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View Full Version : Here is how to fix this.



Ragnar
05-12-2004, 10:48 PM
1) Cut AJ (ok I just had to say that)

2) Seriousley play Kenny

3) At least try Bender on Odom (however Cro did a decent job)

4) Take the handcuffs off of the ofense. I am sick and tired of seing them wast running oportunities because they were getting the call from Rick

5) More minutes for Tinsley

6) Less minutes for Al (I dont know what is wrong but he is playing very poorly and Cro or Jeff should get those minutes.)

7) More minutes for Bender. Get it though your head that he is inefective with AJ in the game and give him some minutes with a real pg.

8) Stop with the Zone they are killing us when in it.

9) Get Reggie going early. We cant win against Detroit if we cant get Reggie going.

10) Cut AJ from the team altogether.

zxc
05-12-2004, 10:51 PM
Really kind of funny that people think our backup point guard is the #1 problem with the team. Just seems kind of laughable. We got problems alot deeper then that it seems to me. #31 is the top dissapointment on my list. Plus Jones is playing like garbage as well we are getting zero production from the SG spot.

sweabs
05-12-2004, 10:53 PM
4) Take the handcuffs off of the ofense. I am sick and tired of seing them wast running oportunities because they were getting the call from Rick.

Isn't this what Pistons fans warned us about?

Suaveness
05-12-2004, 10:53 PM
Really kind of funny that people think our backup point guard is the #1 problem with the team. Just seems kind of laughable. We got problems alot deeper then that it seems to me. #31 is the top dissapointment on my list. Plus Jones is playing like garbage as well we are getting zero production from the SG spot.

Jones isn't playing like garbage, he hasn't even shot the ball! Hence the problem....and Al is shooting too much.

Ragnar
05-12-2004, 10:54 PM
I am not trying to say it is the only problem or even the worst problem. But he is by far and away the worst player that gets minutes. He might be better than Pollard but not by much. The amount of minutes that he gets are the thing I have a hard time with and that he is getting them over Kenny.

He has got to be -20 for this game and that is going to be the worst of the +/- of anyone.

I am also very worried abour Ricks insistence of calling every play and passing up running oportunities.

MagicRat
05-12-2004, 10:56 PM
4) Take the handcuffs off of the ofense. I am sick and tired of seing them wast running oportunities because they were getting the call from Rick.

Isn't this what Pistons fans warned us about?

Slick was on the coaching staff about not making "obvious" adjustments.

He wants to play Ron at the 2 and let him post up Wade......"Let's see how they like that!"......

pacerchic
05-12-2004, 11:03 PM
9) Get Reggie going early. We cant win against Detroit if we cant get Reggie going.

I think we'd better worry about getting past Miami first. They've got the swagger, and we look like we did last year in the playoffs, kinda like we're playing not to lose instead of playing to win. :disturbed:

I would've bet the farm on a victory tonight. I can't believe how we fell apart down the stretch. Where's the poise we had in 82 regular season games?? :unimpressed:

P.S. All the credit to Miami, they're playing great. We may discover they're the better team after all. :o

Shade
05-12-2004, 11:12 PM
1) Cut AJ (ok I just had to say that)

2) Seriousley play Kenny

3) At least try Bender on Odom (however Cro did a decent job)

4) Take the handcuffs off of the ofense. I am sick and tired of seing them wast running oportunities because they were getting the call from Rick

5) More minutes for Tinsley

6) Less minutes for Al (I dont know what is wrong but he is playing very poorly and Cro or Jeff should get those minutes.)

7) More minutes for Bender. Get it though your head that he is inefective with AJ in the game and give him some minutes with a real pg.

8) Stop with the Zone they are killing us when in it.

9) Get Reggie going early. We cant win against Detroit if we cant get Reggie going.

10) Cut AJ from the team altogether.

I agree on every single point. I advocated Bender on Odom well before this series began, and we have nothing to lose at this point. Just do it.

Unclebuck
05-12-2004, 11:38 PM
I agree on every single point. I advocated Bender on Odom well before this series began, and we have nothing to lose at this point. Just do it.


Nothing to lose What are we down 0-3 all of a sudden. We have a ton to lose.

Shade
05-12-2004, 11:46 PM
I agree on every single point. I advocated Bender on Odom well before this series began, and we have nothing to lose at this point. Just do it.


Nothing to lose What are we down 0-3 all of a sudden. We have a ton to lose.

Nobody else has been able to stop Odom, so we have nothing to lose in that matchup.

Millerartest
05-12-2004, 11:59 PM
Nice list. Can we add, Jermaine and the rest of the team taking care of rebounds?

Also, I didn't know Carlisle was trying to stop the Pacers from running. That is just plain foolish. That strategy never works. The Pacers can run with anyone with Tinsley in the game. When teams prevent fast break opportunities that are just doing themselves in. All teams need easy buckets. Come to think of it, the Pacers are only running after steals. The only time teams should be prevented from running is if it's to get the last shot of a quarter.

