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View Full Version : Walsh, "Reggie's replacement is not on the Roster."



Will Galen
06-03-2004, 05:37 AM
http://www.indystar.com/articles/7/151996-1317-179.html


Bob Kravitz
Bird, Walsh must make some changes

Now, Larry Bird knows what he's got, who he's got, who he can count upon when the games are tight and the stakes are high. He had his suspicions all season -- haven't we all? -- watching his team achieve and even overachieve. But that's another one of the great things about coming within two victories of the NBA Finals. Those initial suspicions tend to get confirmed in the bubbling cauldron of playoff basketball.

"Ohhhhh, yeah," Bird said after the Pacers' season ended Tuesday night in Game 6 of the Eastern Conference finals. "It's a whole new ballgame now. Because you've seen them in the tough times, you've seen them in the good times, you've seen them in each playoff round. And you sort of separate the guys who you know can get it done from the guys who can't."

It's unlikely that next year's team will look dramatically different from this year's team, and for good reason: There's no reason to blow up a young, 61-victory team.

But there will be changes.

There must be changes.

More than anything, the Pacers need to find Reggie Miller's heir apparent.

When I recently asked Donnie Walsh if Reggie's replacement was on this roster, he said no. That means the brain trust is going to have to go outside to find someone who can shoot from the outside, stretch defenses, make room for Jermaine O'Neal and Ron Artest to operate, and cover the likes of Richard Hamilton.

Bird, naturally, wasn't going to share his specific vision for this team, but that doesn't stop the rest of us from playing armchair general manager.

• It's time to move Al Harrington.

Good kid, great talent, but the Pacers still cannot count on him to be consistent when it counts. His game too often mirrors his emotions: too high one game, too low the next.

Make no mistake, Game 6 was an important night for Harrington. He got to start, something he's been pining to do for years. And despite a fast start, he didn't get it done, saddled early with foul problems.

For years now, we've been saying the Pacers have to somehow break the logjam at forward, where Austin Croshere, Jonathan Bender, Harrington and others are always fighting for minutes.

Well, this is the time, and Harrington, who is eminently marketable, is the man. If anybody on this team can fetch the kind of player the Pacers need, it's Harrington.

• It's time to recognize that if the Pacers want a "Ring For Reggie," they're going to have to do it with Miller coming off the bench. Assuming that Miller is willing to return under those conditions. After Game 6, he refused to comment on his future.

There's no reason for Miller to retire if he still has the desire to play. This isn't exactly Willie Mays, circling haplessly under a fly ball during the waning days of his career. But the organization stayed with him too long as a starter.

It's like the coaches looked at him and saw the Reggie of 1998, while the rest of us saw a guy who was getting beaten defensively and passing up open shots. Except for the game-winner in Game 1, this was a nightmare series for Miller, who had his layup blocked in Game 2, and saw his mini-me, Hamilton, become a star on his watch.

He might be a starter somewhere, but he's not a starter here, not for a team that has designs on a championship.

If that's blasphemy, so be it. But it's time to make room for somebody else, whether it's Fred Jones or somebody else.

"Only Reggie knows," Bird said when asked about Miller's future. "Whatever he wants to do. I've always said, only a player knows when it's time (to retire) and it's totally up to Reggie and whatever he thinks.

"I have no idea what he'll do. I think he had fun and he had an opportunity to get back to the Finals. If he wants to come back, he can come back. We'll take him with open arms."

Now, a lot of fans will argue that it's time to cut bait with Bender, who follows up every tantalizing performance with the kinds of hellish four-minute stints we saw in Game 5.

Except I don't see it happening. Bird likes Bender too much -- always has -- and the Pacers have invested too much time and money to cut the cord now. Thing is, the only way they'll find out if he can produce on a consistent basis is by giving him consistent minutes, and the only way that will happen is by moving Harrington.

Bird has had an entire season to monitor these players. And so has coach Rick Carlisle, who came along late last summer and still, somehow, choreographed a 13-victory improvement. They know they can't sit quietly, not while Detroit is looking like it will remain a power for years, not while Miami and Milwaukee and Cleveland and others are moving up fast.

This, clearly, will be a different kind of summer.

