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View Full Version : Position by Positon Player Evaluations - The Shooting Guards



Grant
06-04-2004, 12:25 PM
This one should be much more varied and controversial than the PG's

Reggie Miller
There are so many ways to go with this. Clearly, Reggie is not the player he was 10 years ago. Can he still contribute? I think so. My gut feeling is that he returns and comes off the bench. He is not going to get better, and if all you do is score, you need to score more than 10 points a game.
The other thing is, I think that the Pacers need a third scorer in the starting lineup. Reggie and Tinsley are inconsistent, and Foster is consistent as a non-threat. Grade C-

Fred Jones
There is a lot to like about Freddie. I love that he can slash. He's a very good defender, seems to work hard at improving and plays through pain. He's probably the most athletic guy on the roster and can jump with the best of them. If only he could shoot. He improved from 28% - 30% from the 3 point line last year. :unimpressed: He did, however, shoot much better toward the end of the year and was 11-22 in the playoffs. His FG% only went from 38% - 40% but agian he shot much better as the year went on shooting 47% in February and 52% in March. I think he will be the starter next year barring a trade. Grade A-

James Jones
I know he is supposed to be a SF, but supposedly he can shoot and I think his future is brighter at SG than SF, particularly if Reggie leaves. Grade Incomplete

Other Thoughts
If there is a trade a SG or C are the likely positions to be acquired. If the Pacer acquire a SG that creates some sticky problems with the Spindly One. For example: If the Pacers were to acquire McGrady for Harrington and Bender, what do you do with Jones and Miller? You can't move Jones to 3rd string and putting Miller there would be sacriledge. The Pacers aren't going to trade Reggie and that means if the Pacers look to acquire a SG it seems that its possible that Fred could be traded. :o

If Freddie is the future starter, then the Pacers need an eventual backup, and they should probably get one before Reggie leaves. Again, would Reggie move down to being the 11th or 12th guy?

Possible Trades (Off the Top of My Head)
Al, JB and FJ for McGrady
Al, Scot, FJ for Ray Allen
Al for Larry Hughes
Al for Richardson and filler
Al for Stephen Jackson (sign and trade)
Al for Jason Terry - not sure on this one.
Al and Austin for Mobley and Kato

Offseason Fearless Prediciton
I think the Pacers will explore their options in this order.
1)See if they can acquire a premier guy (Allen, McGrady). Fred and Al may be packaged together for one of these guys
2)Look for a tier 2 guy to compete with Freddie (Richardson/Hughes/Jackson)
3)See if Freddie's backup can be acquired through Free Agency/Draft
4) Go with Reggie/Freddie and look for another SG next year.

I think option 4 is most likely, but I think they will try to Move Al for a SG or C.

Projected Lineup
Fred Jones (Starter)
Reggie Miller
Atnhony Johnson

MSA2CF
06-04-2004, 12:29 PM
I think Shane Battier could be implemented as the shooting guard. I'd welcome him to the team instantly.

sweabs
06-04-2004, 12:41 PM
I think Shane Battier could be implemented as the shooting guard. I'd welcome him to the team instantly.

We can get someone better than Battier...trust me.

MSA2CF
06-04-2004, 12:44 PM
I think Shane Battier could be implemented as the shooting guard. I'd welcome him to the team instantly.

We can get someone better than Battier...trust me.

That's fine. I just think he'd be a great fit here. I'm not thinking big-name players; I'm thinking of guys who fit together to win a championship, like the Anaheim Angels of two years ago.

sweabs
06-04-2004, 12:48 PM
I think Shane Battier could be implemented as the shooting guard. I'd welcome him to the team instantly.

We can get someone better than Battier...trust me.

That's fine. I just think he'd be a great fit here. I'm not thinking big-name players; I'm thinking of guys who fit together to win a championship, like the Anaheim Angels of two years ago.

True - but I still think there are some more talented players who would fit in well...and may not be a "superstar".




Quentin Richardson!!!!!!!!!!

