PDA

View Full Version : Bball's take on Reggie and last night



Bball
05-31-2004, 12:26 PM
I had a post I wanted to make yesterday but due to the fact I went to the race and the timing involved it didn't happen. It was going to be a "Why We'll Win-Why We'll Lose" thread with counterpoint back and forth.

On of the subjects in the "Why We'll Lose" part was going to be Reggie Miller having a good game 4 and his history of late has been to follow good games with bad ones. As a matter of fact, this season his history has been to follow good games with several bad ones of varying degrees. So he was due for a bad game when we needed a good game from him.

So on that road I think I'll mention some things that probably need to be considered. I think we all know what Reggie has meant to this franchise but I am looking to the future now. These will be a bit disjointed but I am in a hurry right now.

Myself and a few other posters have mentioned that Reggie's good games would be fewer and farther between at this point in his career. I think that has proven true. We've reached a point where not only are the good games fewer and fewer but he is playing some stinkers.

Historically, Reggie Miller has had big games where he decided to disappear in the past. That is probably the one thing that has put some doubt into whether he's a sure-fire HOFer (that and the lack of an NBA title).

Another theme of a few (Hello FTC) has been that this group of Pacers will never be able to cut the umbilical cord until Reggie is gone. They will always be looking to Uncle Reg to bail them out... or (IMO) afraid of messing up the game themselves and worrying about Uncle Reg.

Is Reggie still the best shooting guard on this team? Is he getting legacy starts? Last year in Walsh's post mortem he talked of how this team wasn't put together well. We're pretty much the same core team as then. That makes me wonder about this:
Reggie's contract. Everyone talks about Reggie's loyalty to the franchise. Well, the franchise has been pretty loyal to Reggie as well. I think that you can find around 6 million reasons they were loyal to him this past season... and next season as well... and optionally for even another season. In the cold cruel world of business I doubt Reggie should've gotten that contract. I can't wholly fault the organization for giving it to him tho... especially if he or his agent made it clear he wanted that. OTOH, I can fault Reggie for not simply asking for the vet minimum. Of course that is assuming that management would then use the rest of that money to solidify this team with a solid scorer.

So, I'm not surprised that Reggie started last night... or even got more minutes than he likely deserved based on his play. I'm not surprised that he had a bad game when we needed him. Even Super Reg did that to us at times.... and Uncle Reg does it more and more. Perhaps this team's failure to address the SG spot with a vet FA was out of loyalty to Reggie... Why create a 'quarterback controversy'?.... Especially knowing Reg would get legacy starts. I'm not saying anyone has etched it in stone that Reggie must start... but I have to wonder who in the whole organization has the balls to even suggest limiting Reggie to coming off the bench? I think only Reggie has that power.

We need a scorer like Rip Hamilton who is showing up EVERY game. I have to wonder if Reggie wasn't so in love with the 3 ball if he couldn't have shown up for a few more games in his career... and especially now that the arms and legs have to be just a little bit less than desired.

Oh well... We have one interesting game Tuesday night.

Tayshaun's block of Reggie is looming bigger and bigger. Perhaps that was an omen... or a wakeup call to us all (management, team and fans)? ...We can no longer count on Reggie Miller to score our points....

-Bball

TheSauceMaster
05-31-2004, 01:09 PM
Great Post and I agree with you Bball

ChicagoJ
05-31-2004, 11:01 PM
bball,

That's a great post. I agree with at least 99% of it.

FireTheCoach
06-01-2004, 07:34 AM
quote: "Bball" -

Another theme of a few (Hello FTC) has been that this group of Pacers will never be able to cut the umbilical cord until Reggie is gone. They will always be looking to Uncle Reg to bail them out... or (IMO) afraid of messing up the game themselves and worrying about Uncle Reg.

Well, thats just ONE part of the problem... I've always thought anyway. I truly believe that they no longer look to Reggie to bail them out.... it's been said enough lately that when Reggies in the game it damn near looks like a 4 on 5 game and I think thats true more often than not.

Reggie should have been gone along with Jackson, Smits and Davis... I truly feel like he was finished as soon as game 6 vs the Lakers was over. I could see it in his eyes.

I ALWAYS said that he was a great shooter and he would STILL have big games and hit game winning shots, which he certainly HAS, but the price is being paid RIGHT NOW for the loyalty to Reggie the last 4 years.

All I really wanted was for the Pacers to have a young shooting guard to grow with this group of Pacers.... sure Freddy is looking promising, but he is still a couple years away from being an impact player.

IMHO, the future was put on hold due to loyalty to Reggie and thats not fair to the fans, it's not fair to me.


Last year in Walsh's post mortem he talked of how this team wasn't put together well.

Yep.... and I said that OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN A LOOOOOOOONG TIME BEFORE WALSH MADE THE STATEMENT DIDN'T I.


We need a scorer like Rip Hamilton who is showing up EVERY game.

AGREE 100%


Tayshaun's block of Reggie is looming bigger and bigger. Perhaps that was an omen... or a wakeup call to us all (management, team and fans)? ...We can no longer count on Reggie Miller to score our points....

Amen brother.

Unclebuck
06-01-2004, 10:00 AM
I don't think Reggie has been that bad, He played well in games #2 and #4, hit the game winning shot in game !

No doubt he is not as good as he once was. But he is still a very valuable member of the Pacers.

Bball you mention perhaps the pacers should have signed a vet shooting guard last summer. You did not name names, Voshun Lenard, Jimmy Jackson, Stephen Jackson are three that come to mind. But I don't think the pacers would have been better this season if they would have signed one of those 3 instead of Reggie. Reggie influence as a leader should not be underestimated

MSA2CF
06-01-2004, 10:05 AM
We need a scorer like Rip Hamilton who is showing up EVERY game.

I hope no one brings up Jalen Rose. :P

Bball
06-01-2004, 10:22 AM
I don't think Reggie has been that bad, He played well in games #2 and #4, hit the game winning shot in game !

No doubt he is not as good as he once was. But he is still a very valuable member of the Pacers.

Bball you mention perhaps the pacers should have signed a vet shooting guard last summer. You did not name names, Voshun Lenard, Jimmy Jackson, Stephen Jackson are three that come to mind. But I don't think the pacers would have been better this season if they would have signed one of those 3 instead of Reggie. Reggie influence as a leader should not be underestimated

I wasn't saying that Reggie should've been replaced entirely. I was saying someone should've been brought in even if they did threaten Reggie's starting or minutes. I was also saying Reggie himself would probably need to 'take one for the team' and make the call on coming off the bench because I don't think anyone in management/coaching would do it. And lastly, I was lamenting the amount of money the organization had to give Reggie. That wasn't a wise allocation of funds (IMO) and if Reggie truly wants a ring as goal #1 then taking that amount of money wasn't the smartest thing.....

....assuming the team would've used the savings to shore the team up....

-Bball