Peck
06-03-2004, 05:55 AM
Is it me, or is this the first time the local press has been calling for player movement after a successfull season?

Does this end the Bender is the future two guard theory? I sure hope so.

Mourning
06-03-2004, 06:15 AM
:laugh: Yeah, it looks like it. Al will bo moved, I think. So, Jon should get his minutes and be our new 6th man. Lets hope he will stay healthy, IF he does I think its great.

Regards,

Mourning :cool:

Will Galen
06-03-2004, 06:45 AM
Is it me, or is this the first time the local press has been calling for player movement after a successfull season?


The writer is Bob Kravitz. He drives down the road in his vehicle and then puts the window down and sticks his hand out the window to see which way the wind is blowing.

Okay, okay, that was harsh. Let me put it this way. He gives me the impression he writes about the Pacers because it's his job, and he's not a fan. As such I think he gets his opinions from the Internet, or his opinion is what is obvious to everyone. Which is of course the Pacer's are going to move some players to get over the hump.

I guess what I'm trying to say is even though he writes for the local newspaper, his writing doesn't strike me as local, just an un-informed hack trying to make a buck writing about something (The Pacers) he's not really interested in writing about.

So I would say the local press still isn't calling for player movement after a successful season.

Shoot, I'm writing a bit of nonsense, I need to go to bed.

indygeezer
06-03-2004, 07:06 AM
Remember the comments last year about needing a slasher, a creator? DId they address those needs at the time? Nope. I don't put much stock in what they say in public.


BTW Will, every time I see that picture of you with the sun and the ocean in the background I'm reminded that you're a prick. There are times when I could kill you...now is one. (j/k of course this was not a REAL threat against his life Mr. FBI eavesdropper)

Peck
06-03-2004, 08:42 AM
Oh, I'm aware that Kravits just writes crap off the top of his head.

But read the Smith piece & in particular read the Montieth piece & you will see they are not just saying "stand pat" or patience or any of the other buzzwords that we have read in the past.

Unclebuck
06-03-2004, 08:59 AM
"Ohhhhh, yeah," Bird said after the Pacers' season ended Tuesday night in Game 6 of the Eastern Conference finals. "It's a whole new ballgame now. Because you've seen them in the tough times, you've seen them in the good times, you've seen them in each playoff round. And you sort of separate the guys who you know can get it done from the guys who can't."


Quote from Bird above.

We know J.O can get it done.

We know Reggie used to be able to.

I think we know that Artest can get it done.

other than that what else do we know

Peck
06-03-2004, 09:20 AM
Oh, we know a lot really.

We know that we are stuck wit Croshere because of his contract. But we also know that he is a good team guy & a good bench player who is willing to play whatever role the team asks of him & that he can have a role on the team.

We know that Jeff Foster can defend most centers & power forwards in the league. We know that he can rebound. We also know that he has to develop a shot of some sort. We know that he is also a good team player & would accept whatever role the team gives him.

We know that Fred Jones is a good guard. He may be a great guard someday, he may just be a good guard. But even if he doesn't improve anymore than he is, he is already a good backup.

We know that Anthony Johnson is a solid backup point guard who is also a good team player. We know that he is a vocal leader on the bench. We know that he will accept whatever role the team gives him.

We know that Scot Pollard is a waste of money. He should be dealt to whoever will take him, even if it means that Primoz Brezac is one of the backups ahead of him.

We know that as of right now our team runs better with Jamaal Tinsley at the p.g. spot.

So in other words, we know know some things. Others are still up in the air though.

bulletproof
06-03-2004, 09:28 AM
So in other words, we know know some things. Others are still up in the air though.

Like what? You don't have to have a genius basketball I.Q. to know what needs to be done. There were some chemistry issues Donnie and Larry were concerned about going into the season. They probably have a pretty good handle on that now. And certainly things change on a daily basis, but I'm sure Larry and Donnie have already talked about an off-season strategy—who they're interested in and who'd they be willing to part with. And you have to believe if they've made some comments to the press, they've certainly talked amongst themselves.

Unclebuck
06-03-2004, 09:29 AM
All good points Peck. Yes we do know all those things.

