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Jon Theodore
12-02-2006, 09:36 PM
What is going on with him this season. Every other time i check SAC live game stats he isn't playing? I dont have cable and have only seen 2 pacer games all year, so yes im out of the loop.

Whats going on with ron.

Unclebuck
12-02-2006, 10:20 PM
He's been having back problems all season and just hasn't looked good at all. He's not playing tonight I assume because of his back

AesopRockOn
12-02-2006, 10:27 PM
He has a back injury and came off the bench last night. I guess it's worse so he didn't even play tonight. Looks like they almost beat San Antonio.

Shade
12-02-2006, 10:33 PM
But is it REALLY back problems? With Ron-Ron, you just never know.

And now, it looks like he and Musselman are already starting to clash:

http://www.sacbee.com/100/story/86436.html


Artest calls for ball

The Kings forward is unhappy after getting too few touches, in his view.

By Sam Amick - Bee Staff Writer

Last Updated 1:19 am PST Saturday, December 2, 2006

Story appeared in SPORTS section, Page C1

That first step? It was a doozy -- a dizzying, dominating, defenseless doozy in the Big D.

The Kings didn't have enough "D" of any kind on Friday night at American Airlines Center, where the first leg of this Texas two-step was, well, a broken one.

But it wasn't until long after the Dallas Mavericks disposed of the Kings 109-90 that the most damaging "D" of all came to the lips of its franchise player.

Discontent.

Kings small forward Ron Artest said the game was a sign that things need to change, namely his role in an offense that has plenty of capable scorers but sometimes struggles to identify the option he sees as the best one available. Himself. Specifically, Artest said he didn't have any offensive plays called for him beyond the first quarter.

"Not to have no plays for the whole second quarter, for the whole second half, that doesn't make me happy at all," said Artest, who scored 15 points on 6-of-11 shooting. "Not from a selfish standpoint. There's got to be a way. We've got to find ways to get me the ball.

"I know that's kind of selfish, but something has to happen. The organization needs to find out which way it wants to go, you know what I'm saying."

Asked what he meant by "which way it wants to go," Artest said the coaching staff and management aren't in sync.

"I think coach understands what I can do, you know," he said. "It just has to be clear between the organization and coach, at times, what type of players you have. Like in other situations, like (the Lakers), they understand who's the man over there.

"Coach and player understand. In Cleveland ..."

Artest wasn't there at the start, when the Kings came out slugglishly and the Mavericks shot three-pointers as if they were free throws in hitting 7 of 9 from beyond the arc. Artest didn't start the game because of the sore back that continues to bother him, then entered with 6:16 remaining in the first when the Mavericks were already up 21-12.

He wasn't able to stop them either, though, and the Mavericks led 38-19 after the first quarter on the efforts of the long-range game. Dallas small forward Josh Howard -- who ranks third in the league in first-quarter scoring -- had 10 of his game-high 24 points in the opening period. The Kings, meanwhile, didn't help their own cause with six turnovers. From there, it was a replica of the Nov. 16 loss at Golden State, in which they fell behind big early and kept pace in the final three quarters.

It was the second consecutive game in which Dallas scored 38 first-quarter points, and their 62-41 halftime lead was a season high in scoring for a half.

"We knew of their past history in the first quarter, but we couldn't stop them," Kings coach Eric Musselman said.

There was, and not for the first time, some contradiction in Artest's views. Just as he deemed himself the go-to guy, he good-naturedly told a national reporter in the locker room afterward to talk to Martin -- "the All-Star." Yet after hitting 5 of his first 6 shots and scoring 13 points, Martin went to the bench midway through the third quarter with the rest of the starters as Dallas' lead grew to 32 points. None of the Kings' starters played in the fourth quarter.

"I thought our subs played hard, and I knew we had a game tonight (at San Antonio) as well," Musselman said.

Martin, who was frustrated by being benched because of poor play in a victory over the Clippers on Tuesday, said he understood the decision this time.

"We weren't getting it done as a group, so we deserved to be over there," he said.

Artest, however, stayed in despite his sore back. It was the continuation of a trend that has taken place for much of the season -- Artest subbing himself in and out of games.

"I wanted to win," he said. "No matter what the score is, I don't want to give up. We could've come back and won."

The Bee's Sam Amick can be reached at samick@sacbee.com.

BlueNGold
12-02-2006, 11:44 PM
The honeymoon is officially over in Sactown. Now, it is time to place your bets. How does the Las Vegas Kings sound?

