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View Full Version : What the #%^$% was Rick thinking?



Ragnar
05-10-2004, 09:11 PM
Tinsley is in the game untill the 2:35 we scored 20 points. AJ played 11 minutes we only score [b]7[/]points. He FINALLY puts Tins back in with 3 to go and we score 8 more points.

My question is why the $%@& was AJ in there that long. I understand that Tins cant play the entire game. But waiting untill the 3 minute mark to put him back in while the Heat take the lead when they had been down by 6 is inexcusable.

I thought my head was going to explode. :mad:

ROCislandWarrior
05-10-2004, 09:19 PM
Tinsley is in the game untill the 2:35 we scored 20 points. AJ played 11 minutes we only score [b]7[/]points. He FINALLY puts Tins back in with 3 to go and we score 8 more points.

My question is why the $%@& was AJ in there that long. I understand that Tins cant play the entire game. But waiting untill the 3 minute mark to put him back in while the Heat take the lead when they had been down by 6 is inexcusable.

I thought my head was going to explode. :mad:

Maybe he is saving him for the second half?

Unclebuck
05-10-2004, 09:19 PM
I was thinking of you

Really Tinsley was at the scorers table waiting to come in with about 6:20 left in the second quarter, but there was not a dead ball until much later so he could not get in.

Ragnar as you know first dead ball inside of 6:00 is an automatic timeout. yes Tinsley walked back to the bench as the clock crossed 6:00 mark but that is because there was going to be a timeout. And before you say Rick should have called timout, he already used a full and the .20 earlier in the quarter.

sweabs
05-10-2004, 09:23 PM
Johnson is SOOOO WEAK with pressure!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:mad: :mad:

Ragnar
05-10-2004, 11:05 PM
I was thinking of you

Really Tinsley was at the scorers table waiting to come in with about 6:20 left in the second quarter, but there was not a dead ball until much later so he could not get in.

Ragnar as you know first dead ball inside of 6:00 is an automatic timeout. yes Tinsley walked back to the bench as the clock crossed 6:00 mark but that is because there was going to be a timeout. And before you say Rick should have called timout, he already used a full and the .20 earlier in the quarter.

I honestly think that and the amount of time Jeff spent on the bench cost us this game. You know that rebound that Odom got at the end. Why was AJ in there instead of Jeff?

zxc
05-10-2004, 11:08 PM
I honestly think that and the amount of time Jeff spent on the bench cost us this game. You know that rebound that Odom got at the end. Why was AJ in there instead of Jeff?

Probably because there was 20 seconds left, Artest had just fouled out and he wanted three point shooting. I don't think anyone on our team could have gotten that rebound, bounced right into three heat players.

Easy to blame AJ for sucking tonight but we didn't lose the game in the second quarter which was where he played the majority of his minutes. He played like 3 minutes in the second half total. We had the game tied up in the 4th Q then just blew it all there is to it. AJ wasn't anywhere near the court don't blame him for team not hitting a single field goal till final minutes of the quarter.

Though I do agree Foster should have seen more time overall. Al just sucked tonight.

Liquid Slap
05-11-2004, 12:04 AM
Nothing is worst that having a lineup like this on the floor:

Mike James
Lindsey Hunter
Darvin Ham
Ben Wallace
Elden Campbell

all at the same time!!! No scorers at all!!

No coach can do worst than that.

Unclebuck
05-11-2004, 12:05 AM
Don't forget that Jeff was not 100% physically

Suaveness
05-11-2004, 12:06 AM
Nothing is worst that having a lineup like this on the floor:

Mike James
Lindsey Hunter
Darvin Ham
Ben Wallace
Elden Campbell

all at the same time!!! No scorers at all!!

No coach can do worst than that.

VERY good defensive lineup though ;)

Millerartest
05-11-2004, 05:34 AM
Jeff never gets much PT and Croshere should have been in at the end. Solves three point shooting and rebounding. Solves a missing person who could potentially provide a spark. Also, other people who should be blamed for that rebound are those who should post their men out of the box instead of standing in front of them and preparing to sky.

ChicagoJ
05-11-2004, 10:32 AM
UB, you slipped a commment on Anthony Johnson in my other thread.

I don't want to sidetrack this thread, but I need to mention that AJ has played very well in the first two games

I disagree, I think he's been pretty ineffective this series. At best, he's helped the Pacers "tread water" when Tinsley has been on the bench.

And you know as well as I do that bench players perform better at home during the playoffs. On the road, you've got to stick with your starters even more.

Tinsley needs more minutes. We need more minutes for the lineup I suggested last week of Tinsley/ Freddie/ Ron/ Al/ JO. Notice that Rick has tweaked the first substitution of each half to bring Fred and Al in at the same time (for Reggie and Jeff). But he's making the move to AJ too soon and leaving him in during the second and fourth quarters for too long (Tinsley should check out after the three minute/ home team timeout in the first and third quarters and return at or shortly after the nine minute/ TV timeout in the second and fourth quaters.)

TheSauceMaster
05-11-2004, 10:37 AM
was I the only one to hear them say Tinsley had sprained his ankle again and this is probably the reason Rick went with AJ so long? I don't agree with the choice because Tins still seemed effective even if he was hurt.

LAPacer
05-11-2004, 10:38 AM
There is definitely nothing more frustrating than watching AJ pick up his dribble and kill the offense. We usually try option 1, then if it doesn't work go to option 2, then if that doesn't work, go back to option 1. But AJ is so bad at running the offense, we couldn't even do option 1 once. He is horrible. Its time to make jamaal play 35-40 mins a game and have KA back up. The only time we need AJ is if we need 3 point shooting, but Tinsley is doing just fine now

Ragnar
05-11-2004, 10:46 AM
Probably because there was 20 seconds left, Artest had just fouled out and he wanted three point shooting. I don't think anyone on our team could have gotten that rebound, bounced right into three heat players.

I still would have rather seen either Cro or Jeff there to try. We knew he was going to miss the free throw we needed to get it.

Easy to blame AJ for sucking tonight but we didn't lose the game in the second quarter which was where he played the majority of his minutes. He played like 3 minutes in the second half total. We had the game tied up in the 4th Q then just blew it all there is to it. AJ wasn't anywhere near the court don't blame him for team not hitting a single field goal till final minutes of the quarter.

Though I do agree Foster should have seen more time overall. Al just sucked tonight.

AJ played 6 minutes in the second half and that was too much also. However had he only played 3 in the first half I could have lived with it. He always seems to play better in the second half than he does in the first half. The problem is that we were up by 6 when he came in. He stayed so long that our momentum was killed.

In the second half when he came in we went on yet another scoring drought that killed the momentum we had regained with Tins in the game. I think it is time for Tins to play 35 minutes. Him getting less than 30 minutes when he was one of the best players on the floor is absurd. Bender is totaly inefective when AJ is in and seems to play his best when he has either Kenny or Tins thowing him the ball in rythem.

I am going to say this again there is no way we are getting past Detroit with AJ playing. Not just playing big minutes but playing at all. You can not waste leads with them. They pressure the ball which is kryptonite to AJ. He needs to sit for us to get past the Pistons and I think it is time for Kenny to get some game time so that he can get his timing back.

ChicagoJ
05-11-2004, 10:48 AM
was I the only one to hear them say Tinsley had sprained his ankle again and this is probably the reason Rick went with AJ so long? I don't agree with the choice because Tins still seemed effective even if he was hurt.

I heard it, but I didn't believe it was a factor.

AJ's and Tinsley's minutes were not significantly different last night than in any other game over the past four months, including games #1 and #2 of this series.

Ragnar
05-11-2004, 10:54 AM
Tinsley sprained his ankle late in the 3rd. AJ's big minutes came in the second quarter (pretty much all of the second quarter) The reason he stayed in there as long as he did was the Rick did not want to burn a timeout after the 6 minute mark when there would have been an automatic timeout anyway at the next dead ball.

The problem is that at the 8 minute mark they took a timeout and that would have been the time to put him back in if not at the dead ball at the 9 minute mark when they were heating up.

If he would have yanked AJ at the 8 or 9 minute mark the Heat would not have gotten on fire and I think we would have won the game. just my opinion but I see that as the crucial mistake of the game.

