a very cheap one at that. I would so much like to see him get daniel's minutes... I am just so sick of that dude.

Robertmto
04-15-2008, 01:32 AM
That's sure what I was thinking while watching. I know people wanted to make the playoffs, but I sure hope nobody feels we should have.

Nice to see Nick Young playing well. I won't lie, if we'd had our pick last year I would have gone for need and taken Law. But I liked Young more as a player.

Aw hell I didn't even want Nick Young, but I'm glad we took him. I was REALLY hoping we would grab Aaron Brooks.


The fact that the Wizards have proven to be better without Gilbert Arenas is the surest sign that he's massively overrated. A no D playing, me-first prima donna. If I were the Wizards management, I'd be looking for a sign & trade in the offseason. Bring in some defense so the Wizards will stop with the epic failure in the playoffs every season.

Actually some teams play better, because their players actually step up. Its kinda nice. ;)


Frankly I'm a bit jealous of MTO. Must be nice to have a team that can take injuries and keep on going strong. Almost makes me rethink my low opinion of Eddie Jordan.

Of course, my biggest problem with Jordan is how he handles Arenas, so maybe Kofi has a point.

Whats wrong with Eddie? He actually disciplnes his playes, and shows tough love. Whats your problem with him? Besides from the fact that he runs the worst practices ever.

Kemo
04-15-2008, 01:56 AM
screaming "FRODO!" every time diener touched the ball.



HAHA that's Great .. FRODO !!!... lmao



hehe think I'll make up a good one on the fly, as a new sig ...

lmao

Midcoasted
04-15-2008, 02:12 AM
Okay I really dont know what has gotten into him but Danny is starting to look like the most dominating scoring threat in the league. Watch out.

But really, he is starting to play like a guy, who on the right team, can win you a championship.

He reminds me alot of Scottie Pippen. But with the scoring ability of Jordan on certain nights. If he starts making those nights more often and does improve his defense and rebounding (which Im almost positive he will) then watch out.

Danny Granger for MVP 2009 anyone?

Midcoasted
04-15-2008, 02:28 AM
And I say no to trading Danny or Mike. They coexist just fine. Our post presence and lack of a PG are just really hurting us.

All we need is a backup SG who can play killer perimeter D, a starting point who can do the same, but not turn it over and not be a ball hog but can also be an offenseive threat(Rose is my dream candidate) and a dominant C and we are set.

Heres to next year:buddies:

special ed
04-15-2008, 02:39 AM
what did poor Graham ever do wrong?Or Ike? Or Kareem Rush?
Not having been around here at all, I don't know if it's been brought up but I've got to question the coaching this season. The rotations were "tight", I guess, in the end, because O'Brien said he liked to do that. But my gawd, man, these guys who weren't part of Jim's favorite 8 got jacked around almost all season. Ike looked early on to be giving us something of what we expected out of a lottery pick, then got hurt and was basically shelved for the season. Rush also looked to be some sort of a steal and guess what? He's been a no show that last quarter of a season. The guys whom OB favored had some game, but those who somehow got in the coach's doghouse? They were rewarded with very little consistent PT.
Not making the playoffs in the woeful EC can only be blamed on the coach this year.
What the heck, questioning the coaching has become typical of most Pacerfans the last two seasons.:cry:

D-BONE
04-15-2008, 06:48 AM
And I say no to trading Danny or Mike. They coexist just fine. Our post presence and lack of a PG are just really hurting us.

All we need is a backup SG who can play killer perimeter D, a starting point who can do the same, but not turn it over and not be a ball hog but can also be an offenseive threat(Rose is my dream candidate) and a dominant C and we are set.

Heres to next year:buddies:

If that's ALL we need, at some point we'll have to give something valuable up to get some of it. I'd definitely sacrifice Dun if he could land us any of those parts, particularly a C or PG. Maybe the defensive specialist we could somehow come up with otherwise.