MSA2CF
06-04-2004, 12:54 PM
True - but I still think there are some more talented players who would fit in well...and may not be a "superstar".
Quentin Richardson!!!!!!!!!!

I don't think we need another young guy. I would welcome a guy with experience, like Battier. :laugh:

Pig Nash
06-04-2004, 12:57 PM
True - but I still think there are some more talented players who would fit in well...and may not be a "superstar".
Quentin Richardson!!!!!!!!!!

I don't think we need another young guy. I would welcome a guy with experience, like Battier. :laugh:

So in this thread we've established

rscarey likes quentin richardson
msa2cf likes shane battier
pig nash is captain obvious
we should move on

Cactus Jax
06-04-2004, 01:02 PM
True - but I still think there are some more talented players who would fit in well...and may not be a "superstar".
Quentin Richardson!!!!!!!!!!

I don't think we need another young guy. I would welcome a guy with experience, like Battier. :laugh:

Richardson is just about as experienced as Battier. I would love to have him on the Pacers, but not as the starting 2 guard, as the Pacers, once again need a scorer at that spot. As long as the guy can play some defense it's fine, usually there are very little teams that have great 2 and 3 positions.

sweabs
06-04-2004, 01:03 PM
True - but I still think there are some more talented players who would fit in well...and may not be a "superstar".
Quentin Richardson!!!!!!!!!!

I don't think we need another young guy. I would welcome a guy with experience, like Battier. :laugh:

Richardson is just about as experienced as Battier. I would love to have him on the Pacers, but not as the starting 2 guard, as the Pacers, once again need a scorer at that spot. As long as the guy can play some defense it's fine, usually there are very little teams that have great 2 and 3 positions.

Are you saying that Quentin isn't a scorer?

MSA2CF
06-04-2004, 01:08 PM
Richardson is just about as experienced as Battier.

I'd like to have a guy who has played in at least one NBA playoff game. Quentin hasn't.

I'm interested in seeing whose name comes up this off-season. This should be fun.

Fool
06-04-2004, 01:09 PM
I stay away from evaluating Pacer's as I am not a Pacer fan and I don't see them enough.

If you've done one of these Position Evaluations before I've missed it, but I was just wondering what the grade was in reference to. Is that the person's play? The player at their position compared to the league?

Some of those trades are unrealistic, IMO.

1)Al and Cro for Kato and Mobley (two bech players, one that even Indy is dissapointed in, for two starters who Houston isn't unhappy with)

2) The Mcgrady trade (I realize its extremely hard offer a reasonable trade for this situation but I don't think Orlando would be happy without getting a starter, even if they might start one of the three bench players they got in this deal)

3)Al for Jackson straight up. I like Al but Jackson's stock is much higher, he's a starter, and he scores a great deal more.

Pig Nash
06-04-2004, 01:16 PM
Jackson? which one?

sweabs
06-04-2004, 01:17 PM
Jackson? which one?

I think he's talking about Stephen.

Pig Nash
06-04-2004, 01:19 PM
Oh ok. Then HELL NO! I don't really like his game. And you have to question the intelligence of a guy that doesn't resign with SA and ends up having to go to the Hawks for less money.

Grant
06-04-2004, 01:36 PM
I stay away from evaluating Pacer's as I am not a Pacer fan and I don't see them enough.

If you've done one of these Position Evaluations before I've missed it, but I was just wondering what the grade was in reference to. Is that the person's play? The player at their position compared to the league?

I did one yesterday on PG's. The grade is completely subjective. I guess for me its based mostly on expectations. Fred Jones, for example is not one of the best shooting guards, but I gave him a high grade based on how much he improved and how well he played as a backup SG.


Some of those trades are unrealistic, IMO.