TheSauceMaster
05-11-2004, 10:59 AM
Personally I think Rick needs to show alittle more faith in Jamal Tinsley , I know he was trying to put AJ in to slow down the game and have us grindout our half court game but it didn't take a scholar or a phd to figure that out :laugh: Jamal has been very good this series against the heat , yes he's made a couple turnovers but he always seems to make it up with dazzling plays.

able
05-11-2004, 11:14 AM
Tins for the series (Miami) has 5 TO's against 19 Ast. 34 points, 7 Reb & 5 St.
all in 84 minutes
AJ on the other hand has 1 TO 3 Ast 14 Pts 4 Reb and 1 St. in 61 minutes

If Tins plays 35 - 40 a game (leaving 8 -13 for backups) we can add 25 - 30 % to his stats + 50% increase in team effectivity.

as far as to much time for JB goes, he played 9 minutes, hardly enough to work up a sweat, so let's not blame 5.1 for anything (yet) :D


And I agree with UB and Jay@section222, JO played a good game with a monster second half, blaming him for 4 missed shots and 1 missed FT in that period is pathetic, Ron, Al hmmm everyone that had minutes min Tins shot worse. (ok Reg not, but then again, he did not shoot at all)

Ragnar
05-11-2004, 12:04 PM
For Tins to have only played 24 more minutes so far than AJ is a travesty.

At the 8 minut mark he knew something was wrong anf thats why he took Bender out to put Ron back in. But Ron was not having a good game and IMO Bender was not the problem. Yes he is mostly inefective when AJ is in there so take AJ OUT!!

able
05-11-2004, 12:18 PM
For Tins to have only played 24 more minutes so far than AJ is a travesty.

At the 8 minut mark he knew something was wrong anf thats why he took Bender out to put Ron back in. But Ron was not having a good game and IMO Bender was not the problem. Yes he is mostly inefective when AJ is in there so take AJ OUT!!

The sole reason i posted the totals. and you know I agree with you more then anyone.

The main reason "others" do not play well when AJ is in is for the simple reason that they need to A. find a position, move on rotation AND go and get the ball. It will hardly ever (if ever) be "delivered" to the "doorstep" (see the splitting pass straight through the middle at the end of the half in game 1 or 2 (not sure anymore) These kind of passes, in tempo, on the spot, are only coming from Tins, his strong suit, the teams main weapon.

Tins makes other players better on this team, he draws space, he creates.

Kenny can "hold" the play, run set patterns when told, AJ can never complete those (ok hardly ever)

</preaching to the choir>







:stupid:

PistonsDynasty
05-11-2004, 01:10 PM
Nothing is worst that having a lineup like this on the floor:

Mike James
Lindsey Hunter
Darvin Ham
Ben Wallace
Elden Campbell

all at the same time!!! No scorers at all!!

No coach can do worst than that.

WHAT???????????????????

So Ben Wallace can score??
Elden can't score in the post??'
D-Ham can hit the open J
MIKE JAME IS A SCORER!! WTF???? LOL come on man
Lindsey can knock the open J and he can drive.

Also, Larry never throw that line-up out there.

When he goes with the bench Okur OR Williamson will be on the court.

waxman
05-11-2004, 02:26 PM
Rick doesn't need to put AJ in to slow down the game.... Tins runs the halfcourt better than anyone on the Pacers.... personally I'd like to see jamal shoot more and drive more.....he comes off those pick and rolls above the elbow wide open sometimes at 15'... but feels the need to get the ball to JO or Al for a fading 17' brick....

Jamal can get into the lane anytime he wants, last night when he did, he made good decisions and got easy baskets for people.... this is a much better option than watching JO, Al, or Ron hold the ball on an isolation play...until they have to take an impossible shot.

We need much more movement and penetration....and for christ sakes if we can't get Reggie a shot in the halfcourt set, lets try and at least get some sort of transition game going and get him shots that way. The fact is we need some productivity from the perimeter...to release pressure in the halfcourt and in the paint.

Ragnar
05-11-2004, 03:59 PM
In games like last night where we have pissed away a lead while AJ was in Rick at least needs to take the cuffs off of Tins and let the team run a little more.

I can see not doing it while we have a lead or it is within 2 points. But when things are not working let Tins do his thing and get out into the open floor.