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aero
12-24-2007, 12:34 PM
Bulls coach Scott Skiles has lost his job as a result of his team's slow start.

The Bulls have lost three of their last four games and were booed throughout Saturday's home loss to the Rockets. Despite high expectations, the Bulls (9-16) have the third worst record in the Eastern Conference.

"This was a difficult decision to make, but one that was necessary at this time," general manager John Paxson said in a statement Monday. "Scott helped us in many ways during his time with the Bulls; most importantly, he helped this franchise get back to respectability. I am appreciative of his hard work and the imprint that he left on our team."

The Bulls said no decision has been made on a replacement for Skiles.

Ben Wallace said Saturday he would welcome personnel changes if it would help the club.

"That's one of those things that goes along with this league," said Wallace. "Change is not always bad. If everybody wants to be here we have to step it up and go out there and play basketball."


[espn] (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3167808)

_______________

I know they had a rought start but wow...

Rajah Brown
12-24-2007, 12:34 PM
Per ESPN Radio, Paxson has announced he is 'relieved of his duties'.

Ho, Ho, Ho, Merry Xmas Scott !

Larry Brown ?

Mr. Pink
12-24-2007, 12:34 PM
Scrolling like crazy on ESPN.

Can we sign him as a backup PG?

kester99
12-24-2007, 12:39 PM
Can we sign him as a backup PG?

Ha. My first thought too. He's a hoosier boy, right? Be good for the box office.

Mr. Pink
12-24-2007, 12:41 PM
ha. I saw we started our threads exactly at 5:34. Is that a PD record?

SamBear
12-24-2007, 12:42 PM
Bulls fire coach Skiles; no replacement named yet

ESPN.com news services

Updated: December 24, 2007, 12:37 PM ET

Bulls coach Scott Skiles has lost his job as a result of his team's slow start.

The Bulls have lost three of their last four games and were booed throughout Saturday's home loss to the Rockets. Despite high expectations, the Bulls (9-16) have the third worst record in the Eastern Conference.

"This was a difficult decision to make, but one that was necessary at this time," general manager John Paxson said in a statement Monday. "Scott helped us in many ways during his time with the Bulls; most importantly, he helped this franchise get back to respectability. I am appreciative of his hard work and the imprint that he left on our team."

The Bulls said no decision has been made on a replacement for Skiles.

Ben Wallace said Saturday he would welcome personnel changes if it would help the club.

"That's one of those things that goes along with this league," said Wallace. "Change is not always bad. If everybody wants to be here we have to step it up and go out there and play basketball."

Information from The Associated Press was used in this report.


LINK (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3167808)

Moses
12-24-2007, 12:43 PM
Kind of surprising. Good news for us though, at least for this season.

ABADays
12-24-2007, 12:51 PM
A bit Grinchy for me.

DisplacedKnick
12-24-2007, 12:53 PM
And yet Isiah Thomas still has a job . . .

Yo Jimmy - and this time, when a coach gripes about the lazy players that don't play defense, let him go until he gets some hard working players that WILL play defense.

Or you could just Larry Brown him.

Will Galen
12-24-2007, 12:54 PM
Kind of surprising. Good news for us though, at least for this season.

Huh? Chicago losing Skiles isn't good news for us, it's bad news. Now the team will all get on the same page for a new coach and play better ball. If they would have kept Skiles they would have continued their tailspin.

kester99
12-24-2007, 01:02 PM
A bit Grinchy for me.

Pax the Axe.

naptownmenace
12-24-2007, 01:09 PM
Scott wasn't the problem but maybe the players did bail them out.

Natston
12-24-2007, 01:18 PM
Scott wasn't the problem but maybe the players did bail them out.

The NBA is a players' league, so therefor it's never the players' fault... ;)

Fool
12-24-2007, 01:19 PM
Does this mean Grace is w/o a team again?

tdubb03
12-24-2007, 01:25 PM
Man, day before Xmas. Not like it'll put him in the poor house I s'pose.

I think it's the right move. Even if they hadn't had this disastrous start I never saw Skiles as a championship coach. Of course, Doc Rivers may be a championship coach after this season.

Anthem
12-24-2007, 01:26 PM
On the one hand, a new coach usually does give a team a short-term boost.

On the other hand, who is Chicago going to go after that will improve them by the end of the year? Who's out there? Carlisle?

grace
12-24-2007, 01:29 PM
Does this mean Grace is w/o a team again?