1)Al and Cro for Kato and Mobley (two bech players, one that even Indy is dissapointed in, for two starters who Houston isn't unhappy with)

Well I should have put more though into it instead of spouting off everything I thought of. Houston has had a strange fascination Croshere, and so I put this one in at the end more as an afterthought. I do think that Houston thinks they overpayed for Kato, but of course it doesn't help to trade a bad contract if another is coming your way. Houston does already have a pretty good center though :D

2) The Mcgrady trade (I realize its extremely hard offer a reasonable trade for this situation but I don't think Orlando would be happy without getting a starter, even if they might start one of the three bench players they got in this deal)

I bowed to popular opinion on this. I personally don't think that McGrady is going to go to Indiana. I heard somewhere that a Al/JB - McGrady deal is already on the table (I'm guessing that Orlando is the side holding it up).
I think a lot of people would be on opposite sides of this trade and that probably means its close to fair. I think both Jones and Al would start (given the absence of T-Mac) but it probably boils down to how high the Magic would be on JB. If they think he's a potential superstar... :rolleyes:


3)Al for Jackson straight up. I like Al but Jackson's stock is much higher, he's a starter, and he scores great deal more.

As I understand it Stephen Jackson, wants to get his payday, and its likely that if he is going somewhere else it will have to be a sign-and trade (mid-level exception is likely too low). That means that Atlanta is a little behind the 8-Ball, where Indiana is trading at a position of strength.

Fool
06-04-2004, 01:46 PM
As I understand it Stephen Jackson, wants to get his payday, and its likely that if he is going somewhere else it will have to be a sign-and trade (mid-level exception is likely too low). That means that Atlanta is a little behind the 8-Ball, where Indiana is trading at a position of strength.

I respect that.

SkipperZ
06-04-2004, 03:34 PM
Theres no way Stephen Jacksons stock is higher than Harrington. He's a role player on a terrible team. If he came here his job would be as a spot up 3 point shooter. Valuable sure, but not worth Al Harrington.

Jackson is a mediocre player on a terrible team putting up great numbers. (Ahem, Jason Terry, Shareef Abdur Rahim, Ricky Davis, etc. etc. etc.) Bobby Sura was racking up the triple doubles on Atlanta. Sure hes a nice player I would welcome on the Pacers but im talking Jason kidd numbers. Bobby Sura is no Jason Kidd. And Stephen Jackson is no Al Harrington.

SkipperZ
06-04-2004, 03:40 PM
By the way if TMac is really available I would say get him with any means necessary, without trading JO or Tinsley. I only say Tinsley because I think he would be a great PG to lead a team with McGrady and JO, and that Orlando is unable to give us back a PG of similar quality.

TheSauceMaster
06-04-2004, 03:55 PM
Tmac has said already there are 4 teams he would accept a offer to goto and those 4 teams are :

Suns
Rockets
Spurs
Lakers

Suns have no intrest in him as confirmed by several reports , Jeff Van Gundy has Said pretty much he views Tmac as a quitter and doesn't want him and would rather keep Francis than Having Tmac, Spurs haven't really said much nor have the Lakers.

I think Dreaming Reggie is gonna come off the Bench is a slim chance

There has been some speculation that Miller might come off the bench next season, but Carlisle said he doubts that would happen.

"If he returns for an 18th year, my feeling would be he probably would be a starter next year," Carlisle said.

So I really am having doubts on what these so called changes are gonna be.

sweabs
06-04-2004, 04:02 PM
Tmac has said already there are 4 teams he would accept a offer to goto and those 4 teams are :

Suns - Nice weather
Rockets - Nice weather
Spurs - Nice weather
Lakers - Nice weather

TheSauceMaster
06-04-2004, 04:05 PM
I really see Tmac going to the Lakers if Kobe indeed want's to leave , If I remember right Tmac has a House Next Door To Shaq in Cali and there good friends.

sweabs
06-04-2004, 04:07 PM
I really see Tmac going to the Lakers if Kobe indeed want's to leave , If I remember right Tmac has a House Next Door To Shaq in Cali and there good friends.

:puke:.

I just want the Lakers to completely FOLD after this year - no good players!!! Them and their nice weather/location. I swear - players MUST have the weather/location up on their priority list when they are choosing a new team. Especially the young talented ones.