If we can get these pieces and keep him, all the better! I like him a lot.

duke dynamite
04-15-2008, 07:06 AM
I don't really see anyone wanting Mike's contract even with the numbers he has put up this season. I say we keep him!

Putnam
04-15-2008, 07:41 AM
How many of you think he could kill a whole bowl with one bong rip?:angel:


Nope. Not in 24 seconds, anyway.

Speed
04-15-2008, 08:05 AM
We have all summer to talk about this, but I'm looking forward to this draft more than any I can remember.

I think the Pacers basically have 2 above average legitimate NBA starters in JO and Granger. Dunleavy on the right team. JO, whatever your take on him, is injury prone just by definition of the last 4 or 5 years. That leaves one legit starter and its at a position that you won't have an advantage at every night.

Internally you can look to guys getting better in Shawne and Ike, but I think you could see significant progress from Shawn if JO is moved and he bulks up, but Ike is in no mans land. The answer isn't solely there, obviously.

With all that said with a dominant point guard a lot of the peripherial pieces fit. Problem is Chris Paul isn't walking in that door any time soon with a Pacer uniform on.

This is going to be a very very interesting summer.

I'm not a negative poster and I loved the effort by these guys and most of them could be bench guys or niche guys on a good team.

All I'm saying is they aren't even close and it needs to be addressed that way.

Major Cold
04-15-2008, 08:18 AM
I will take good effort losers over bad effort not as bad losers any day.

grace
04-15-2008, 08:42 AM
Would he have preferred if I were there making Stanko's Russian Diner jokes? Frankly I think he'd just be confused.

You mean he doesn't lurk around here? :loser:

Unclebuck
04-15-2008, 08:51 AM
I would be very hesitant to trade Dunleavy - and I certainly would not trade him for anything less than a starter.

Granger and Dunleavy seem to get along just fine. I've seen Mike get frustrated with Danny at times this season for not passing the ball (but Danny has a little tunnel vision at times, but did improve later in the season)

Overall, I'm not sure Mike is too popular with his teammates. He gets frustrated quite often on the court and just seems like a quiet guy who isn't a barrel of laughs. Just seems as though he has a dour personality. And for that matter not sure Granger is a real popular guy with his teammates either.

Tom White
04-15-2008, 09:55 AM
I would be very hesitant to trade Dunleavy - and I certainly would not trade him for anything less than a starter.

Granger and Dunleavy seem to get along just fine. I've seen Mike get frustrated with danny at thimes this season for not passing the ball (but Danny got a little at not having tunnel vision - later in the season)

Overall, I'm not sure Mike is too popular with his teammates. He gets frustrated quite often on the court and just seems like a quiet guy who isn't a barrel of laughs. Just seems as though he has a dour personality. And for that matter not sure Granger is a real popular guy with his teammates either.

Disclaimer: This is not aimed at Unclebuck - I'm only expanding on his quote.

Seeing how these are two of the hardest working and best players, I think we should be questioning the reasoning of "the teammates" instead of these two.

Can't fault either one for not being the types to hang out with some of the others at the strip clubs or carry around guns or drugs. My guess is they didn't frequent JO's club when it was open, either. That is not to give dis-service to JO's place, or compare it to a strip club. Its just that they don't seem to be club-hoppers.

The thing is, the Pacers are trying to bring back the fans and these two are two of the guys that can really help make that happen. They both seem to be upstanding people, don't bring legal problems with them, and represent the team well on the court and off. I'm not sure that trading either one of them would be in the best interest of the franchise from a basketball or PR aspect.

AesopRockOn
04-15-2008, 10:17 AM
Philly held on! The announcers finally got excited!

Correction! I had sex with Katie too! http://sports.espn.go.com/broadband/video/videopage?videoId=3347181&categoryId=2459788

They must be :mad: now!

OnlyPacersLeft
04-15-2008, 11:34 AM
The way Granger has played since the All-Star break has certainly leads me to believe he could become at least close to an elite player. He's raised his game above other second-string youngsters like Luol Deng and Andre Iguodala.
his team is in the playoffs so i donno about all that...