It means that grace has League Pass for nothing. She also has an unused 2008 Chicago Bulls calender and a fashionable Bulls t-shirt (only worn about 4 times) for sale.

I suppose it's an over reaction to say that my Christmas is ruined, but it sure feels that way.

For those who are interested I'm still not a fan of the Pacers. :tongue:

Now I'm off to change my avatar. I don't blame Noah, but there is no f-ing way there's going to be a Bull in my avatar!

Wu-Gambino
12-24-2007, 01:31 PM
Does anyone see talks of Gordon, Deng, or Hinrich increasing?

grace
12-24-2007, 01:36 PM
Does anyone see talks of Gordon, Deng, or Hinrich increasing?

You want 'em you can have them.

CableKC
12-24-2007, 01:43 PM
You want 'em you can have them.
Wow.....I'm really surprised by your reaction....I'm not sure if you are joking or not.

Do you think that it was Skiles fault that the Bulls are playing like the way they are now?

or

Is it the Players fault?

or

Is it a little of both the Players or Coaches fault?

I'm asking only cuz you would probably have a better insight then most of us....and I'm gonna be bored for the next 2 days until we play the Hawks ;)

Kegboy
12-24-2007, 01:45 PM
Does anyone see talks of Gordon, Deng, or Hinrich increasing?

Not necessarily now, but when the trading deadline comes around and they're even worse than they are now, yeah.

Kstat, Fool, and Shags, here's your chance to convince my sister to be a Pistons fan. Not only does everyone here think she should be (because you're supposed to be loyal to your first team, and she was born in Michigan), but you've got Peanut Butter now, too.

Fool
12-24-2007, 01:57 PM
My Pitch:

There's only one Wallace left on our team and Tayshaun is a nice guy.

grace
12-24-2007, 02:02 PM
Wow.....I'm really surprised by your reaction....I'm not sure if you are joking or not.

Do you think that it was Skiles fault that the Bulls are playing like the way they are now?

or

Is it the Players fault?

or

Is it a little of both the Players or Coaches fault?

I'm asking only cuz you would probably have a better insight then most of us....and I'm gonna be bored for the next 2 days until we play the Hawks ;)

Before Scott got fired I was to the point I didn't care who they traded, not even Deng. The only people on the team that amount to anything are Joe Smith and Andres Nocioni.

Naptown_Seth
12-24-2007, 02:14 PM
On the one hand, a new coach usually does give a team a short-term boost.

On the other hand, who is Chicago going to go after that will improve them by the end of the year? Who's out there? Carlisle?
OMG, this would seriously be a nightmare for me. I love Rick and I do not want to be handing out "I told you so"s at the Pacers' expense. Detroit already got nearly F'd on a Rick deal, don't add Indy to the list.

But back to this, speaking of I told you, remember all the tank supporters who used Chicago at the model of how to do it, build with picks, etc? Remember others who used Skiles as the model of how to do it, to keep it tough, smart, whatever else was thought of him?

Down in flames. So much for that formula being the way to win. Was it worth all those years of losing just to get kinda okay again, fail to match expectations and then return to losing and firing the coach?

No thanks, I'll take Pacers .500 for the win, especially when every 4-5 years you go to the ECF. Heck, I'm a lot happier to be a Pacers fan right now than a Heat fan too, even with their title. And then there's the Cavs and a top stud pick and a Finals appearance, now being boo'd at home as well. Maybe Mike Brown is the next head to roll.

Then Mike can join Rick in Chicago and make me physically ill as the Bulls turn it around and knock of Detroit in a surprise comeback. :-o


In other words, there's a lot of ways to do it and none of them is right or certain, and ALL COACHES can struggle. Jay's fav (and mine) Jeff VG - fired, Aldeman not showing anything more. Skiles, gone. Larry Brown, flopped, made an *** of himself and gone. Mike Brown, the guy that "was smart enough to play Tinsley", struggling. Pat Riley, ready for another health retirement.

Trader Joe
12-24-2007, 02:16 PM
I wonder if Pippen or Jordan would ever coach....

Unclebuck
12-24-2007, 02:27 PM
Skiles is a great coach for a very short period of time. He wears thin, pretty quickly. Not surprised although the timing was a littl surprising. Appears the Bulls players stopped buying into what Skiles was trying to get them to do

Shade
12-24-2007, 02:29 PM
I feel bad for Skiles. Not only because I believe he's being made out to be the fall guy, but because axing him on Christmas Eve is pretty low class of Paxson.