I think we also know that Fred Jones is better in bigger games

sweabs
06-03-2004, 09:38 AM
Wow - I am really starting to get excited...not "playoff" excited...but "offseason acquisition" excited!!! I can't wait to see who Donnie and Larry go after for the SG position...who do you all think they'll go after?

Peck
06-03-2004, 09:39 AM
So in other words, we know know some things. Others are still up in the air though.

Like what? You don't have to have a genius basketball I.Q. to know what needs to be done. There were some chemistry issues Donnie and Larry were concerned about going into the season. They probably have a pretty good handle on that now. And certainly things change on a daily basis, but I'm sure Larry and Donnie have already talked about an off-season strategy—who they're interested in and who'd they be willing to part with. And you have to believe if they've made some comments to the press, they've certainly talked amongst themselves.

Bender. That's still up in the air. Even if they know what they want/hope/dream/desire whatever from him. There is just no way of knowing how this guy will respond to a larger role, because there is always the injury issue with him. Also I have never been thrilled with his off-season work ethic. His refusal to come to town for coaching or go to Pete Newells camp have always rubbed me the wrong way.

Some of the stuff you & I have talked about are still up in the air as well, at least until you tell me differantly. The two players in particular that we discussed are still enigma's IMO. I'll wait till you tell me though, I'm very interested in hearing the follow up on one in particular.

Also what is up in the air is what other teams do. Could say Cleveland make a move to dramticaly improve their team? Could New York?

bulletproof
06-03-2004, 09:46 AM
So in other words, we know know some things. Others are still up in the air though.

Like what? You don't have to have a genius basketball I.Q. to know what needs to be done. There were some chemistry issues Donnie and Larry were concerned about going into the season. They probably have a pretty good handle on that now. And certainly things change on a daily basis, but I'm sure Larry and Donnie have already talked about an off-season strategy—who they're interested in and who'd they be willing to part with. And you have to believe if they've made some comments to the press, they've certainly talked amongst themselves.

Some of the stuff you & I have talked about are still up in the air as well, at least until you tell me differantly. The two players in particular that we discussed are still enigma's IMO. I'll wait till you tell me though, I'm very interested in hearing the follow up on one in particular.

Also what is up in the air is what other teams do. Could say Cleveland make a move to dramticaly improve their team? Could New York?

Ooooooh...I was talking more from a management position. I think they have a pretty good handle on what needs to be done. The other stuff I'm curious about myself. Wish I were in Indy right now.

Suaveness
06-03-2004, 10:12 AM
All good points. I think that Fred WILL improve, and he will become the main 6th man if Harrington is traded or starts. Unless Bender decides to stay healthy.

I think I am happy having JO, Ron, Fred, Reg, Austin, Foster, Tins, and AJ on the team. They all play well. And yes, Fred does seem to play better in bigger games. And once he tries shooting more, he will help a lot next year.

Only thing that I worry about is that if we trade Al, we won't have a post presence coming of the bench. Unless you think Bender is a post presence....

Jose Slaughter
06-03-2004, 10:22 AM
Bird likes Bender too much -- always has

I remember reading somewhere, a long time ago that Bird was highly PO'd that the Pacers traded away AD for an unproven high school kid.

So, which is it?

Bball
06-03-2004, 10:32 AM
Bird likes Bender too much -- always has

I remember reading somewhere, a long time ago that Bird was highly PO'd that the Pacers traded away AD for an unproven high school kid.

So, which is it?

I think I remember it that Bird wanted somebody who was ready to contribute and not an unproven HSer... Foster was a 'make up' move to compromise.

That's how I remember it. I don't necessarily remember Bird having a problem with trading AD... altho who knows what goes on behind closed doors? I just seem remember JB wasn't Larry's pick.

-Bball

SycamoreKen
06-03-2004, 10:42 AM
All good points. I think that Fred WILL improve, and he will become the main 6th man if Harrington is traded or starts. Unless Bender decides to stay healthy.

I think I am happy having JO, Ron, Fred, Reg, Austin, Foster, Tins, and AJ on the team. They all play well. And yes, Fred does seem to play better in bigger games. And once he tries shooting more, he will help a lot next year.

Only thing that I worry about is that if we trade Al, we won't have a post presence coming of the bench. Unless you think Bender is a post presence....

