PDA

View Full Version : What Is Wrong With The Bulls Lately?



TheDon
11-25-2007, 10:57 AM
I've been following them lately and it is unreal they are night and day from last season to this one. I'm not to sure how many pacers fans care about the bulls but as a division opponent i've at least cared to see how they play and why they're losing so badly. last night deng and hinrich went 9-34 and lost to the knicks in a game where they made jamal crawford look like a defensive mastermind. Not only this but it really seems like Skiles has been trying to get Ben Wallace, Tyrus Thomas, Joakim Noah to take more jumpshots which is hilarious. Then you get articles where skiles openly criticized Tyrus Thomas' effort and owned up to his quotes but apologized later. I've been on a couple of their fan boards and it's pretty nasty all-around. there was a thread started by some bulls fans saying they'd trade deng hinrich and gordon for marcus williams and richard jefferson. Other threads want Skiles fired and some even think the only reason Hinrich is playing is because he's white and they're holding people like duhon back because he's black. There have actually even been chants at their home games for Kobe. Pacer fans have had a HELL of a lot more to get upset about in past seasons and I don't think we were ever that illogical.

Kegboy
11-25-2007, 12:05 PM
Pacer fans have had a HELL of a lot more to get upset about in past seasons and I don't think we were ever that illogical.

Oh, I don't know about that. Go read the trade board sometime.

Tom White
11-25-2007, 12:38 PM
The Bulls lost to the Knicks?

Kegboy, you better check on your sister, pronto!

grace
11-25-2007, 12:59 PM
Don, I think you meant Hinrich and Gordon. Deng did not play against the Knicks. He strained his back on the west coast trip. Last I heard maybe he might play today. Personally, I think it's a waste because I don't think we stand a chance in hell of beating the Raptors. Of course I didn't think we'd lose to the Knicks so that just shows you what I know.

As for message boards I don't know how anyone can take anything said on them the least bit seriously. There were people last year who said Skiles should be fired.

Some have said that Skiles has lost the team. I don't think so. If anyone is to blame for those panty waists having their little feelings hurt over trade rumors and not getting contract extentions its John Paxson.

If by chance they're stupid enough to fire Skiles I think they should hire Norm Van Lear to take his place. He'll kick their asses and make them play 48 minutes of intensity. (Since none of you watch the pre/post game shows on Comcast Chicago you have no idea what I'm talking about. If you do have a chance to watch the show you should. At this point it's a hell of a lot more entertaining than watching the Bulls play.)

Tom White, thanks for your concern. I'm none too happy with this ****ty start. The thing that really chaves my rear end is that if they don't get any better I spent all that money on League Pass for nothing.

CableKC
11-25-2007, 01:04 PM
IMHO....I think that the Bulls are too good of a team suck for too long. They may have had a slow start....but I still think that they will make it to the playoffs.

grace
11-25-2007, 01:15 PM
IMHO....I think that the Bulls are too good of a team suck for too long. They may have had a slow start....but I still think that they will make it to the playoffs.


I hope you're right. The trouble with this slow start is they're not a young team anymore so there's no excuse for the stupid mistakes they're making. I don't think the coaching staff knows how to fix what's wrong other than to slap some of the players upside the head and yell "Snap out of it and play you sissy!" Of course if those players are as mentally weak as I fear they are that will only make it worse.

Maybe I'll try being a Kings fan next. :kickcan:

Unclebuck
11-25-2007, 01:29 PM
This is my theory, but first I must admit I have only seen parts of a couple of their games, so it is just a theory.

The Bulls won the past couple of years because they played harder than their opponents - they outhustled, outworked, out-defended who ever they were playing. They also were extremely well coached. They didn't win on talent and they certainly didn't win on offensive talent.

So having said all that if they lose that edge, the motivation, the player coach relationship - if the players don't buy into Skiles system 100% - I mean even if they only drop to buying it lets say 90% - that will impact their play - because they cannot rely on talent.

So are they tuning out Skiles - not really sure, maybe a little,

So did the trade rumors effect some of the players - probably.

But my main point is their margin for error isn't as great as many teams because they aren't that talented they don't have that one great player to bail them out

ABADays
11-25-2007, 01:43 PM
They started out badly last year too. I wouldn't be very concerned if I was a Bulls fan.

Shade
11-25-2007, 02:20 PM
Unrelenting trade rumors + poor personal relations from TPTB FTL.

King Tuts Tomb
11-25-2007, 02:22 PM
I've watched a good amount of Bulls games this year and I see three problems:

1. No low post offense. If they're getting 15-25 point on baby hooks, turnaround jumpers and up and unders from Pau Gasol or Lamarcus Aldridge they're a championship contender.

2. Scott Skiles. First of all, he doesn't respect his players and treat them like adults. These aren't high school kids, they're millionaire professionals and need to be treated as such. You can criticize them and ride them hard, but you also need to treat them with respect. It's what Gregg Popovich and Phil Jackson do, it's why they're the best.

3. The young players haven't made the jump we all expected. Deng, Hinrich and Gordon haven't improved like I thought they would.

Shade
11-25-2007, 02:23 PM
As much as I hate Ben Wallace (and make no mistake, I HATE Ben Wallace), I would try to deal them JO for their #1 next season and Wallace's contract.

bellisimo
11-25-2007, 02:43 PM
As much as I hate Ben Wallace (and make no mistake, I HATE Ben Wallace), I would try to deal them JO for their #1 next season and Wallace's contract.

hell would need to freeze over before I would support a Pacers team with Wallace on it

*i just hope i wont ever have to eat my words later down the line*

Mourning
11-25-2007, 03:12 PM
ok... sorry Grace, but I'm hoping it continues, so we might actually have some JO rumours again from Sam Smith :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:.

Mourning
11-25-2007, 03:14 PM
hell would need to freeze over before I would support a Pacers team with Wallace on it

*i just hope i wont ever have to eat my words later down the line*

:amen:

TheDon
11-25-2007, 03:19 PM
Don, I think you meant Hinrich and Gordon.

yes I did thank you for catching that

sweabs
11-25-2007, 03:26 PM
They looked good in the first quarter against the Raptors today.

After that, it was back to sucking. Honestly, they're just very bad. The one thing that jumped out at me is how non-chalant they look on defense (compared to years past).

The talk about them needing a low post threat is absolutely true as well. Bosh didn't have to do a thing today on the defensive end.

On a side note, can teams stop letting Jamario Moon have big games against them. The Jamario Moon hype in Toronto is getting to epic proporitions, and I can't take it anymore. During today's broadcast he was compared to Scottie Pippen AND Julius Erving on separate occassions. Absolutely ridiculous.

Mourning
11-25-2007, 03:33 PM
Calderon though... love that player.

sweabs
11-25-2007, 03:41 PM
Calderon though... love that player.
Oh man, don't even get me started. He's unbelievable. The Raptors are so lucky to have the Ford/Calderon tandem. And the best part about it is that they push each other to be the best, and get along with one another. They have the best PG rotation in the league.

Calderon had something like 24 assists without a turnover in the past couple of games. He's a starting PG on most other teams. He is so smart with the ball.

bellisimo
11-25-2007, 04:19 PM
They looked good in the first quarter against the Raptors today.

After that, it was back to sucking. Honestly, they're just very bad. The one thing that jumped out at me is how non-chalant they look on defense (compared to years past).

The talk about them needing a low post threat is absolutely true as well. Bosh didn't have to do a thing today on the defensive end.

On a side note, can teams stop letting Jamario Moon have big games against them. The Jamario Moon hype in Toronto is getting to epic proporitions, and I can't take it anymore. During today's broadcast he was compared to Scottie Pippen AND Julius Erving on separate occassions. Absolutely ridiculous.