OnlyPacersLeft
04-15-2008, 11:37 AM
WE REALLY NEED GUYS WHO CAN REBOUND! WE GOT KILLED ON THE GLASS ALL SEASON! IT IS DISSAPOINTING TO BE OUT OF THE PLAYOFFS BUT MAYBE WITH SOME OFFSEASON TUNING AND ADDITIONS WE CAN MAKE IT BACK NEXT SEASON. BYE BYE O'BRIEN!

Unclebuck
04-15-2008, 11:49 AM
WE REALLY NEED GUYS WHO CAN REBOUND! WE GOT KILLED ON THE GLASS ALL SEASON!


Rebounding was OK. (I think defense is much more of a problem) Pacers were the 8th best defensive rebounding team in the NBA. 22nd best offensive rebounding team - That isn't too bad overall.

Speed
04-15-2008, 11:51 AM
Rebounding was OK. (I think defense is much more of a problem) Pacers were the 8th best defensive rebounding team in the NBA. 22nd best offensive rebounding team - That isn't too bad overall.

I wonder how those numbers would be without Jeff.

Unclebuck
04-15-2008, 12:08 PM
I wonder how those numbers would be without Jeff.

I wonder what our record would be without Jeff. My guess is his effort and his energy won a lot of games for the Pacers this season. (they sure seemed different last night without him)

btowncolt
04-15-2008, 12:12 PM
Funny, that's how I feel whenever Btown posts.

:rimshot:

You're getting the hose again.

OakMoses
04-15-2008, 01:35 PM
I would be very hesitant to trade Dunleavy - and I certainly would not trade him for anything less than a starter.

Granger and Dunleavy seem to get along just fine. I've seen Mike get frustrated with Danny at times this season for not passing the ball (but Danny has a little tunnel vision at times, but did improve later in the season)


You hit on a couple of interesting things. I agree with your sentiment about trading or not trading Dunleavy. He's our 2nd best player right now, and we can't really afford to give him away. If we're going to build around Dun and Granger, I really think we need to get a very good defensive PG to play alongside them. You need to have 2 good perimeter defenders. If we have a strong defensive PG, it makes it much easier for us to hide Dun a bit on defense. Also, I think that Dun initiates a lot of our offense, so a guy like Westbrook could play with these guys because he doesn't necessarily have to have the ball in his hands all the time.

As for Danny, I'm incredibly impressed. I never thought he'd be the type of scorer that he's become over the course of this season. To really take his game to the next level, however, he really needs to work on his passing. That's what puts guys like Iguodala ahead of him for the time being. Danny very rarely drives to create a shot for someone else, and he often winds up missing some difficult shots when the defense collapses. He has been better at this lately. I'd also like to see Danny learn how to do this when there is a post player in the game on offense, be it JO or someone else.

If Danny can become a 24 ppg, 6 reb, 4 ast, 2 stl, 1 blk type of guy for next season, I think we'll have a legit. star to build around, even if he is a SF.

Anthem
04-15-2008, 02:44 PM
Betcha guys wish now we had a better draft pick. :tongue:
Not even a little bit.

You think Danny would have tested his wings like this if the team was in tank mode? This recent offensive explosion was because the dude was trying to win. If we were in tank mode we wouldn't have realized that he could do that.

rexnom
04-15-2008, 03:12 PM
Not even a little bit.

You think Danny would have tested his wings like this if the team was in tank mode? This recent offensive explosion was because the dude was trying to win. If we were in tank mode we wouldn't have realized that he could do that.
Yeah, kid showed huge cajones down the stretch. I feel god-awful that we're not going to get to see him in the playoffs - I'm sure he'd excel.

Since86
04-15-2008, 04:05 PM
I don't see the Frodo comparison. :shrug: Maybe a skinner Sam, with the blonde look but not Frodo.