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View Full Version : Praise for Carlisle in a Foxsports article about the East



maragin
12-01-2006, 03:25 PM
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/6216112

Basically it is just another "West > East" article, but it takes an interesting spin by suggesting that the West is better coached. With the limited praise delivered to East coaches, Carlisle was one of two given props.

"Rather than bomb those who may not be measuring up, let's take a look at the Eastern Conference's limited roster of truly good coaches.

We can start with Miami's Pat Riley, move over to Rick Carlisle at Indiana and, well, the rest of the list looks a bit iffy."

Pitons
12-01-2006, 03:32 PM
What can I say? True.

Dr. Goldfoot
12-01-2006, 04:17 PM
Mike Brown & Flip Saunders probably take offense to that.

Destined4Greatness
12-01-2006, 04:30 PM
And yet half(Aprox) this board wants him replaced.

rexnom
12-01-2006, 05:32 PM
SO glad we got him signed to that extension. Sometimes you can't appreciate a good coach unless you have a really, really bad one (i.e. Isiah).

FlavaDave
12-01-2006, 05:34 PM
I'm a huge believer in Carlisle.

Trader Joe
12-01-2006, 05:45 PM
Mike Brown & Flip Saunders probably take offense to that.

You mean the Flip Saunders that has made it out of the first round twice? No thanks.

Aw Heck
12-01-2006, 05:49 PM
You mean the Flip Saunders that has made it out of the first round ONCE?
Actually, twice. In 2004, when the T-Wolves made the Western Conference Finals and lost to the Payton-Kobe-Malone-Shaq Lakers team and last season when he lost in the ECF to the Heat.

Anyway, I'd still take Carlisle over him.

Trader Joe
12-01-2006, 06:00 PM
Actually, twice. In 2004, when the T-Wolves made the Western Conference Finals and lost to the Payton-Kobe-Malone-Shaq Lakers team and last season when he lost in the ECF to the Heat.

Anyway, I'd still take Carlisle over him.

Yeah you caught me right before I edited it, I guess lol. I went into the thread a little too quick. Either way not that impressive.

Will Galen
12-01-2006, 07:28 PM
I disagree it's the coaches. The article pointed out that last year the West won 55% of their games against the East and this year so far it's 73%. So then they say the players talents from each conference are much the same. The coaches are much the same too, so that doesn't make sense.

The East over the last 10 years or so has played more of a half court game, while the West looked to run. Along comes some rule changes that help which conference? The West of course.

Eastern teams saw last year how things were going and and almost all have changed their philosophy and are looking to run.

Where does this put them in the scheme of things? It puts them behind the west in development. Most Western teams aren't changing their way of playing, whereas east teams are.

I'll bet anyone two toenail clips that the West's winning percentage will be much lower by the end of the season.

Mourning
12-02-2006, 11:10 AM
I disagree it's the coaches. The article pointed out that last year the West won 55% of their games against the East and this year so far it's 73%. So then they say the players talents from each conference are much the same. The coaches are much the same too, so that doesn't make sense.

The East over the last 10 years or so has played more of a half court game, while the West looked to run. Along comes some rule changes that help which conference? The West of course.

Eastern teams saw last year how things were going and and almost all have changed their philosophy and are looking to run.

Where does this put them in the scheme of things? It puts them behind the west in development. Most Western teams aren't changing their way of playing, whereas east teams are.

I'll bet anyone two toenail clips that the West's winning percentage will be much lower by the end of the season.

:amen:

Naptown_Seth
12-03-2006, 02:28 AM
I disagree it's the coaches. The article pointed out that last year the West won 55% of their games against the East and this year so far it's 73%. So then they say the players talents from each conference are much the same. The coaches are much the same too, so that doesn't make sense.

The East over the last 10 years or so has played more of a half court game, while the West looked to run. Along comes some rule changes that help which conference? The West of course.

Eastern teams saw last year how things were going and and almost all have changed their philosophy and are looking to run.

Where does this put them in the scheme of things? It puts them behind the west in development. Most Western teams aren't changing their way of playing, whereas east teams are.

I'll bet anyone two toenail clips that the West's winning percentage will be much lower by the end of the season.
Great point about style adjustment.

I basically said it wasn't the coaches either over at Star. Most of my points have been covered (like Mike Brown, Skiles, Flip, etc), but one of my main points would be that really if Miami and Chicago get it going as expected then what's the difference between the 2 conferences again?

A couple East "contenders" come out slow, and both are being coached by guys considered pretty good previous to this season. In fact one of the 2 teams is coached by one of the 2 good coaches by the writer's standards...and doesn't that contradict his point?

If it was the coaches then shouldn't Miami be winning? Or did Wade drop dead and I missed it?


The "West over East" has been said for about 25 years now. Even as the Bulls were winning people thought of the East as Chicago and also-rans, using the Rockets' 2 wins to "prove it", ignoring the Bad Boys as a short term thing based on physical play, and then ignoring the East winning 2 of the last 3 titles.

The West has seemingly always been the running conference, the high scoring conference, and yet despite having many big winning teams they often get knocked off in the Finals by a "lesser" East squad.


Come May I think Detroit, Cleveland, and Miami are still in the mix just as much as Dallas, SA, and PHX. Pretty much the same as the last few years. Utah? Possible, but then the same could be said for Orlando if Grant Hill is playing.

NPFII
12-03-2006, 11:05 AM
Has someone checked what % of the East-West games were played at home court?

My guess is that there is a significant homecourt advantage leaning to the West (more Eastern teams made Westcoast trips than the opposite) - which can explain the difference from last year.

All in all the West has been beating the East in the direct East-West games totals for about 15 years, and that's not gonna change this year... maybe it's something with the timezones...?

Unclebuck
12-03-2006, 12:07 PM
Has someone checked what % of the East-West games were played at home court?

My guess is that there is a significant homecourt advantage leaning to the West (more Eastern teams made Westcoast trips than the opposite) - which can explain the difference from last year.

All in all the West has been beating the East in the direct East-West games totals for about 15 years, and that's not gonna change this year... maybe it's something with the timezones...?


It does seem a lot of east teams have already had long west coast trips.

OK, so I looked it up. Wow you nailed it. Of the 15 eastern conference teams 9 have already had a west coast trip. (note: games in Texas, Minneapolis, NO, and Memphis aren't included in this) And two more start either tonight or Tuesday.

Pacers,
Magic
Pistons
Nets
Sixers
Knicks
Bulls
Raptors
Bucks
Hawks - starting tonight
Heat - starting Tuesday night



OK, I'm looking up to see what west conference teams have had a long eastern conference trip. I don't know what I should do with the Texas teams and the Grizz and T-Wolves. I guess I'll count those

Nuggets
Blazers
Sonics
Jazz
Kings

OK so of the 15 western conference teams only 5 have had one of their eastern conference road trips

denyfizle
12-03-2006, 12:19 PM
I guess that's really how horrible the EAST is...

NPFII
12-05-2006, 11:55 AM
It does seem a lot of east teams have already had long west coast trips.

OK, so I looked it up. Wow you nailed it. Of the 15 eastern conference teams 9 have already had a west coast trip. (note: games in Texas, Minneapolis, NO, and Memphis aren't included in this) And two more start either tonight or Tuesday.

Pacers,
Magic
Pistons
Nets
Sixers
Knicks
Bulls
Raptors
Bucks
Hawks - starting tonight
Heat - starting Tuesday night



OK, I'm looking up to see what west conference teams have had a long eastern conference trip. I don't know what I should do with the Texas teams and the Grizz and T-Wolves. I guess I'll count those

Nuggets
Blazers
Sonics
Jazz
Kings

OK so of the 15 western conference teams only 5 have had one of their eastern conference road trips

So what this means is that:
1. It will even out eventually when the West coast teams take their road trips. Not saying even out to .500, but closer to what it was last season.
2. The NBA schedule for this season has the Eastern teams going out west early in the season. I dunno what this means, but I hope it's just a coincidence. Care to check on previous years?...

NPFII
12-05-2006, 12:38 PM
Ok, I did the math:

East teams played West teams 90 times this season so far, with 57 (!!) of the games giving homecourt advantage to the Western teams.

57 out of 90 is 63%

The winning % of the West-coast teams in these encounters stands at 73% (66 games), which is a bit more than 63%, but not that significant overall.

In a nutshell - all these articles about how horrible the East is are BS. It may well be that the West is better, but the schedule (so far) strongly favors the West, and the teams records are biased strongly in that direction.