He is my big pick from the waiver wires in the fantasy league - I need him to put up big numbers :D

Oneal07
11-25-2007, 04:49 PM
hell would need to freeze over before I would support a Pacers team with Wallace on it

*i just hope i wont ever have to eat my words later down the line*

Yeah, he's the one of the main reasons why we're the way we are. I wouldn't even want Wallace on my team. We could get a cheaper wallace, who's more effective

JayRedd
11-25-2007, 07:09 PM
As much as I hate Ben Wallace (and make no mistake, I HATE Ben Wallace), I would try to deal them JO for their #1 next season and Wallace's contract.

JO at $21 million is WAY better than Wallace at $14 million. Unless Chicago's pick winds up being Top 10 (which I doubt), I wouldn't touch that deal.

stew
11-26-2007, 09:13 AM
They started out badly last year too. I wouldn't be very concerned if I was a Bulls fan.

If I am not mistaken, they have an easier schedule (dec-jan) last year... this year, they dont have that luxury... in my opinion, they are in deep trouble...

wintermute
11-26-2007, 09:55 AM
As much as I hate Ben Wallace (and make no mistake, I HATE Ben Wallace), I would try to deal them JO for their #1 next season and Wallace's contract.

only way that works for me is if we send big ben to a third team


Calderon though... love that player.

he's got to be one of the top free agent prospects next summer. seems like half the teams in the league could use a pg upgrade. toronto is close enough to the luxury tax that a big offer might keep them from matching. i'd say calderon should be able to get a 6 year $50m offer pretty easily - that's what mo williams got last summer.

RomanGabriel
11-26-2007, 11:47 AM
It's been a bizarre start to the season. Wallace, like JO, hasn't been healthy - bad ankle. Deng's got the bad back. Tyrus Thomas can jump through the roof, but Skiles was right about the fact that the next time he runs the floor will be the first. His physical gifts are off the charts, but his basketball IQ is off the charts in the other direction. What a stupid mistake trading LaMarcus Aldridge for him in the '06 draft. The biggest puzzle of all is Hinrich. What the hell happened to him I can't figure out. He's had a solid couple of years as a combo guard - he's not a true PG - but is playing horribly this year. Terrible shooting and silly mistakes of commission and omission. Joe Smith has probably been their most dependable player thus far.

Speculation around here is that the real problem is that the team has tuned out Skiles. Carlisle can empathize. If Skiles can get the team back, they'll still win 45-50 games. If not, look for a Sam Smith scenario to finally happen in real life! It's strange that chemistry is a problem on this team since they were thought to be among the very tightest of teams until the past couple weeks.

Shade
11-26-2007, 12:37 PM
JO at $21 million is WAY better than Wallace at $14 million. Unless Chicago's pick winds up being Top 10 (which I doubt), I wouldn't touch that deal.

It would be under the assumption that the pick was Top 5 or so.

grace
11-26-2007, 02:01 PM
Speculation around here is that the real problem is that the team has tuned out Skiles. Carlisle can empathize. If Skiles can get the team back, they'll still win 45-50 games. If not, look for a Sam Smith scenario to finally happen in real life! It's strange that chemistry is a problem on this team since they were thought to be among the very tightest of teams until the past couple weeks.


Last year I loved every player on that team. This year Ben Wallace's lazy passes are driving me nuts. My opinion of Hinrich has gone back to 2 years ago when I couldn't see why people thought he was so good. Gordon and Deng, while I love their game, appear to have gone soft in the head. That drives me more nuts than Ben Wallace. I don't know what the hell is up with Tyrus and Thabo. The first couple regular season games that Noah played in I wanted to ship him out. At least now I'm starting to see a little bit of improvement. The worst part is when the only good players on the team are Nocioni and Joe Smith what chance do they have? :kickcan:

Anthem
11-26-2007, 08:16 PM
hell would need to freeze over before I would support a Pacers team with Wallace on it

*i just hope i wont ever have to eat my words later down the line*
I absolutely agree.

grace
11-27-2007, 12:03 AM
I've decided to take some comfort in the fact that the Knicks beat the Jazz tonight. It doesn't make the Bulls any better, but maybe the Knicks aren't as bad as their record shows. :shrug:

As I sit here watching the Kings game I want to now what it would take to get Brad Miller back with the Bulls. Artest also looks good, but I'm not that stupid.