I too like the idea of Fred being the 6th man spark plug off the bench. He is very atletic and has shown he can hit the three. I really don't see him as being a starter due to his being 6'2". Him and Tins together in the backcourt would be a difficult matchup defensively for us.

TheSauceMaster
06-03-2004, 10:45 AM
All I know is when Rick was asked by a caller lastnight about Bender he said it Depends alot on how hard JB works this summer etc , so that leads me to believe if JB doesn't show something this summer , he's gone.

Then again maybe I was reading to much into what Rick was saying ;)

LAPacer
06-03-2004, 10:53 AM
Bender is too slow to be a 2 guard anyway.

This is why I hate the offseason. Too long. No games to watch. Even more teasing (last year it was theo ratliff, scot pollard the eastern conference all star center, cuttino mobley... this year its tmac, the #1 draft pick). So does that mean if we don't make a move for a two guard this off season, then Donnie/Bird basically didn't get it done over the summer.

Unclebuck
06-03-2004, 11:29 AM
I have not run the numbers, But I think Fred Jones is the only Pacers player who shot better in the playoffs than he did in the regular season.

unstandable
06-03-2004, 11:43 AM
He was one of the two - Jones increased from 39.5% to 49%, and Foster increased from 54.4% to 58.1%.

LAPacer
06-03-2004, 11:49 AM
He was one of the two - Jones increased from 39.5% to 49%, and Foster increased from 54.4% to 58.1%.

:yikes: , Foster!!! those are some nice stats.

Stryder
06-03-2004, 11:56 AM
He was one of the two - Jones increased from 39.5% to 49%, and Foster increased from 54.4% to 58.1%.

But he only shot 3 of 8 (37.5%) in the Detroit series.

RWB
06-03-2004, 11:59 AM
Bird likes Bender too much -- always has


I remember seeing on one of the T-Haute stations a short interview with Slick and Bird at some golf outing a few years ago. One thing that really caught my interest was Slick talking about Bender "If Johnny Bender works on his game I think we may have another Larry Nance or better". Make no mistake Bird listens/talks to Slick Leonard as much as anybody and this comment came out of no where in the off season.

Bball
06-03-2004, 12:10 PM
Bird likes Bender too much -- always has


I remember seeing on one of the T-Haute stations a short interview with Slick and Bird at some golf outing a few years ago. One thing that really caught my interest was Slick talking about Bender "If Johnny Bender works on his game I think we may have another Larry Nance or better". Make no mistake Bird listens/talks to Slick Leonard as much as anybody and this comment came out of no where in the off season.

Didn't Larry Nance retire due to an injury?

-Bball

DisplacedKnick
06-03-2004, 12:33 PM
Bird likes Bender too much -- always has


I remember seeing on one of the T-Haute stations a short interview with Slick and Bird at some golf outing a few years ago. One thing that really caught my interest was Slick talking about Bender "If Johnny Bender works on his game I think we may have another Larry Nance or better". Make no mistake Bird listens/talks to Slick Leonard as much as anybody and this comment came out of no where in the off season.

Didn't Larry Nance retire due to an injury?

-Bball

Yeah - after 13 years when he was 35. By that logic we wouldn't want another Larry Bird.

Of course I don't agree with the original premise. But if it was several years ago, Slick may not agree with it today.

TheSauceMaster
06-03-2004, 12:45 PM
He was one of the two - Jones increased from 39.5% to 49%, and Foster increased from 54.4% to 58.1%.

But he only shot 3 of 8 (37.5%) in the Detroit series.

surely he shot better than that , I know game 5 he was 5-8 and 3-4 from 3 point land ,so I know he took more than 8 shots during that series.

Bball
06-03-2004, 03:08 PM
He was one of the two - Jones increased from 39.5% to 49%, and Foster increased from 54.4% to 58.1%.

But he only shot 3 of 8 (37.5%) in the Detroit series.

surely he shot better than that , I know game 5 he was 5-8 and 3-4 from 3 point land ,so I know he took more than 8 shots during that series.

I think maybe he was talking about Foster....