Unclebuck
12-02-2006, 11:54 PM
But is it REALLY back problems? With Ron-Ron, you just never know.

http://www.sacbee.com/100/story/86436.html

Well you never know for sure, but I've been reading and hearing about his back problems since the first couple days of training camp - so I doubt they would have started the "excuse" two months in advance of using it. And watching Ron play this season - it looks like a bad back to me

piksi
12-03-2006, 12:02 AM
Ron had back problems and that is the reason why he isn't playing as much lately

His mental/attitude issues are still what is to be considered "normal" by Ron's standards.

For how long - who knows. We are just not a good team anymore and Ron might not deal well with it. Time will tell - I guess

Kegboy
12-03-2006, 12:11 AM
Who?

Quis
12-03-2006, 12:19 AM
Ron Artest is the most selfish player in the NBA.

Does anyone disagree with that statement?

Big Smooth
12-03-2006, 12:29 AM
Ron Artest is the most selfish player in the NBA.

Does anyone disagree with that statement?

I would disagree with it.

McKeyFan
12-03-2006, 01:09 AM
Iverson, Francis, Marbury, Kobe. There's a pretty long list ahead of Ronnie.

CableKC
12-03-2006, 01:11 AM
I was listening to Sports 1140 ( one of the SacTown radio stations ) and it sounded like he may have been benched by Musselman for missing practice.

Musselman has a rep for not taking any cr*p from players.

Kingsfanbmiller
12-03-2006, 01:23 AM
Musselman's honestly been a terrible coach so far and yeah he's had back problems since the beginning of the season. Just not making shots he normally hits and stuff.

Eindar
12-03-2006, 01:42 AM
Ron's got two main problems.

The first is that he thinks that he's on the same level as Kobe and LeBron. While he is very good, he's simply not on their level at this point. Ron feels like he should be a #1 option, which if you comply with that notion like Adelman did, he'll be happy, but you most likely won't win a title. If you don't comply, as Musselman isn't, Ron turns into a cancer. I'd like to point out that there wasn't a peep out of Ron in terms of his happiness until Kevin Martin became the consistent #1 option.

The second problem with Ron is that his competitiveness is often problematic. If you start losing, he immediately thinks he's going to "take over" and help you back towards winning. This often tends to only make the matter worse, especially if he's not shooting well.


I still think hiring Musselman was a bad choice given that they've got Ron on their roster. Scott Skiles would also be a bad choice.

I think one day Ron Artest will win a title. However, he needs two things for that to happen: a total alpha dog player who he knows he's not better than, and a player-friendly coach that "understands" him.

Here's what I'd do. Have Minnesota trade something fair like 1 first and a decent player to Sacramento for Ron. Pair him up with Garnett, who is obviously more talented, doesn't play Ron's position, shares his homicidal drive to win, and won't take any of his crap. Bring in Rick Adelman to coach the team, because he's a proven winner, and already has a good rapport with Ron.

Why don't I have Kevin McHale's job again?

Kingsfanbmiller
12-03-2006, 02:13 AM
Ron's got two main problems.

The first is that he thinks that he's on the same level as Kobe and LeBron. While he is very good, he's simply not on their level at this point. Ron feels like he should be a #1 option, which if you comply with that notion like Adelman did, he'll be happy, but you most likely won't win a title. If you don't comply, as Musselman isn't, Ron turns into a cancer. I'd like to point out that there wasn't a peep out of Ron in terms of his happiness until Kevin Martin became the consistent #1 option.

The second problem with Ron is that his competitiveness is often problematic. If you start losing, he immediately thinks he's going to "take over" and help you back towards winning. This often tends to only make the matter worse, especially if he's not shooting well.


I still think hiring Musselman was a bad choice given that they've got Ron on their roster. Scott Skiles would also be a bad choice.

I think one day Ron Artest will win a title. However, he needs two things for that to happen: a total alpha dog player who he knows he's not better than, and a player-friendly coach that "understands" him.

Here's what I'd do. Have Minnesota trade something fair like 1 first and a decent player to Sacramento for Ron. Pair him up with Garnett, who is obviously more talented, doesn't play Ron's position, shares his homicidal drive to win, and won't take any of his crap. Bring in Rick Adelman to coach the team, because he's a proven winner, and already has a good rapport with Ron.

Why don't I have Kevin McHale's job again?

Cause Geoff Petrie's not an idiot and your plan wouldn't work.