My condolences, grace.

Shade
12-24-2007, 02:33 PM
Y'know, now that I think about it, wasn't Tim Floyd canned on X-Mas Eve as well?

Will Galen
12-24-2007, 02:45 PM
axing him on Christmas Eve is pretty low class of Paxson.



I look at it as an early Christmas present for Skiles. Now he's got the holidays off and then he can go somewhere he will be appreciated.

Hicks
12-24-2007, 02:51 PM
It's rough when you just think "Oh, it's Christmas Eve, how horrible." But the Bulls are in the middle of a season and if Paxon thought he needed to show Skiles the door, why wait? The only other choice was to either keep him longer than you want him, or to fire him on Christmas Day (they play another game on the 26th).

tdubb03
12-24-2007, 03:34 PM
Pretty honest self-analysis from Skiles;

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/cs-071224chicagobullsscottskilestalksaboutfiring,0,31 4547.story


"Hardly a day goes by that I don't demand accountability and stress results," Skiles said from his north suburban home. "Today was my day to be held accountable."
"The fact that it's Christmas Eve is neither here nor there," Skiles said. "The timing doesn't bother me."
"I just wish we could have figured things out this season. I won't look at my time here as failure. But the endgame is."

NapTonius Monk
12-24-2007, 04:27 PM
I wonder if Pippen or Jordan would ever coach....

Pippen...I'm not too sure about. But I seriously doubt Jordan would have the patience to coach. He'd be the chief victim of being a perfectionist. When his competetive juices get flowing, they're not easily controlled. Ask Kwame Brown how that went (although I don't think Kwame needed very much help to be a disappointment).

kester99
12-24-2007, 06:02 PM
If you've been watching headline news go around like I have a bit today, you will have seen a story with an SUV crashing into a TV station, the news anchor flinching on camera, etc.....My theory? Scott Skiles, on the tail end of the bender, wanting the camera to tell his side...."HEY! I'm Scott Skiles, da**it! Lemme in 'ere....burp. Oh man. Is this the parking lot?"

---------------

Just riffing a little. I have always likes Skiles.

NorCal_Pacerfan
12-24-2007, 06:31 PM
Well, I personally don't think anyone should be fired on Christmas Eve, but hey, call me old fashioned. Whether or not he cares (skiles), it's still another thing on the mind during a day that should be focused on family and giving. Ok so he got a pink slip, Merry christmas lol. Seriously though, that's a low blow, and one more game would've been the honorable thing to do. My 2 cents.

Anthem
12-24-2007, 07:12 PM
Well, I personally don't think anyone should be fired on Christmas Eve, but hey, call me old fashioned. Whether or not he cares (skiles), it's still another thing on the mind during a day that should be focused on family and giving. Ok so he got a pink slip, Merry christmas lol. Seriously though, that's a low blow, and one more game would've been the honorable thing to do. My 2 cents.
Dude's getting paid to spend the rest of the year (and next, IIRC) home with his family.

I'd take that.

Will Galen
12-24-2007, 07:19 PM
It was 20 years ago Monday when one of the most popular players -- Artis Gilmore -- in Bulls history was released on Christmas Eve because of then-NBA rules that forced teams to waive players Dec. 24 or pay them for a full season. The so-called guarantee date subsequently was moved into January.

The organization was overwhelmed with negative publicity and community condemnation for dumping Gilmore, which makes the Bulls organization perhaps the most sensitive to the personal aspect of the holiday season. -- Chicago Tribune (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/cs-071223bullschicago,1,4990268.story?coll=cs-home-headlines)




Yeah right! What do they say about history repeating itself?

NorCal_Pacerfan
12-24-2007, 07:35 PM
It was 20 years ago Monday when one of the most popular players -- Artis Gilmore -- in Bulls history was released on Christmas Eve because of then-NBA rules that forced teams to waive players Dec. 24 or pay them for a full season. The so-called guarantee date subsequently was moved into January.

The organization was overwhelmed with negative publicity and community condemnation for dumping Gilmore, which makes the Bulls organization perhaps the most sensitive to the personal aspect of the holiday season. -- Chicago Tribune (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/cs-071223bullschicago,1,4990268.story?coll=cs-home-headlines)

Yeah right! What do they say about history repeating itself?