-Bball

Will Galen
06-03-2004, 03:39 PM
BTW Will, every time I see that picture of you with the sun and the ocean in the background I'm reminded that you're a prick. There are times when I could kill you...now is one. (j/k of course this was not a REAL threat against his life Mr. FBI eavesdropper)


It's a good thing then that I didn't use the picture I wanted to use. Think . . . new porsche and me, surounded by bikinied girls. <snort>

BillS
06-03-2004, 04:27 PM
BTW Will, every time I see that picture of you with the sun and the ocean in the background I'm reminded that you're a prick. There are times when I could kill you...now is one. (j/k of course this was not a REAL threat against his life Mr. FBI eavesdropper)


It's a good thing then that I didn't use the picture I wanted to use. Think . . . new porsche and me, surounded by bikinied girls. <snort>So you do Photoshop as well?

Stryder
06-03-2004, 04:28 PM
He was one of the two - Jones increased from 39.5% to 49%, and Foster increased from 54.4% to 58.1%.

But he only shot 3 of 8 (37.5%) in the Detroit series.

surely he shot better than that , I know game 5 he was 5-8 and 3-4 from 3 point land ,so I know he took more than 8 shots during that series.

I think maybe he was talking about Foster....


-Bball

Bball is correct. I was referring to Foster.

Will Galen
06-03-2004, 04:30 PM
BTW Will, every time I see that picture of you with the sun and the ocean in the background I'm reminded that you're a prick. There are times when I could kill you...now is one. (j/k of course this was not a REAL threat against his life Mr. FBI eavesdropper)


It's a good thing then that I didn't use the picture I wanted to use. Think . . . new porsche and me, surounded by bikinied girls. <snort>So you do Photoshop as well?

Laughing out loud! No, Micrografx.

Tom White
06-03-2004, 04:45 PM
Wow - I am really starting to get excited...not "playoff" excited...but "offseason acquisition" excited!!! I can't wait to see who Donnie and Larry go after for the SG position...who do you all think they'll go after?

Last year many of us were excited about the off-season, and what might be done. All they did was add Anderson, Johnson and Pollard.

And lost Brad Miller.

The moral to the story is, don't get too excited.

Suaveness
06-03-2004, 04:46 PM
BTW Will, every time I see that picture of you with the sun and the ocean in the background I'm reminded that you're a prick. There are times when I could kill you...now is one. (j/k of course this was not a REAL threat against his life Mr. FBI eavesdropper)


It's a good thing then that I didn't use the picture I wanted to use. Think . . . new porsche and me, surounded by bikinied girls. <snort>

So...you think you can hook me up with those girls and the porsche? I am MORE than willing... ;)

Slick Pinkham
06-03-2004, 04:48 PM
BTW Will, every time I see that picture of you with the sun and the ocean in the background I'm reminded that you're a prick. There are times when I could kill you...now is one. (j/k of course this was not a REAL threat against his life Mr. FBI eavesdropper)


It's a good thing then that I didn't use the picture I wanted to use. Think . . . new porsche and me, surounded by bikinied girls. <snort>So you do Photoshop as well?

Laughing out loud! No, Micrografx.
Is that something like Viagra?

:laugh:

Will Galen
06-03-2004, 05:00 PM
Is that something like Viagra?

:laugh:

Ah . . . I don't know, what's Viagra?

Suaveness
06-03-2004, 05:04 PM
Is that something like Viagra?

:laugh:

Ah . . . I don't know, what's Viagra?

If not Viagra...then Cialis? Or Levitra? ;)

Mourning
06-03-2004, 05:27 PM
Is that something like Viagra?

:laugh:

Ah . . . I don't know, what's Viagra?

If not Viagra...then Cialis? Or Levitra? ;)

WOW! You certainly seem to know your brands!!! :D :D :D

Regards,

Mourning :cool:

Will Galen
06-03-2004, 05:55 PM
Is that something like Viagra?

:laugh:

Ah . . . I don't know, what's Viagra?

If not Viagra...then Cialis? Or Levitra? ;)

WOW! You certainly seem to know your brands!!! :D :D :D

Regards,

Mourning :cool:

:jump: :jump::jump::jump:

Bball
06-03-2004, 09:22 PM
Is that something like Viagra?

:laugh:

Ah . . . I don't know, what's Viagra?