Trust me, Martin's not the #1 option on the Kings. He should be, but usually Bibby and sometimes Artest take more shots. Considering Mike is battling a wrist injury and he's your PG-that's bad and it sets a tone for the whole team. The other problem is Muss likes seeing Artest take jumpers instead of putting him in the post. Ron only made 1 comment, to be honest I'm more worried about his back than this.

Who knows, maybe it's karma?

Quis
12-03-2006, 03:11 AM
The difference between Ron Artest and those other guys mentioned as being mroe selfish than Ron is the fact that those other guys actually have some talent on the offensive end to justify their shot attempts. Artest is a guy without much of a shooting and a shot selection that would make Stephen Jackson blush. And thats just on the court, don't get me started on how selfish he is away from it ie wanting to abandon the team to promote his lousy CD.

Unclebuck
12-03-2006, 08:42 AM
The difference between Ron Artest and those other guys mentioned as being mroe selfish than Ron is the fact that those other guys actually have some talent on the offensive end to justify their shot attempts. Artest is a guy without much of a shooting and a shot selection that would make Stephen Jackson blush. And thats just on the court, don't get me started on how selfish he is away from it ie wanting to abandon the team to promote his lousy CD.

Do you mean you actually believed that. I figured that was a myth that was busted and no one believed that anymore.

MagicRat
12-03-2006, 10:08 AM
I saw about 2 minutes of the Kings game against the Mavs the other night and the announcers were talking about his back problem. Ron's story is that he bought a new car for his wife which is too small for him and he somehow hurt his back driving it............

Kingsfanbmiller
12-03-2006, 12:26 PM
I saw about 2 minutes of the Kings game against the Mavs the other night and the announcers were talking about his back problem. Ron's story is that he bought a new car for his wife which is too small for him and he somehow hurt his back driving it............


It's true though. Pre game you can see the trainer putting patches or something on his lower back. You can see it in the way he moves and sometimes when it's really bad his defense aint as good(just the way he moves).

A-Train
12-03-2006, 02:48 PM
The honeymoon is officially over in Sactown. Now, it is time to place your bets. How does the Las Vegas Kings sound?

I'd love it! (now that I live in Vegas) At least the Pacers would be visiting at least once a year!

:cool:

Kingsfanbmiller
12-03-2006, 03:02 PM
Stern already said no team in Vegas cuz the casinos.

Shade
12-03-2006, 03:10 PM
Stern already said no team in Vegas cuz the casinos.

Stern can't run the NBA (into the ground) forever.















Can he? :shudder:

MagicRat
12-03-2006, 03:12 PM
It's true though. Pre game you can see the trainer putting patches or something on his lower back. You can see it in the way he moves and sometimes when it's really bad his defense aint as good(just the way he moves).

He probably is. I just thought the reason was pretty bizarre......

Naptown_Seth
12-03-2006, 04:20 PM
He probably is. I just thought the reason was pretty bizarre......
And sorry Kingsfan, but you sound a lot like Pacers fans regarding Ron BEFORE he was gone.

Ron said the IDENTICAL comment in Indy right when he asked to be traded. His current complaint is WHY YOU HAVE HIM NOW. Thinks about that. It's harmless? Wasn't harmless here, it had him asking to be traded and being disruptive.

He also happened to get "hurt" just around this same period, a few games before he made his complaint about Rick. It seemed at the time that he had been hurt, but honestly we learned to start questioning these absences after awhile. There is a lot of spin, ego jockying, and perhaps PR filtering between what's really going on and what is being reported with him.


I'm in no way mad about Ron when I say this. I liked him here, I think he has a great game, and I do think in the end he proved that he was actually more selfish than "nuts". Right now Ron and Sacto are on an identical path as Ron and the Pacers were last season. It was right about this point in the season that he made the exact same comments about himself and the offense.

And on top of it he hurts his back driving a new car?

Likely the Kings won't handle it the same as the Pacers because Indy had other issues going into it, a lengthier history with Ron and the brawl, but the Kings will have to handle him somehow, at the very least behind the scenes.


I agree with Eindar's comments on the matter.

Kingsfanbmiller
12-03-2006, 05:49 PM
Kings Notes: Artest backpedals a bit on Friday's outburst
By Sam Amick - Bee Staff Writer
Published 12:00 am PST Sunday, December 3, 2006
Story appeared in SPORTS section, Page C5

It was a mini mea culpa of sorts, Ron Artest realizing a day later that frustration drove his words just as it had so many times before.

A day after the Kings' 19-point loss to Dallas sparked the Kings small forward to let out a lengthy list of dislikes -- from his role in the team's offense to the organization's perception of his overall place in the system -- Artest said he went too far.

"I probably said too much," he said. "I just can't get used to losing, you know."

Artest, who sat out Saturday's game against San Antonio because of the sore back that continues to bother him, said he and Kings coach Eric Musselman had talked, though not specifically about Artest's concerns.

Before the Kings faced the Spurs, Musselman insisted he wasn't aware of Artest's comments.

"I haven't seen what he said," he said. "I'm in San Antonio. I haven't seen the Sacramento paper. I haven't read the clips (online articles) today."

After told of Artest's sentiments, Musselman would only say: "He's a big competitor, and I think there's a lot of NBA players who have great confidence in their scoring ability. And I think that's a good thing."

Kings forward Shareef Abdur-Rahim, who was well aware of Artest's concerns, said one player couldn't have changed the game at Dallas.

"I don't think we lost that game last night because one guy didn't get the ball," Abdur-Rahim said. "He's one of the better offensive players we have, but we've got a lot of guys who deserves shots."

Kings point guard Mike Bibby -- who has often spoken of the need for selflessness on the team -- also said he did not know of Artest's comments but that it was not his concern.

"That's for someone higher than me to figure out," he said. "You'll be able to see if (Artest's views) are hurting us or not."

Artest said he wasn't upset he didn't start against Dallas. He had missed the morning shootaround and was not expected to play, but Musselman started swingman John Salmons. Artest entered midway through the first quarter.

"When we talked (Friday), we felt (he should play) five to six minutes in the first quarter, five to six minutes in the third quarter, (which) would prevent the 40-minute pounding of the back that's been a constant problem now for three weeks," Musselman said.


http://www.sacbee.com/100/story/86823.html (http://www.sacbee.com/100/story/86823.html)

skyfire
12-03-2006, 08:47 PM
Ron is a competative guy. Not giving him a single play for 3 quarters isn't going to go down well when he is one of the teams 3 main scorers.

He has bad shooting nights at times, but can also be a very effective scorer when he has the ball in certain areas.

I cant see Sacto giving up on Ron just yet.

microwave_oven
12-04-2006, 12:26 PM
tick....tick....tick....

VF21
12-04-2006, 06:55 PM
I've loved the Kings since the first one of them stepped off the plane from Kansas City. As long as Ron can be a productive member of the team, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

BUT - and this is a very big point with me - if it ever gets to the point where it appears he's putting himself above the team I love, I'll be among the first calling for his head.

Naptown_Seth
12-04-2006, 07:44 PM
I've loved the Kings since the first one of them stepped off the plane from Kansas City. As long as Ron can be a productive member of the team, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

BUT - and this is a very big point with me - if it ever gets to the point where it appears he's putting himself above the team I love, I'll be among the first calling for his head.
This is exactly how I felt, and I was 100% behind him UNTIL he went selfish and did the trade demand crap after the team and city supported him through the brawl fallout.

He said the exact same words, didn't understand the offense, thought he needed the ball more, and so on. That was selfish at that point and much of it IMO implied "I want to be able to put up bigger offensive numbers so my new contract will be bigger or so I can get endorsement money."

He's on a lowball deal right now and he doesn't like it.


As for the retraction, he's yet to NOT issue one as far as I can recall. Of course a few days later he backed off. He always does. If he was in Indy this would be a huge deal because it would be the 7th or 8th time a problem like this (ignoring the flagrants and stuff from a few years ago) popped up as a distraction.

He's just not near the Sacto tolerance limit yet. He's got 4-5 more of these or 1-2 big ones before they are sick of him. My only concern would be that this looks like he hasn't changed which means that those other incidents are on thier way.

If it goes that way then he really will look like an idiot and will have wasted what could have been (still could be) a HOF career. It's like watching a friend go in and out of rehab over and over.

VF21
12-04-2006, 07:56 PM
My heart, of course, hopes you're wrong but my brain is not about to totally disregard the lessons you all had to learn here the hard way.

PacerMan
12-05-2006, 01:03 PM
Do you mean you actually believed that. I figured that was a myth that was busted and no one believed that anymore.

and why would you think that?

He DID what he DID.

denyfizle
12-05-2006, 09:55 PM
it is that time of the year you know... RonRon acts up around this time o year. maybe the cold gets to his head. people are reporting that RonRon has been complaining about his role on the Kings offense and starting to be a strain on the team again. wooohooo glad we can just sit back and enjoy this one from afar.