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View Full Version : Shocked how many of you are blaming J.O.



Unclebuck
05-11-2004, 12:16 AM
I have read most of the posts since the game ended and I must say I am shocked that so many of you are blaming J.O.

He did score 29 points

He was 8 for 8 at the free throw line in the 4th quarter

He did have 4 blocked shots.

I thought this was J.O's best game of the series.

The "best" post I read is someone is denegrading J.O because most of his points came on dunks and layups because of Tinsley's great passing. Yes Tinsley did a nice job getting J.O the ball, but how is that a negative toward J.O.

TheSauceMaster
05-11-2004, 12:18 AM
well I don't blame JO or Tinsley they are the only 2 that showed up for tonight's game IMHO

able
05-11-2004, 12:22 AM
I have read most of the posts since the game ended and I must say I am shocked that so many of you are blaming J.O.

He did score 29 points

He was 8 for 8 at the free throw line in the 4th quarter

He did have 4 blocked shots.

I thought this was J.O's best game of the series.

The "best" post I read is someone is denegrading J.O because most of his points came on dunks and layups because of Tinsley's great passing. Yes Tinsley did a nice job getting J.O the ball, but how is that a negative toward J.O.

I just posted similar thoughts in another post, so wont repeat here but you are 100% right.

Reg has 1 good game and everyone is shouting "give the ball to Reg" while HE says he passed up the (low percentage) shots for better opportunities.

There were others not showing, read what i posted including some numbers.

Unclebuck
05-11-2004, 12:24 AM
The post I "liked", someone was caomplaing that J.O was not showing enough passion, and the next sentence they said he is yelling at the refs too much. Isn't that passion.

Southside_Pacer
05-11-2004, 12:26 AM
The post I "liked", someone was caomplaing that J.O was not showing enough passion, and the next sentence they said he is yelling at the refs too much. Isn't that passion.

Negative passion is not a good thing to have all the time....

I wouldn't say yelling at refs is passion, that's just being pissed off. Passion would be calling a huddle to get your teammates over, showing some emotion in a timeout, diving after a loose ball, stuff like that.

sixthman
05-11-2004, 12:29 AM
I thought JO came to play tonight from the git go.

He might as well get used to all the banging in the post. Because in the next series, the opponent's interior defense is going to be bigger and better.

Bball
05-11-2004, 12:50 AM
We shouldn't blame JO. We have other weapons.
When the playoffs get here Pollard will be very valuable.... :idea:

:devil:
Bball

Hoop
05-11-2004, 01:33 AM
When the playoffs get here Pollard will be very valuable.... :idea:

:devil:
Bball

Now that's just plain mean. :devil: :D

waterjater
05-11-2004, 03:31 AM
JO needs to lead his team to victory late in the 4th Qtr, not assist in the loss. He missed shots late, turned the ball over and we needed another miracle 3 by Miller to even have a chance at a miracle win.

He opened the game missing just about every shot and free throw he attempted when we should've taken a 12-2 lead.

JO wants to be recognized as an MVP, then he needs to play huge in the playoffs. See Garnett tonight...tough D, 30 pts, 15 boards and the game winning shot!

I want to see JO step up and make the big plays!! Its his time to shine!!


Water

able
05-11-2004, 04:43 AM
JO needs to lead his team to victory late in the 4th Qtr, not assist in the loss. He missed shots late, turned the ball over and we needed another miracle 3 by Miller to even have a chance at a miracle win.

He opened the game missing just about every shot and free throw he attempted when we should've taken a 12-2 lead.

JO wants to be recognized as an MVP, then he needs to play huge in the playoffs. See Garnett tonight...tough D, 30 pts, 15 boards and the game winning shot!

I want to see JO step up and make the big plays!! Its his time to shine!!


Water

?? tying point in the 4th Q, go ahead point in the 4th , and again go ahead point in the 4th:

All made by JO

first miss after go ahead: Al, second; Al
first mis after second go ahead; Al, then Ron.

Get a grip. JO played a good second half, if you expect him to do it all alone, why bother bringing the other players.

You can only lead those that want to follow, not those that want to shine, or think they are already there.

Millerartest
05-11-2004, 05:30 AM
I don't care how many shots JO makes when he misses his last two, including a wide open jumper, and inexplicably drops a great pass from Reggie in the final three minutes.

JO needs to make his shots in the final minutes consistenly in a close game. He hasn't. Reggie has done that many times. Reggie also often gets three, whereas Jermaine often gets two. Pacers should be running screens for Reggie every time down. Jermaine should be the second option. When the Pacers are tossing it to Reggie, why not run the screen first. And then cut when JO has the ball. It's called team basketball.

No lack of effort. Lack of execution from a young team. And from a young coach that keeps running plays for his youngsters.

able
05-11-2004, 06:05 AM
I don't care how many shots JO makes when he misses his last two, including a wide open jumper, and inexplicably drops a great pass from Reggie in the final three minutes.