If not Viagra...then Cialis? Or Levitra? ;)

WOW! You certainly seem to know your brands!!! :D :D :D

Regards,

Mourning :cool:

Nah.... he just doesn't have a filter on his email and sees those about 1000 times a day in his email....

Spam :unimpressed: :mad:

-Bball

Suaveness
06-04-2004, 12:08 AM
Is that something like Viagra?

:laugh:

Ah . . . I don't know, what's Viagra?

If not Viagra...then Cialis? Or Levitra? ;)

WOW! You certainly seem to know your brands!!! :D :D :D

Regards,

Mourning :cool:

It helps when I work at a pharmaceutical company ;)

Will Galen
06-04-2004, 12:38 AM
quote]

It helps when I work at a pharmaceutical company ;)


Could you send PacerTom some samples? I'm not in need myself. <smerk-grin>

Suaveness
06-04-2004, 09:12 AM
quote]

It helps when I work at a pharmaceutical company ;)


Could you send PacerTom some samples? I'm not in need myself. <smerk-grin>

lol...are you sure it will work ? ;)

ChicagoJ
06-04-2004, 10:23 AM
Could you send PacerTom some samples? I'm not in need myself. <smerk-grin>

That's good. Because otherwise...

It's a good thing then that I didn't use the picture I wanted to use. Think . . . new porsche and me, surounded by bikinied girls. <snort>

.... would be a waste of precious, valuable bikinis.

:D

MagicRat
06-04-2004, 10:28 AM
Is that something like Viagra?

:laugh:

Ah . . . I don't know, what's Viagra?

If not Viagra...then Cialis? Or Levitra? ;)

WOW! You certainly seem to know your brands!!! :D :D :D

Regards,

Mourning :cool:

Nah.... he just doesn't have a filter on his email and sees those about 1000 times a day in his email....

Spam :unimpressed: :mad:

-Bball

I assumed his knowledge came from sports talk radio ads, but since he didn't mention Enzyte I figured I was wrong......

Suaveness
06-04-2004, 12:08 PM
It's a good thing then that I didn't use the picture I wanted to use. Think . . . new porsche and me, surounded by bikinied girls. <snort>

.... would be a waste of precious, valuable bikinis.

:D

Oh indeed. I think those bikinis are quite unneeded. :D

Snickers
06-04-2004, 12:10 PM
Kind of ironic how a Reggie Miller thread transformed into a Viagra discussion.

:D

LAPacer
06-04-2004, 12:13 PM
Kind of ironic how a Reggie Miller thread transformed into a Viagra discussion.

:D

Wasn't there a thread on the definition of ironic. What is ironic about a RMiller thread transforming into a Viagara thread? Did RMiller have off court issues this year. ;)

ChicagoJ
06-04-2004, 12:19 PM
Kind of ironic how a Reggie Miller thread transformed into a Viagra discussion.

:D

Wasn't there a thread on the definition of ironic. What is ironic about a RMiller thread transforming into a Viagara thread? Did RMiller have off court issues this year. ;)

Not that I know of, but at his age he'd make a fine spokesman for Lilly's version, don'tcha think?

Snickers
06-04-2004, 12:34 PM
Kind of ironic how a Reggie Miller thread transformed into a Viagra discussion.

:D

Wasn't there a thread on the definition of ironic. What is ironic about a RMiller thread transforming into a Viagara thread? Did RMiller have off court issues this year. ;)

Not that I know of, but at his age he'd make a fine spokesman for Lilly's version, don'tcha think?

Exactly what I was thinking. Not that I spend a lot of time thinking about Reggie's "problems...." :uhoh:

And the irony is how it happened beneath the posters' consciousness. :flirt:

Suaveness
06-04-2004, 02:15 PM
Kind of ironic how a Reggie Miller thread transformed into a Viagra discussion.

:D

Wasn't there a thread on the definition of ironic. What is ironic about a RMiller thread transforming into a Viagara thread? Did RMiller have off court issues this year. ;)

Not that I know of, but at his age he'd make a fine spokesman for Lilly's version, don'tcha think?

Yeah....Levitra has the NFL, Viagra...well, it's Viagra. So Reggie should do Cialis! :laugh: