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TheDon
01-31-2007, 12:27 PM
A little excerpt from a recent question of the day on pacers.com on whether Armstrong should replace Tinsley in the starting lineup. Conrad put this little part in that shocked me.

"Rather than trying to turn Armstrong into something he's not say, for example, a 30-year-old we should accept and enjoy what he is. Armstrong brings joy to the floor, and he's having so much fun he's re-thinking his original plan to retire after this season. "

I'm not going to get my hopes up, but I want this guy on this team as long as he can be.

Jon Theodore
01-31-2007, 12:50 PM
It's obvious he should start, seeing our troubles of getting off too a good start. Even if he plays 5 minutes a game it should be the first five minutes. I think Tinsley could benefit from having a something to prove off the bench.

Will Galen
01-31-2007, 12:59 PM
I disagree with you guys. I don't want Armstrong to play until the 4th quarter, I want him to finish. (Unless Tins or Daniels is having a good game. In that case he can wait until the next game.)

If he starts he will be tired come playoff time.

CableKC
01-31-2007, 01:17 PM
As Conrad said...he is what he is....a 38 year old PG that can bring alot of energry to the floor....unfortunately, the reality is that he is neither a long term for our starting PG situation...nor is he is a solution for our backup PG situation.

But given our rather lackluster starts in the 1st QTR....although I don't think that he should start....I think that our lineup could benefit from giving Armstrong a decent # of minutes at the point during that stretch. But given his age....its unreasonable to expect him to keep playing 25+ minutes throughout the course of the game. Between the 2nd and 3rd QTRs, he could probably be used sparingly until the 4th QTR when he could get some decent minutes to provide the spark off the bench that we love to see.

That way...he can help us out when we most need him....during parts of the 1st QTR when we mostly slump...and in the 4th QTR...when we need him to help seal the deal. :shrug:

NuffSaid
01-31-2007, 01:35 PM
I don't think Army should start. He brings too much energy to the game at the most opportune moment - when things aren't going so well. We need that "energy fix", that moment of adrinaline. Armstrong's energy is the main reason this team hasn't fallen so deeply behind come the 2nd and succeeding quarters. He infuses life back into the team just when they need it most.

In that regard, he's our version of Lindsey Hunter. And how many of you hated to see this guy come into the game back when the Pacers/Pistons rivalry was hot!?! I know I cringed every time he came into the lineup because I just knew he wasn't going to let up his smoothering pressure defense. He always gave us problems. Now, with Army the shoe is on the other foot. :laugh:

Keep things as they are among the PG rotation. Tinsley starts; Army remains his backup. If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

ABADays
01-31-2007, 02:17 PM
I love the guy but I think he should finish as well.

Roferr
01-31-2007, 02:31 PM
Tins has proven himself to be a terrible closer in each quarter. He wants to take over and be the offense too much. I think Armstrong should be playing in the las 2-3 minutes of each quarter, thus preventing Tins from making some bone-headed plays trying to close things out.

Ragnar
01-31-2007, 02:43 PM
You guys see Armstrong out there feeding off of backup pg's and think he should start? Yes he is fun to watch and he brings a lot of energy but do you really think he could do that night in and night out as a starter? Not at this point in his career.

Armstrong is a HUGE upgrade over AJ but lets not get carried away DA's BEST year he averages 7 assists per game and that was with Doc Rivers letting him run the show with a lot less controll than Rick brings to the table.

Ragnar
01-31-2007, 02:44 PM
Tins has proven himself to be a terrible closer in each quarter. He wants to take over and be the offense too much. I think Armstrong should be playing in the las 2-3 minutes of each quarter, thus preventing Tins from making some bone-headed plays trying to close things out.

Is that why the celts felt they needed to quadruple team him last night?

Dr. Goldfoot
01-31-2007, 02:57 PM
Darrell Armstrong is old. The Pacers need someone to emerge as a backup point. Runi couldn't do it, Greene hasn't been able to and now the ball will be in McLeod's hands if/when he returns. Armstrong is a temporary fix. Rick, Donnie, Larry and Darrell all know this. He isn't going to start and he shouldn't even be needed to play. Unfortunately, we've had trouble with poor performances from our other backups and he's now forced to go out there and lay it all down. He's becoming less and less productive in just the 6 games since the trade and against the Celtics they were taking advantage of his tired legs. I haven't seen anyone blow by him all season and last night it happened repeatedly. I like Armstrong and all of the hustle, energy, leadership, attitude, personality, experience he brings but he's 38. He didn't come here to compete for the starting job. If for some reason (injury,trade) he is forced into starting any significant number of games this team is screwed.

Ragnar
01-31-2007, 03:08 PM
I do want to point out that I have not been this happy with our backup pg position since I first heard Sarunas was coming and I foolishly thought he was NBA ready.

We have never had a better backup pg than we do right now and that is something we should all be thrilled with.

ChicagoJ
01-31-2007, 03:57 PM
Darrell Armstrong is old. The Pacers need someone to emerge as a backup point. Runi couldn't do it, Greene hasn't been able to and now the ball will be in McLeod's hands if/when he returns. Armstrong is a temporary fix. Rick, Donnie, Larry and Darrell all know this. He isn't going to start and he shouldn't even be needed to play. Unfortunately, we've had trouble with poor performances from our other backups and he's now forced to go out there and lay it all down. He's becoming less and less productive in just the 6 games since the trade and against the Celtics they were taking advantage of his tired legs. I haven't seen anyone blow by him all season and last night it happened repeatedly. I like Armstrong and all of the hustle, energy, leadership, attitude, personality, experience he brings but he's 38. He didn't come here to compete for the starting job. If for some reason (injury,trade) he is forced into starting any significant number of games this team is screwed.

