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Speed
07-07-2007, 09:52 AM
My preface is this, a team takes on its coaches personality and then the culture changes. This isnít a statement on Carliseís coaching ability, I think he may be one of the most knowledgeable guys in the game, listen to him on TV, heís excellent. Look at Phil Jackson, Iím not sure heís an Xs and Os coach or at least thatís not what he is best at, heís best at the culture or convincing people to buy into what he wants from them and smart enough to empathize or get into players heads. While Carlise is thinking of awesome inbound plays, Jackson</ST1:p thinks of books to give his players to make them understand the greater good of the team. Now, Obie is a different type coach, I think its all about aggression and attacking. Athletes easily buy into to aggression thatís why they are able to compete at the level they are at. Itís about bunker mentality, but in a manageable way.

I guess what Iím saying is my overall hope is that just by having Obie on board this team takes on his no BS, aggressive persona, or at least that is my opinion of him so far.<O:p</O:p
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Now with all this said I waiver literally moment to moment thinking this team is the bottom 5 worst teams and a team that could make it to the ECF (I know ridiculous). Hereís why (in a Bill Benneresque fashion):
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Optimist: The East is wide open, I truly believe <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comhttp://www.pacersdigest.com/apache2-default/ /><st1:City w:st=<ST1http://www.pacersdigest.com/apache2-default/ /><st1:City w:st=<ST1:place Detroit</ST1:place</st1:City> is on the down side of their pinnacle, all of those heavy minute years start to add up. <st1:City w:st="on"><ST1:pCleveland</st1:City> canít afford to put anyone around Lebron. The Bulls are missing a set offense go to guy thatís not launching a 3Ö I guess Iím saying all these teams have gaping holes.

Pessimist: The Pacers werenít a playoff team last year and almost every team around them has improved, Knicks, <st1:City w:st="on">Boston</st1:City>, <st1:City w:st="on"><ST1:pOrlando</ST1:p</st1:City>.

Optimist: D Granger, Ike, and Shawne Williams have high ceilings and even though its not a last couple of days acquisition they all could show big time improvement this year.

<O:pPessimist: They wonít improve unless given more of a chance/responsibility and as long as this is a team focused around a non franchise guy in JO, then they wonít.

Optimist: JO is one of literally a handful 20/10 guys and is no doubt the Pacers best player, maybe you donít look at it as building around him, as you would have with a heyday Shaq, but you build with him.

Pessimist: JO does not understand what to do to make others around him better or how to lead.<O:p</O:p
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Optimist: Its all about managing expectations, your best player doesnít have to be your leader, Reggie wasnít the leader, actively, on the successful 90s Pacers teams.<O:p</O:p
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Pessimist: The Pacers donít have a leader.<O:p</O:p
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Optimist: The Pacers do have a coach, who understands the psychology of it.<O:p</O:p
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Pessimist: The Pacers have a coach who wants to jack up a 3 after getting the ball past half court.<O:p</O:p
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Optimist: The culture will be to be aggressive and not always being a counter puncher and reacting to mismatches.<O:p</O:p
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Pessimist: The entire line up is a mismatch. Dunleavy is a 2/3, Marquis Daniels is a 2/1 who canít shoot, Ike is an undersized 4, Murphy is a defensive liability, Tinsley canít keep a guy in front of him, JO doesnít want to be Center.
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Optimist: Dunleavy is multidimensional at 6í9Ē who understands basketball, Daniels is and athletic shot creator who can play the point at 6í6Ē, Ike will be a 3<SUP>rd</SUP> year player who stats project out to nearly a double/double. Murphy is a 6í11Ē guy who can make a teams PF or C guard him 23 feet away from the basket, Tinsley can get anywhere on the court whenever he wants to, JO will play where ever you put him and has regardless of what he has said.
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Pessimist: Every team they play has exploited the weaknesses of those players.<O:p</O:p
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Optimist: If the team takes on Obies aggressive persona, they wontí be able to like they did when Carlise was fumbling for his clip board, they will be grabbing the ball out of the basket after a Kareem Rush 3.<O:p</O:p
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Pessimist: Kareem Rush is a guy who was kicked off a bad team.<O:p</O:p
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Optimist: Kareem Rush is a shooter on a team that lacks shooters, playing for a coach who wants you to shoot.<O:p</O:p
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Pessimist: Kareem Rush was a weak move in an off season where every other teams are improving by leaps and bounds.<O:p</O:p
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Optimist: The Pacers could have a fire sale, make a knee jerk move and solidify being a bad team for years, what if Bynum is only average?<O:p</O:p
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Pessimist: Or he could be he is a star. Better than the injury prone group of back up players on the roster now.<O:p</O:p
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Optimist: The injuries could be part of why they struggled last year and that other players had off years.<O:p</O:p
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Pessimist: They have injuries every year, why would it change.<O:p</O:p
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Optimist: That is why its good to have the depth they have.<O:p</O:p
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Anyway, I could go on and on and on. Feel free to post any ďboth sides of the coinĒ type additions. Itís really a struggle with the Pacers because I want the Optimism to be true because I want them to be good, but itís easy to fall into what could be the reality of things with the opposite.<O:p</O:p