Wow, interesting! I think most people see the firing of someone on Christmas Eve, (THE biggest holiday) to be negative. Way to go Pax!! Idiot.

Evan_The_Dude
12-24-2007, 07:53 PM
I'm not gonna lie, as much as I like Jim O'Brien, I sort of wish this would have happened a year ago and that Skiles was available this past off season.

Shade
12-24-2007, 08:15 PM
It was 20 years ago Monday when one of the most popular players -- Artis Gilmore -- in Bulls history was released on Christmas Eve because of then-NBA rules that forced teams to waive players Dec. 24 or pay them for a full season. The so-called guarantee date subsequently was moved into January.

The organization was overwhelmed with negative publicity and community condemnation for dumping Gilmore, which makes the Bulls organization perhaps the most sensitive to the personal aspect of the holiday season. -- Chicago Tribune (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/cs-071223bullschicago,1,4990268.story?coll=cs-home-headlines)




Yeah right! What do they say about history repeating itself?

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/marty_burns/12/24/skiles.reax/?eref=mostpop


But before calling Bulls GM John Paxson a Scrooge for firing his coach on Christmas Eve, let's cut him a little slack.

For one, it's a bit of a team tradition. The Bulls fired Tim Floyd on Christmas Eve several years ago.


The funny thing is, Paxson is the one who should be getting the axe if anyone. He's the one who vastly overpaid for a declining Ben Wallace, and he's the one who refused to debunk or confirm all of the trade rumors that led to the disarray that has taken over the Bulls' locker room.

BoomBaby31
12-24-2007, 08:46 PM
Does anyone see talks of Gordon, Deng, or Hinrich increasing?

If we get Hinrich, I'll shed a tear of joy.

Jose Slaughter
12-24-2007, 09:09 PM
Step 1: Chicago fires Skiles

Step 2: NY fires Isiah

Step 3: NY hires Skiles

Shade
12-24-2007, 09:49 PM
Step 1: Chicago fires Skiles

Step 2: NY fires Isiah

Step 3: NY hires Skiles

Step 4: NY still sucks

Young
12-24-2007, 11:04 PM
Skiles is a good coach. The Bulls have good players.

I think that he sort of lost the team. That's really what it comes down to.

I don't know who the Bulls get. I don't think that Jeff Van Gundy or even Rick Carlise are the right answers. Nor is Larry Brown. I think they are all similar because like Skiles they wear quickly on players.

I'm not for sure of his style but Jim Boylan seems like a good coach, one of the better assistants in the league. I remembe liking what I read about him as a possible Pacer coach.

I think that if they decide that Jim isn't the long term answer, i'm not for sure if they have announced if he is the interm or new offical head coach, I feel that Dwyane Casey would be a good choice. Still will never understand why the Timberwolves fired him. Same with Terry Porter I thought he was doing a respectable job with the Bucks before considering who they had before he was replaced by Terry Stotts.

No matter who the coach is the Bulls players better start playing as they are capable of. There is no good reason why that team should be below .500. I don't care if they could use a low post scorer they have plenty of talent to win.

rexnom
12-24-2007, 11:42 PM
Step 4: NY still sucks
Step 5: Profit?

grace
12-25-2007, 12:31 AM
My Pitch:

There's only one Wallace left on our team and Tayshaun is a nice guy.

I've never liked that Wallace and I'll never forgive Tayshaun for blocking Reggie's game winning shot. Besides, if Dale Davis couldn't make me a Piston's fan no one will (unless they hire Scott as their coach).


If we get Hinrich, I'll shed a tear of joy.

Have you seen him play lately? If you want someone with leadership he's certainly not your man. If you don't believe me ask the talking heads on Chicago Tribune Live.


Step 1: Chicago fires Skiles

Step 2: NY fires Isiah

Step 3: NY hires Skiles

I doubt Scott is going to take a job this year. No one in their right mind would want that job. If the Bulls players can't get along with Scott Stephon Marbury and Zach Randolph certainly won't.

Trader Joe
12-25-2007, 01:31 AM
I'm not gonna lie, as much as I like Jim O'Brien, I sort of wish this would have happened a year ago and that Skiles was available this past off season.

Man if this team collapsed under Carlisle they wouldn't have made it a day under Skiles. Talk about the anti-thesis of a player's coach.

Pax should be on the hot seat. This man did draft Tyrus Thomas AND Joakim Noah in back to back drafts while also spending 15 million over 4 years on a washed up Ben Wallace. Maybe he wants to see if the Bulls can average UNDER 80 points per game for a whole season.

RamBo_Lamar
12-25-2007, 03:59 AM
Scott Skiles out in Chicago?


"Meh"


:p

Rajah Brown
12-25-2007, 08:30 AM
Sam Smith has a pretty insightful piece in the Tribune this
a.m. Sounds like Skiles more or less wanted to be let go.

Mourning
12-25-2007, 10:20 AM
I feel bad for Skiles. Not only because I believe he's being made out to be the fall guy, but because axing him on Christmas Eve is pretty low class of Paxson.

My condolences, grace.

:amen:

Unclebuck
12-25-2007, 11:03 AM
I have always thought the Bulls talent level was very overrated.

They won games because they payed great defense, they played hard every game - almost always playing harder than their opponent. They were one of the very best coached teams in the NBA. Their talent level just wasn't all that good.

Here is a good column by Vecsey, I agee with him, Paxson's moves the past two season have not worked out and I believe this is another case in poin that trading for drft picks is a crapshoot at best.

http://www.nypost.com/php/pfriendly/print.php?url=http://www.nypost.com/seven/12252007/sports/heave_ho_ho_ho__
123200.htm

HEAVE HO-HO-HO!
By PETER VECSEY


December 25, 2007 -- The initial Christmas Eve plan was to shop for loved ones . . . provided I had any.
So, instead, I decided to stay home and wait for the jolly fat man who works one day more a year than Jerome James.

That's when I heard about coach Scott Skiles' holiday farewell from the Bulls.

My first thought was, count on James Doughland to seize this moment; look for him to lock up Isiah Thomas past his current 4-year commitment to blunt any attempt by a raiding party from the coach's home town team to pry away the Knicks' prized possession.

Interesting that Skiles is the scapegoat for the Bulls' sharp decline. That was my next notion. Not that I fail to understand that something significant had to be done, some distress button had to be pushed to shake the 9-16 team out of its swoon.

The Bulls didn't immediately announce a replacement for Skiles, who went 165-172 after replacing Bill Cartwright in 2003. General manager John Paxson said he does not expect to hire a coach until after the season, with assistants Pete Myers or Jim Boylan likely taking over on an interim basis. Myers will coach the team against the Spurs.

When preseason expectations rage rampant and your championship contending team is last in the Central and shrinking incredibly - as evidenced by the Bulls last two defeats, one in Boston, the other a 116-98 disgrace at home - someone consequential either has to come or go.

And because Paxson has been unable to execute the Bulls No. 1 priority - securing a low-post presence that can command double-team defensive coverage and complement a crowd of perimeter shooters - it was off with Skiles' head.

As usual in professional sports, especially when salary caps and guaranteed long-term contracts can't be easily consumed, the coach is considered extraneous. In the majority of circumstances, sharing the blame is well warranted, though, as far as Skiles is concerned, I'm not down with that.

A few weeks ago, an ESPN analyst accused Skiles of wearing thin on players because he screamed too much. If anything, I was informed at the time, it was the opposite, at least in a couple key cases.

For whatever reason, Skiles chose not to get into the faces of Ben Wallace or Ben Gordon for lack of production, effort, defense, shot selection, whatever. The ultra sensitive Wallace has a history in Detroit and Chicago of rebelling when told to do something he would prefer not to. Gordon's partiality is to start when clearly he's more prolific in a sixth man role.

Perhaps Skiles was concerned Wallace might go into a permanent funk or slowly recover from injuries if coached too hard. He also worried Gordon might bail on him if he took him out of the starting lineup.

Before the season, Gordon rejected a $50 million, 5-year extension, $25M below his asking price. In the mind of the rising restricted free agent, how could he hope to get an offer sheet in that range elsewhere or in Chicago coming off the bench?

Clearly, that financial hangover (Luol Deng turned down a similar deal) permeated the Bulls' performance from Jump Street. That and Kobe Bryant trade talk that spooked their jittery young core players, which tells us more than we would like to know about them. And Kirk Hinrich's dreadful inconsistency, a triple-double sandwiched by more or less 4-point, 2-assist outputs. And the lack of improvement by Tyrus Thomas and Thabo Sefolosha; their growth was vital to the team's success. And the retirement of P.J. Brown. And Malik Allen signing with the Nets for a 1-year minimum.

Of the core players, Andres Nocioni is the only one with nothing to be embarrassed about, and he was hurting at the beginning of the season.

These are some of the impediment Skiles faced. Oh, yeah, and then there were numerous personnel moves - some with the coach's blessing, no doubt, if not urging - by Paxson that had to be overcome.

Three years ago, the Bulls won 47 games with the above mentioned core, plus Eddy Curry and Tyson Chandler. Last season they won 49 games. In between Curry forced a trade to the Knicks that yielded Tim Thomas, the No. 2 of '06 and the No. 9 pick in '07; Chandler was dealt for P.J. and J.R. Smith, and Wallace was signed to $60M, four- year free-agent contract.

What do the Bulls have to show for that? Thomas was waived long after being sent home by Skiles. Smith was traded to the Nuggets for a pair of second rounders and Howard Eisley. The No. 2 pick was used to take LaMarcus Aldridge and sent him to Portland for Tyrus and Victor Khryapa. And last June's No. 9 selection got them Joakim Noah.

Don't look now but Aldridge is precisely the type of player the Bulls would love to have patrolling their paint . . . and they wouldn't have had to trade two of their top six for, say, Pau Gasol.

"Looks like we finally returned the Portland favor from 84!" a Bulls official laments.

Brandon Roy might have also helped from that '06 draft. No, nobody knew he was going to be All-Star good when the Timberwolves tabbed him and traded his rights to Portland for Randy Foye. But we all kinda knew Roy was 6-foot-6 and a smooth operator and Chicago's backcourt remains conspicuously undersized.

What's more, why delete Chandler and add Tyrus, an obvious long-term project, and the 6-foot-7 Wallace who had the benefit of the 6-foot-11 Rasheed Wallace playing alongside him when the Pistons won the title, when you're trying to compete for a championship in the present?

Looking back (which helps a bit, I admit), of all the moves Paxson made would anybody do any of them?

If Jerry Krause were in charge, Chicago's media would be skinning him alive . . . the old fashioned form of liposuction.

This concludes the Christmas spirit portion of today's missive.

peter.vecsey@nypost.com





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idioteque
12-25-2007, 01:04 PM
I would never, ever want Skiles here. Skiles is just RC on steroids, even less of a players coach. The players seem to like Obie even despite how much he demands from them and I think that's one of Obie's best qualities.

Between Skiles and Obie I'd take Obie any day. Obie has taken good, but not great teams pretty far into the playoffs, while Skiles has struggled with similarly talented teams.

Will Galen
12-25-2007, 02:13 PM
I have always thought the Bulls talent level was very overrated.

They won games because they payed great defense, they played hard every game - almost always playing harder than their opponent. They were one of the very best coached teams in the NBA. Their talent level just wasn't all that good.


I agree. I thought Skiles got them to play as good as they could. That strikes me as a problem with a good coach and young players in todays NBA. The players suddenly get the idea that they are worth $15m a year like Gordon. More than anything I think greed destroys good young teams.

As for Chicago, can a new coach get the team to play as hard as Skiles did?

Kofi
12-26-2007, 02:49 AM
I'd love to see Rick Carlisle get the job, but he's probably too similar to Skiles for John Paxson's and the teams liking. Pete Myers is the interim coach. I personally hope they continue to lose, not only to help us secure a playoff berth, but I still hold out hope that we can rob a desperate Bulls team of some of their young talent in a potential J.O. deal.

Robertmto
12-26-2007, 03:52 AM
It means that grace has League Pass for nothing. She also has an unused 2008 Chicago Bulls calender and a fashionable Bulls t-shirt (only worn about 4 times) for sale.

I suppose it's an over reaction to say that my Christmas is ruined, but it sure feels that way.

For those who are interested I'm still not a fan of the Pacers. :tongue:

Now I'm off to change my avatar. I don't blame Noah, but there is no f-ing way there's going to be a Bull in my avatar!

Hop on over to my bandwagon??

Rajah Brown
12-26-2007, 09:49 AM
Kofi-

I'm with ya. It's too bad Da Bulls are in our division and the EC as
they're easily the best match as far as doing a deal involving J.O.
He's exactly what they need and we could certainly use a few of
their youngsters. Though much as I like Gordon, the notion that
he's worth $15 mil per year is laughable. His agent needs to lay
off the wacky weed !