Wanted to highlight the following:

If DA was 31 years old, this could be different, but when McLeod gets healthy we need to see what he can do as a backup PG for about ten games or so. Even if he fizzles, DA will need to take a couple of weeks off if we still want him to contribute in the playoffs.

Remember Byron Scott's second season (full season) with the Pacers - he really faded toward the playoffs. I view DA the same way - he's probably good for about 50-60 R/S games before all the mileage begins to take its toll.

On nights where he doesn't bring extraordinary energy to the game, he's just not very good. He's way too much like Haywoode Workman for my taste, he relies entirely on his ability to out-hustle everyone else on the court.

As I said the other night -- where he was simultaneously terrific for getting us back into the Miami game and sending it to overtime but also guilty of making so many bad shots and other mistakes in the fourth quarter that its a shame we didn't win by ten in regulation -- he's still a mixed bad in terms of his overall impact.

indyman37
01-31-2007, 04:04 PM
A part of me doesn't want DA to retire because I think what he does on the court is great...but another part of me does want to see him retire. He has said he would like to be a coach. What I would love to see after this season, is DA becoming an assistant coach for the Pacers. I doubt he can become a head coach right away, so he could learn under Rick. Then if Rick gets moved into a front office position (part of his new title) DA could be a possible choice for the head coach.

Mourning
01-31-2007, 04:31 PM
Is that why the celts felt they needed to quadruple team him last night?

Ok, Tins had ONE good game and a few more this season ... I aggree with you that we shouldn't let DA start or play more then 20 minutes, but that doesn't mean I am happy with how Jamaal is playing overall this year (though he is playing atleast this year).

I know you and several others love Jamaal, that's totally ok, but let's not pretend like he is having a good year playing wise. I loved him in 2003-2004 and 2004-2005 not so much after that. Since he was asked to carry the load in 2004-2005 he hasn't given up, while he should have.

Part of that is Rick, but also definitely part of that is Tinsley, don't try to tell me his one-on-one "battles" with some of the premiere PG's at critical stages in the 3rd and especially the 4th quarter is what Rick is telling him to do not too mention some of those increadibly untimed shots, because I don't buy that. Shooting a bit more yes, but not the one-on-one's and some of the shots he takes. We need a decent alternative that could play 30 a night aswell when Jamaal is going in to streetmode again.

Sometimes he's brilliant, sometimes he's total crap. It used to be more brilliant then crap in my opinion, I think that has gradually shifted more to the other side. More then I personally like. Shame, he used to be my second favorite player not too long ago.

Regards,

Mourning :cool:

MagicRat
01-31-2007, 04:39 PM
http://chaos.able-towers.com/~magicrat/tinsley.mp3

Mourning
01-31-2007, 05:06 PM
Like Rick would say something bad about ANY of our players :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Besides, I already noted that one of the positive things on Tinsley this year is that he's been healthy.

shags
01-31-2007, 09:34 PM
Wanted to highlight the following:

If DA was 31 years old, this could be different, but when McLeod gets healthy we need to see what he can do as a backup PG for about ten games or so. Even if he fizzles, DA will need to take a couple of weeks off if we still want him to contribute in the playoffs.

Remember Byron Scott's second season (full season) with the Pacers - he really faded toward the playoffs. I view DA the same way - he's probably good for about 50-60 R/S games before all the mileage begins to take its toll.

On nights where he doesn't bring extraordinary energy to the game, he's just not very good. He's way too much like Haywoode Workman for my taste, he relies entirely on his ability to out-hustle everyone else on the court.

As I said the other night -- where he was simultaneously terrific for getting us back into the Miami game and sending it to overtime but also guilty of making so many bad shots and other mistakes in the fourth quarter that its a shame we didn't win by ten in regulation -- he's still a mixed bad in terms of his overall impact.

That is exactly what the Pistons have done with Lindsay Hunter the past 4 years. He's basically gotten a sizeable chunk (at least a month) of the season off, either due to injury or planned inactivity.

And that's what the Pacers need to do with Armstrong, IMO. He's too old to play the way he plays (similar to Hunter) to be fresh for the playoffs.

Naptown_Seth
02-01-2007, 12:57 PM
Yeah, I love Army closing out games, much like he finished off the Heat in the final seconds....whoops.


Reality check. Energy great, attitude great, busts of strong play, great. Terrible 3pt shots forced up, not so great. Gambling for steals that leave his man free to go to the lane on a regular basis, not so great. His overall passing ability, eh.

He's a very LIKEABLE player, but he's not bringing more talent than AJ did. Energy, yes, but not skill. Sometimes fans appear to mistake those 2 items and energy doesn't replace skill, it enhances it.

DA is the guy that can get a team losing interest or down because they fallen behind back to playing at their highest level. That's the best use for him IMO. But to view him as a starting PG solution is beyond crazy to me.

You think ANY other NBA team would pick up DA and make him their starting PG?

OakMoses
02-01-2007, 01:45 PM
I'd love to see Armstrong get about three 4-minute stretchs each game. Maybe he plays the first 4 minutes of each half and then the last 4 minutes of the game. That's only twelve minutes, that shouldn't wear him out too much and it would give us some energy at the most important times in the game.

MagicRat
02-03-2007, 01:13 AM
Like Rick would say something bad about ANY of our players :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Maybe you'll take Darrell Armstrong's word for it?.........:morning:

http://chaos.able-towers.com/~magicrat/daonjt.wmv

Anthem
02-03-2007, 03:42 PM
Maybe you'll take Darrell Armstrong's word for it?.........:morning:

http://chaos.able-towers.com/~magicrat/daonjt.wmv
Wow... DA says he's been encouraging Jamaal to look for his shot more. We've been wondering why JT seems to be more offensive than usual... maybe we were looking in the wrong place?