Will Galen
07-07-2007, 09:58 AM
One of those guys is only right half the time, and the other is wrong half the time. :p:p

Peck
07-09-2007, 02:46 AM
I don't know, I like the way your pessimist thinks and I would like to subscribe to his newsletter.:D

Kstat
07-09-2007, 03:02 AM
have you paid Bball royalties for this yet?

Roferr
07-09-2007, 09:16 AM
I'm an optimist. Especially, when a new coach comes aboard. A team doesn't win without the magic word---chemistry.

I believe the three players mentioned Shawne, DG and Ike will be entirely different players under Obie (I guess we can settle on this as his new moniker, works for me). As was noted, they have tons of potential.

I regard Dun higher than most fans, it seems. I think that he can be a very valid starter, playing 35 mpg and at least 2 positions. If his shot comes around, which I firmly think it will, he is going to surprise a lot of people. I would put him close to being our second best player along with DG.

I also, believe that JO is very expendable. We've shown in the past that we play almost as well without him in the lineup. This leaves us in a very advantageous position. If we can win without JO (I don't believe he's ever going to lead us anywhere), just think what a couple of decent players obtained through trading him can add to our competitiveness. The LA deal sounds particularly appealing even if we don't obtain Odom. Kwame and Bynum should be enough to relegate Murph to the bench as about the 8th player, about where he should be.

Something that is a long shot would do wonders for our team, obtaining KG, who I think is much tougher than JO and plays his heart out night in and night out. With Obie's style of coaching, I think that he would excel much more than "softie" JO.

Every team in the East has bettered themselves (theoretically) whereas we have pretty well remained pat. However, if the Lakers deal goes through and Kareem (I believe he to be a candidate for MIP) plays to his potential, providing us with a reliable outside shooter, I like our chances.

Anyway, with a new coach, I'm chomping at the bit for the season to begin. Ahhhh, a brand new season with eternal hope permeating. We are not going to be the door step that most have predicted for us in the East. In fact, if certain things fall into place, we can be highly competitive and win 45-50 games.

Trader Joe
07-09-2007, 02:34 PM
Pessimist: We stink.

Optimist: ...Yeah I got nothing.

FlavaDave
07-09-2007, 02:51 PM
Are you getting kickbacks from the National Association for the Advancement of Stick-Out-The-Tongue Smileys or something?

PaceBalls
07-09-2007, 03:45 PM
Pessimist: The entire line up is a mismatch. Dunleavy is a 2/3, Marquis Daniels is a 2/1 who canít shoot, Ike is an undersized 4, Murphy is a defensive liability, Tinsley canít keep a guy in front of him, JO doesnít want to be Center.

Ack! this one made me cringe.

ChicagoJ
07-10-2007, 12:19 PM
have you paid Bball royalties for this yet?

Because Bball was a Bill Benner ripoff? The optimist/ pessimist still apears in Bill's columns occasionally...

Oneal07
07-10-2007, 01:08 PM
Can we please see how our players play with Coach O'brien before we jump to conclusion!!! We ran our Offense through Oneal because that's how Rick runs his offense.. .I'm sure Jermaine would love to play for Obrien, because he wouldn't have to carry all the offensive load, ALL THE TIME. . .getting easy baskets ARE a relief!!! About the Kareem Rush thing, people will always say bad things about someone, but I don't usually buy into that stuff,cause I wasn't there. . .I seen the guy play and he's talented, I could care less on an opinion especially if I've seen it for with my own eyes!!! He, Kareem would have to prove me wrong!!!