Hicks
12-26-2007, 12:24 PM
It's bizarre to me that they've given up on the season already. I say that because I was reading that the Bulls don't have any plans to hire a permanent head coach until the summer. They're going to ride with their assistant coach the rest of the year.

Now sure, there's a chance that works out (see Jim O'Brien following Pitino in Boston), but odds are this is the white flag for the Bulls' 2008 season. That's sad.

Kegboy
12-26-2007, 01:35 PM
That's sad.

It's pathetic. How would you feel if you were a season ticket holder? "Oop, we've had a bad start, so we're gonna fire the coach and give up." :rolleyes:

grace
12-26-2007, 01:45 PM
It's bizarre to me that they've given up on the season already. I say that because I was reading that the Bulls don't have any plans to hire a permanent head coach until the summer. They're going to ride with their assistant coach the rest of the year.

Last I heard they hadn't even decided who was going to be interim for the rest of the year. All they've said was that Pete Mitchell was going to coach the next game. I'm starting to think neither Pete or Jim Boylan want to coach those bunch of :censored:. Kegboy keeps saying that since Jim Paxson thinks it's so easy he should be the coach. If he coaches the way he runs the team they won't win 30 games this year.

Naptown_Seth
12-26-2007, 02:06 PM
With the Xmas thing it sounds like Paxson needs to be GM for Shinn in New Orleans, the king of all-time bad timing firings.

JayRedd
12-26-2007, 03:10 PM
I never liked Skiles anyway. Especially not for that team.

When you've got guys like Ben Wallace, Luol Deng and Kirk Hinrich as your clubhouse leaders, I really don't think you need an overbearing disciplinarian. Those guys are all pretty blue-collar, stand-up workers anyway.

I bet they turn the season around now, get to .500 by the All Star break and make a quality 2nd Round playoff push.

avoidingtheclowns
12-26-2007, 04:34 PM
It's bizarre to me that they've given up on the season already. I say that because I was reading that the Bulls don't have any plans to hire a permanent head coach until the summer. They're going to ride with their assistant coach the rest of the year.

Now sure, there's a chance that works out (see Jim O'Brien following Pitino in Boston), but odds are this is the white flag for the Bulls' 2008 season. That's sad.

remember though that boylan was sought after this summer - so it isn't as if the cupboard is bare on the bench. i don't think it is a white flag yet... they did this early enough to give the team a shot this season (as jayredd noted).

Will Galen
12-26-2007, 05:02 PM
It just occurred to me that one of the reasons Chicago splintered this season was the big contract Paxton gave Ben Wallace.

I think Deng and Gordon looked at what Wallace was making, and his production, and decided they should be making big bucks too. Gordon even said something early this season about Wallace's production this year when he was averaging more rebounds than Wallace.

I think you can give consensus super stars big contracts, but when you give one dimensional players like Wallace big contracts it hurts your team.

grace
12-26-2007, 07:35 PM
I never liked Skiles anyway. Especially not for that team.

When you've got guys like Ben Wallace, Luol Deng and Kirk Hinrich as your clubhouse leaders, I really don't think you need an overbearing disciplinarian. Those guys are all pretty blue-collar, stand-up workers anyway.

I bet they turn the season around now, get to .500 by the All Star break and make a quality 2nd Round playoff push.


First of all the team doesn't have a leader. Don't believe me? The one players only meeting they've had this year was called by Adrian Griffin. I have never seen that the big attraction is with Kirk Hinrich. Until a month ago I thought Luol Deng was untouchable. As of last week I was ready to trade him. Ben Wallace--watching his half *** play drives me insane.

My theory on where the Bulls went wrong: they let Ben start wearing the headband again.

grace
12-26-2007, 07:38 PM
It just occurred to me that one of the reasons Chicago splintered this season was the big contract Paxton gave Ben Wallace.

I think Deng and Gordon looked at what Wallace was making, and his production, and decided they should be making big bucks too. Gordon even said something early this season about Wallace's production this year when he was averaging more rebounds than Wallace.

I think you can give consensus super stars big contracts, but when you give one dimensional players like Wallace big contracts it hurts your team.

Here's an idea, if you don't like you contract play well and you'll get more money. They way Gordon and Deng are playing they don't deserve the contract they have now. If they're so weak minded that being pissed about Ben Wallace's big contract makes them play like :censored: they should go play in Europe.