I didn't want to say anything about AJ in the other post because it was so negative. AJ has never been a baller. He's always been solid. Solid doesn't always cut it in the playoffs. Anderson is a baller, but now he's so rusty. But the guy is a veteran with serious playoff experience. A veteran veteran. Not a "I got backup minutes playing behind Jason Kidd" kind of veteran. It's not an insult to AJ to take him out. It's an insult to Anderson for not putting him in.

Just like the players need to up it, the coach needs to up it to. Croshere getting good minutes is a step in the right direction. He played Odom tough. And he didn't blow the clutch dunk like you-know-who blew the layup last game from nearly the same spot. Funny how Artest also blew a dunk this series.

I also like, get Reggie going early. Just standing around all game and not taking a shot is enough to do anybody in. Notice how with Artest and Oneal taking so many shots the rest of the team shoots terribly? People need touches. Shots. Ball movement. So I guess also add to the list, play as a team, move the ball as a team, realize that it's not individual superstars that make the Pacers so tough, but depth, extraordinary depth, and the only way to take advantage of depth is to hustle and hustle and hustle and run.

And if a guy can't stop his man from getting an offensive rebound after offensive rebound, I don't care what he finished in the MVP voting, try somebody else who can. Their strength is that they have been a team! Let the egos go!

sweabs
05-13-2004, 12:02 AM
Speaking of fastbreaks...what about that fastbreak in the first quarter I believe led by Tinsley where he basically stopped, held onto it for a while, waited for Miami to catch up, Artest misses the layup once, twice, and FORTUNATELY gets it to go the 3rd try...that one wasn't pretty!

kerosene
05-13-2004, 12:08 AM
2) Seriousley play Kenny


If Tinsley gets a suspension then we'll see lots of Kenny. I suppose that means lots more of AJ too though ;)

TheSauceMaster
05-13-2004, 12:11 AM
AJ was -11 for this game in Plus Minus , but no pacer was + ethier

Ron Artest -5
Austin Croshere -8
Jeff Foster -4
AL HArringtin -2
Anthony Johnson -11
Fred Jones -8
Reggie Miller -6
Jermaine O'Neal -11
Jamaal Tinsley -1

beast23
05-13-2004, 01:49 AM
Oh my god.

The sky is falling!!! The sky is falling!!!

Are we a bunch of fair-weather fans or what?

We've lost two games in a row on the road to a team that has now won 17 straight home games. You could say that Miami did what they had to do to stay in this series. Not what I expected to happen, but not absolutely far fetched, either. I fully expected to win one out of two, and possibly to sweep. Most experts picked the Pacers in 4 or 5.

But come on folks, we still have home court advantage. And the last time I checked, Miami sucks on the road. And remember, we've yet to lose three games in a row this season.

And as far as "cut AJ altogether" that is the most ridiculous statement that I've heard. Ragnar, you've been busting AJ's nuts since the early in the season. He's not what is wrong with this team! And quite frankly, although he does not direct the offense nearly as well as Tinsley, he does what you expect your backup PG to do. He holds his own within the offense, even provides a few points, some outside shooting, and does a very credible job on defense.

I haven't heard you bust Tinsley's nuts about defense. And even you would have to agree that AJ plays much better defense than Tinsley.

The thing is that AJ is a decent backup with experience at a cheap price. And we have him for one more year, so get used to it.

It should be very obvious that there is no way in hell that Kenny will re-sign with this team for next season. And I would agree with you that it is Carlisle's fault that he won't. It might have been nice to have him on the roster again. Having all three guys back next season would have allowed us to totally focus on SG and the center position this summer.

But at any rate, try to focus on what this team's problem is right now.... and that has nothing to do with the offensive end of the floor. OUR PROBLEM IS DEFENSE. And with regard to that AJ does a better job than either Tinsley or Kenny. So what next? Do we "cut Tinsley and Kenny altogether"?

Put your hatred of certain players aside and FOCUS on the problem!

Artestaholic
05-13-2004, 02:54 AM
We're still gonna win the series, so really these 2 losses were no more than a learning experience for the Pacers. A couple of other positives are the fact that now non-Miami non-Indy fans may be interested in this series and if we would have swept the Heat we would have had another long lay off. We'll win in 6 and Nets/Pistons will win go to 7 so we'll have have a perfect amount of time off to rest a little yet not get rusty while the winner of the other semi will be worn out and easy to beat like a crippled child. :P

able
05-13-2004, 06:17 AM
Sorry, but i do not buy into the "AJ is better on defense" crap.

To make a long story short: he isn't.

Tins outhustles him, outrebounds him, out steals him, is faster, cuts through screens better, want more ?

It is not the point that our starting PG is better, the point is that some of us thinks that Kenny is better at holding the ship in the water while Tins gets a breather, which is all a PG needs to do.