JO needs to make his shots in the final minutes consistenly in a close game. He hasn't. Reggie has done that many times. Reggie also often gets three, whereas Jermaine often gets two. Pacers should be running screens for Reggie every time down. Jermaine should be the second option. When the Pacers are tossing it to Reggie, why not run the screen first. And then cut when JO has the ball. It's called team basketball.

No lack of effort. Lack of execution from a young team. And from a young coach that keeps running plays for his youngsters.

I agree he "could" have been perfect down the stretch, after all Reggie never faltered in all those years.

Your last sentence though makes real sense, Rick calls to many games and it looks like we are reaching another stage where the players do not really agree with it.

TheSauceMaster
05-11-2004, 07:49 AM
sorry if you wanna beat someone down for a loss , why not ron artest ? his less than stellar performance was a big key to our loss , same goes for AL ;)

Game 3 was Jo's best performance of the series and I see some care to brow beat him for his effort , like I said the only 2 pacers that came to play game 3 was JO and TInsley , if one more pacer could have stepped up his performace we would have won.

Will Jo have to score 40-50 next game just to be in good graces with some ?After all JO is one man , he can't carry the full load like some of you expect , some others have to help and with the exception of Jamal tinsley JO scored double of what all the other pacer players scored and yet it's still not enough for some.

JO did his part , where where the others is the real question ? :rolleyes:

wintermute
05-11-2004, 08:25 AM
i'm pretty surprised too. i guess reggie's throwback performance got people wishing for the old reggie again.

the thing is, reggie can't carry the team anymore. not all the time. that's jermaine's job now. and he did what a franchise player should, which is to take the shots that he should have been taking all series long.

really, counting on the guards for our offense doesn't make sense for our team. jermaine and ron on the low post are our best weapons. against any team. everyone else is a complementary piece.

think of it this way - better in the long run to waste a game getting jermaine back into his groove. lord knows we'll need him at his best against detroit.

fwpacerfan
05-11-2004, 08:36 AM
JO wasn't the reason for this loss. I don't think he played well in stretches but I do like that he finally made agressive moves TOWARD the basket. He is unstoppable when he's in the paint, but he has a tendency to drift from the basket and settle for jumpers. The whole team played like crap, imho. They didn't seem like they wanted this one. They were outhustled, outwitted and outlasted (Oh sorry this isn't survivor) by Miami. The Miami bench outscored the Pacers bench. The Pacers were outrebounded. The Pacers only shot 38% from the field and 65% from the charity stripe. Malik Allen killed them. Al Harrington played terribly. Foster looked hurt. Artest had a bad game, which means he'll have a great one in game 5. Reggie took 2 shots. Wade and Odom killed the Pacers. The Pacers defense wasn't very good. Etc., etc., etc.

In a weird kind of way, I'm glad this happened now. This team needed to be tested sometime before the conference finals. Winning every game in the playoffs by double digits and having a young team could be a bad combination. I think there might be a tendency for them to think they can take a night off and still win but, I don't think they believe that any more. I'm not very pleased with the effort the Pacers gave but I think they will win the next 2. Miami played about the best game they can and the Pacers played about as poorly as they can and it was still only a 7 point victory for Miami. The Pacers need to come out in game 5 angry and hungry, if they don't then I'll be concerned.

indygeezer
05-11-2004, 08:42 AM
We got killed on the boards...again. Guess which PF/SF played 28 minutes and gathered a total of 3 rebounds. Al totally sucked last night. Totally.

Unclebuck
05-11-2004, 09:03 AM
The post I "liked", someone was caomplaing that J.O was not showing enough passion, and the next sentence they said he is yelling at the refs too much. Isn't that passion.

Negative passion is not a good thing to have all the time....

I wouldn't say yelling at refs is passion, that's just being pissed off. Passion would be calling a huddle to get your teammates over, showing some emotion in a timeout, diving after a loose ball, stuff like that.


OK, I can agree with you there, but let me ask, how do you have any idea what J.O. did during timeouts, or whether he called the team over for a huddle. I saw him going after loose balls, I would have to watch the game again, to see

naptownmenace
05-11-2004, 09:07 AM
We got killed on the boards...again. Guess which PF/SF played 28 minutes and gathered a total of 3 rebounds. Al totally sucked last night. Totally.

Plus he missed 2 free throws in the 4th. He could've played much better defense as well.

Reggie was non-existent in this game and he passed up several shots that he should've taken down the stretch. He seemed scared to shoot at times.

Overall the Pacers didn't deserve to win. When you miss 12 free throws, in a close game, you deserve to lose.

TheSauceMaster
05-11-2004, 09:11 AM
Reggie was non-existent in this game and he passed up several shots that he should've taken down the stretch. He seemed scared to shoot at times.

Thank You I am glad someone else seen this , I seen Reggie pass up alot of good shots also , shots that the old reggie miller would have shot without hesitation and not just in game 3 , I seen some in games 1 and 2 also.

naptownmenace
05-11-2004, 09:26 AM
Reggie was non-existent in this game and he passed up several shots that he should've taken down the stretch. He seemed scared to shoot at times.

Thank You I am glad someone else seen this , I seen Reggie pass up alot of good shots also , shots that the old reggie miller would have shot without hesitation and not just in game 3 , I seen some in games 1 and 2 also.

Yeah, even my wife (whom isn't the most astute basketball person) made a comment about it last night. It seems that if the play isn't designed for him, he's unwilling to shoot. He needs to remember that he's Reggie "Freaking" Miller and that this is the playoffs. If he has a good look, he has to take it.

fwpacerfan
05-11-2004, 09:42 AM
Reggie was non-existent in this game and he passed up several shots that he should've taken down the stretch. He seemed scared to shoot at times.

Thank You I am glad someone else seen this , I seen Reggie pass up alot of good shots also , shots that the old reggie miller would have shot without hesitation and not just in game 3 , I seen some in games 1 and 2 also.

Yeah, even my wife (whom isn't the most astute basketball person) made a comment about it last night. It seems that if the play isn't designed for him, he's unwilling to shoot. He needs to remember that he's Reggie "Freaking" Miller and that this is the playoffs. If he has a good look, he has to take it.

It seems to me that Reggie's age keeps him from being 'the man' for 2 games in a row. On Saturday Reggie looked like a young Reggie. Last night he looked like an old Reggie, he just didn't have that little extra 'umph' that he has when he's feeling it. I attribute that to age and maybe to a lesser extent what the coaches wanted to happen. They may have wanted the ball to go through someone on the post every posession, so Reggie didn't want to deviate from that. I think we'll see a much better game out of Reggie on Wednesday.

ChicagoJ
05-11-2004, 09:50 AM
Just got online... I guess I haven't seen all the garbage yet...

Yes, JO missed some shots he would normally hit, but I thought JO was otherwise stellar last night.

OTOH. From a 72-72 tie with about five minutes to play:

Ron took consecutive horrible shots. Although the three-pointer from the top may have been to beat the shotclock but the God-awful runner in the lane was very early in the shotclock. Then we got selfish for a while.

Jamaal had a turnover or two.

Reggie passed up some good looks.

Al and Jeff was generally uneffective.

And all of that wouldn't have mattered if we could have made some stops at the defensive end.

Folks, we win as a team and we lose as a team. Everybody contributed. But to single out the blame for our best player, who was the only one offering consistent effort, and he did put up 30 points and fixed his FT shooting in the second half...

:crazy:

I also thought our bench, with the exception (Sauveness is going to fall off his chair) of Freddie Jones got way to many mintues for a second-round road playoff game. AJ and Bender in particular got too many minutes but I would have preferred Reggie to get benched after he passed up the open three with about three minutes to play. If he's not going to bring clutch shooting, we need Freddies' D against Jones and Wade.

There was also a sequence in the third quarter that was pretty physical, and I said to Jay's_Wife@Section222 that, "Rick should take a 'T' here." We could've used the momentum boost because I thought that if we could solidly re-capture the lead that Miami might crumble.

I'm afraid to go and read the rest of the threads.

indygeezer
05-11-2004, 11:11 AM
As for Reggie passing up shots, I felt from the start that we were making a concious effort to push the ball inside. It seemed that nothing was to be taken from outside and that the coaches had decided to game-plan this. Force the ball inside and use our inside stength to overcome them. It seemed to me we never wavered from this game plan, it just didn't work.

Suaveness
05-11-2004, 02:33 PM
You see, the problem that concerns me with JO, is that he isn't hitting his jumpers, and the turnarounds, and the hooks, and the non dunks. Yes, dunks are ALWAYS good. But he also needs to be able to hit those other shots, which he HAS been doing. But all of a sudden, they aren't falling in. That is what worried me. I do believe he can correct it.

naptownmenace
05-11-2004, 03:03 PM
You see, the problem that concerns me with JO, is that he isn't hitting his jumpers, and the turnarounds, and the hooks, and the non dunks. Yes, dunks are ALWAYS good. But he also needs to be able to hit those other shots, which he HAS been doing. But all of a sudden, they aren't falling in. That is what worried me. I do believe he can correct it.

He seemed to be getting some of that back in the second half last night. He was right on target on a couple of missed shots but they rimmed out. JO is definitely a rythm shooter and he's slowly working his way back into rhythm.

Still, if everyone had made their free throws we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

waxman
05-11-2004, 03:09 PM
JO needs to use the glass more.... it would help his FG%.

waterjater
05-11-2004, 07:01 PM
I'm not completely dissing JO, BUT it is time for him to step up and make the BIG plays down the stretch.

He made all of his ball movement dunks which is awesome and yes he played much better. But he started the game poorly and set the tone for an off night. He missed nearly all shots that weren't dunks.

PLUS He should be getting 15 plus rebounds against this team and HE ADMITTED HE's not doing it on the glass.

Agree Artest was a problem last night as well. He's gone back to his selfish one on one crap which doesn't put any pressure on the Miami defense and doesn't give us any rebounding lanes.

Water