Kegboy
12-26-2007, 07:55 PM
The way Deng and Gordon have played they won't get anywhere near what they're expecting.

Young
12-26-2007, 09:54 PM
Something I don't think anyone has posted is what Rick Bucker said the other day. He was saying that Paxson wanted to keep Skiles at least until the end of the season but it is the Bulls ownership who wanted to make the change at this time.

Also, I normally feel that it's bad to fire a coach during the season and a lot of times teams get rid of coaches to quickly and the GM deserves some blame but I don't think that is the case here. I think that John Paxson has done an outstanding job since he took over that team.

I don't think that not having a low post scorer is preventing the Bulls from winning because they won 49 games last year with this very same team. I don't think it is Ben Wallace making more money than Ben Gordon and Luol Deng that has prevented those two from meeting expectations because it wasn' the case last year.

Sure, I bet a low post scorer would help. And yes I think that Gordon and Deng are not happy to not get contract extensions however if anything I would think it would make these two play better.

I think that Skiles may have lost this team. Maybe there are some locker room problems between players. I just don't buy into John Paxson being the direct reason the Bulls are doing so poorly.

stew
12-27-2007, 01:12 AM
Also, I normally feel that it's bad to fire a coach during the season and a lot of times teams get rid of coaches to quickly and the GM deserves some blame but I don't think that is the case here. I think that John Paxson has done an outstanding job since he took over that team.


I am sorry, but what exactly have Paxon done that you can say he have done an outstanding job?

--overpaying for wallace
--trading aldridge for tyrus thomas, it is still too early to tell, but this move doesnt make any sense at all.. the team is looking for inside presence, and you just overpay for
wallace looking at a 4 year window, but then draft thomas (considered a project at the time)....

I think he totally blew it.... in my opinion, his only bright move is drafting deng and hiring skiles...

Young
12-27-2007, 02:26 PM
I am sorry, but what exactly have Paxon done that you can say he have done an outstanding job?

--overpaying for wallace
--trading aldridge for tyrus thomas, it is still too early to tell, but this move doesnt make any sense at all.. the team is looking for inside presence, and you just overpay for
wallace looking at a 4 year window, but then draft thomas (considered a project at the time)....

I think he totally blew it.... in my opinion, his only bright move is drafting deng and hiring skiles...

haha do you remember where this team was when Paxson took over? They were god awful and had no direction.

He has been great at drafting. Kirk Hinrich, Ben Gordon, Luol Deng, Tyrus Thomas none of them seem to be busts. Yes I think Aldrige seems to have been the better pick but TT still looks like he could be something. I defiantly wouldn't call TT a bad pick yet. And signing Andres Nocioni was a good move. Then he brought in a good coach.

Signing Ben Wallace, to that money was not a good move. However BW is a big man. So teams overpay for them. Ben Wallace was coming off back to back defensive player of the year honors and you are saying he blew it lol. At least John overpayed for a good player and not piece of crap.

What about all the money that Donnie has given out to guys? He has overpayed for some. I guess he blew it too.

John hasn't done a perfect job with the team but yes I consider it outstanding considering how that team was when he took over them. He will have them winning again soon. Maybe not this year as their coaching situation is messed up but Paxson will have the Bulls back in the thick of things next year.

Dr. Goldfoot
12-27-2007, 02:44 PM
I am sorry, but what exactly have Paxon done that you can say he have done an outstanding job?



*Drafted Kirk Hinrich
*Traded rights to 2nd rounder Matt Bonner for 2nd rounder Chris Duhon
*Hired Scott Skiles
*Drafted Ben Gordon
*Traded Jackson Vroman & a 1st rounder ( Nate Robinson) for Deng
*Signed free agent Nocioni
*Bought out Eddie Robinson
*Traded Curry, AD & right to swap picks for Tim Thomas, Michael Sweetney, Jermaine Jackson, '06 1st rounder(Aldridge), the swapped pick (Noah) & two 2nd rounders one has been used and one has yet to be used.

There have been some questionable trades and some that haven't stewed long enough to be determined.

Anthem
12-27-2007, 06:29 PM
Now sure, there's a chance that works out (see Jim O'Brien following Pitino in Boston), but odds are this is the white flag for the Bulls' 2008 season. That's sad.
It's pretty good for us, though.