He runs the offense simply better then AJ and fluency is important, once the offense gets stagnant (AJ) then it is hard and takes time to get it going again.

But we can shout all we want, its Ricks' decision and guess what?

yeah thought so to :D

birdman
05-13-2004, 08:19 AM
It seems like when AJ is in the offense never gets going. I get so frustrated when he is in for a long amout of time and Tinsley is sitting on the bench. I also thought Cro did a good job on guarding Odom, but we should give Bender a shot. The bench has to get it going though. When only two players on your team are scoring it is kind of hard to win.

ChicagoJ
05-13-2004, 11:26 AM
Beast,

I don't think AJ is any better than Jamaal against the quicker PGs. I do think he's better than Kenny against the quicker PGs.

zxc,

Said another way, the problem Ragnar keeps hitting us in the head with a sledgehammer about isn't the backup PG per se; its that the backup PG is playing waayyyyy too many minutes for a second-round-road-playoff game. The answer isn't really a different backup PG, its to play Tinsley closer to 42 mpg.

Sauveness,

I've said a few times that your boy Freddie is critical to this series. But he's got to be aggressive - especially if Reggie isn't. He's had an opportunity, just by being aggressive, to take minutes away from Reg the last two games. He didn't capitalize. We've kept Eddie Jones somewhat in check for the series; but during both games in Miami we really got killed at the SG position.

Suaveness
05-13-2004, 01:03 PM
I've said a few times that your boy Freddie is critical to this series. But he's got to be aggressive - especially if Reggie isn't. He's had an opportunity, just by being aggressive, to take minutes away from Reg the last two games. He didn't capitalize. We've kept Eddie Jones somewhat in check for the series; but during both games in Miami we really got killed at the SG position.

It is a REAL pity that both of our shooting guards are both not willing to shoot the ball. I agree, Freddie really does need to be more aggressive. Not just with shooting the ball, but with penetration. But for some reason, like Reg, he just keeps deferring the ball to others. Fred is shooting real well, and he needs to shoot.

ChicagoJ
05-13-2004, 03:09 PM
I've said a few times that your boy Freddie is critical to this series. But he's got to be aggressive - especially if Reggie isn't. He's had an opportunity, just by being aggressive, to take minutes away from Reg the last two games. He didn't capitalize. We've kept Eddie Jones somewhat in check for the series; but during both games in Miami we really got killed at the SG position.

It is a REAL pity that both of our shooting guards are both not willing to shoot the ball. I agree, Freddie really does need to be more aggressive. Not just with shooting the ball, but with penetration. But for some reason, like Reg, he just keeps deferring the ball to others. Fred is shooting real well, and he needs to shoot.

For the record, when I say Freddie should be more aggressive, I mean attacking the basket. He's shooting an okay % but his shot still reminds me of Vern Fleming's knuckleball shot. So I'm not really ready to give him a green light to stand out there and jack up a (three point) shot just because he's open.

But he can't just play "hot potato" and pass the ball as soon as he catches it.

Ragnar
05-13-2004, 03:42 PM
zxc,

Said another way, the problem Ragnar keeps hitting us in the head with a sledgehammer about isn't the backup PG per se; its that the backup PG is playing waayyyyy too many minutes for a second-round-road-playoff game. The answer isn't really a different backup PG, its to play Tinsley closer to 42 mpg.


Thank you Jay thats exactly what I am saying. When I say cut AJ I dont mean because of AJ per say. What I mean is becuase Rick keeps playing him for way too long.

For example in the last game had Rick taken him out when things started to go horribly wrong like he did with the rest of the bench then we might have been able to end the run they were on. As is was it got worse. It seems that he does not understand that the problem was not with Cro and Bender it was with AJ. If it were Cro and Bender than the problem would have been fixed by taking them out.

Tinsley is 4th in minutes Reggie is getting more minutes than Tinsley right now thats absurd. Reggie and Jamaal are the highest Pacers in plus minus. Reggie is getting older now and cant be expected to play heavy minutes but Jamaal is very young. There is no reason he should only get 32 minutes in a road game.

Graywolf_59
05-13-2004, 04:28 PM
After the last 2 ****-Poooorrrr showing's from the Pacer's down in South Beach......I think they were taking the Heat as a roll over and die team.I HOPE they have woke up and know------the Miami Heat are for real.We need to play like every game is game 7 of the series.......because this time next week-(If we don't play like a Team)-----It (Might)be game 7! When 2 player's carry your whole load of scoring-----(Trouble)....Getting out rebounded by a smaller team is (Trouble)....!Coach just need's to turn's these guy's loose........and let them play like did thru the whole regular season!Maybe I'm blowing **** up a tube.......But let these guy's cut it loose and RUNNNNN like they can!http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/Graywolf59/Game4Stats.jpg