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View Full Version : Where's this alleged bad attitude from Shawne Williams?



Hicks
10-17-2006, 07:11 PM
There were conflicting reports about him during the draft. Some said he had an attitude problem, others said he didn't. His coach addamently denied it.

Now I'm seeing this:

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061017/SPORTS04/610170392/1088



As Indiana Pacers forward Shawne Williams jogged off the court during a timeout in the second half of Monday's preseason game against the Minnesota Timberwolves, Stephen Jackson stopped him and gave him some advice.


Then Jeff Foster stopped Williams and gave the rookie out of Memphis some tidbits. Darrell Armstrong, a 12-year veteran, also dropped a little bit of knowledge on Williams at one point.


Williams is three games into his first NBA preseason and he has quickly realized he's no longer in Conference USA.


The game is quicker. Players are stronger. And your weaknesses are easily exploited.


"Phew," Williams said after scoring six points and committing four fouls in 14 minutes in the Pacers' 103-87 loss. "The speed is tremendous. The strength is something else, too. It's men out there. There are guys who have arms bigger than my legs."


The 20-year-old Williams was named Conference USA Freshman of the Year in his only season at Memphis. Pacers president Larry Bird said he was pleased Williams was available with the 17th overall pick in the draft.
The talent is there for Williams. Pacers officials have talked about the one-on-one battles he had with Danny Granger and Al Harrington during the summer. But at the same time, it's clear it will take time before Williams is ready to be a steady contributor for the Pacers.


There are times Williams gets ahead of himself instead of letting the game come to him.


"I took two timeouts (Monday) to get him to calm down and to point out some things he was making mistakes on," Pacers coach Rick Carlisle said. "A lot of his mistakes are things where he's getting ahead of himself. That comes with experience and gets better with experience. It's good he's getting the opportunity to get out there and find out what it's about."


Part of Williams' problem is that he's trying to learn both forward positions. Carlisle said the Pacers envision Williams as a small forward down the road.


"He has the tools to play both positions effectively, as does (Danny) Granger," Carlisle said. "That's the reason we're so excited about him. He's going through some growing pains, and it's not easy when you're getting your rear end beaten out there the way those guys were. But that's how you learn."


Williams is averaging 4.3 points and shooting 31 percent from the field in about 15 minutes per game through the first three preseason contests.
"It's one of those situations where he has to really focus," forward Jermaine O'Neal said. "It's not college. I told him he's young, he's a rookie and rookies are going to make mistakes. The key for him is to get better each and every day."


Williams has remained upbeat through his ups and downs by turning to veteran teammates.


"That's all they want to do, is help," he said. "They're always telling me things. It's not only when I mess up; it's when I do something right. That's key. I'm a competitor and I like it.
"The best thing about this is I'm not feeling miserable about things. It's all a learning experience. I'm only 20 and it's a transition for me going from college to the NBA."


http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/digest_061017.html



"I didn't come in with the aspect of being a 20-point, 10-rebound dude," he said. "I came in knowing I've got to learn, knowing I've got to get stronger, knowing I've got to improve. That's the only way I'm going to get better is if I come in with a great mindset, knowing I've got to learn, knowing there are great players out here who are better than me. I'm getting better by the day and that's the best thing."

Between all of that and what I've seen of him so far, I think the allegations were a load of crap.

lumber man
10-17-2006, 07:24 PM
sure seems to be a load of crap.

Leisure Suit Larry
10-17-2006, 07:29 PM
Your not confusing him with Marcus are you? I don't really remember hearing about Shawne's bad attitude

Naptown_Seth
10-17-2006, 07:33 PM
I don't remember attitude being an issue at the pre-draft. I thought it was his age and the fact that his single NCAA season had featured some very streaky shooting. The question was just how legit was his talent, at least in terms of consistancy.

But maybe I missed or forgot some attitude comment.

Hicks
10-17-2006, 07:35 PM
Your not confusing him with Marcus are you? I don't really remember hearing about Shawne's bad attitude

No, there were some places (scouting reports) suggesting he had a bad attitude. Definitely Shawne, not Marcus (who has/had his own negative issues).

Destined4Greatness
10-17-2006, 07:44 PM
Don't take anything seriously during the draft, I remember hearing about Harrisons poor work ethic, and I haven't seen that. The only thing holding him back is PT.

ChicagoJ
10-17-2006, 07:59 PM
I was gonna say, we were told Harrison was lazy and he's been anything but lazy.

Change the "L" to a "Cr" any it breaks down, though.

Don't worry, David. I still love ya.

McKeyFan
10-17-2006, 08:06 PM
I remember, Hicks.

Hopefully, you're right in perceiving it looks good so far.

Harrison had reports of attitude problems as well (temper, anyway). That report was correct.

Bball
10-17-2006, 08:19 PM
Was it attitude problems or work ethic/dedication that were the question marks? I was thinking it was an issue with 'cruise control' that was the thing his coach addressed, not attitude.... but I could be wrong.

-Bball

Los Angeles
10-17-2006, 08:23 PM
Williams was so far out of my radar that I don't remember any reports one way or the other.

LG33
10-17-2006, 08:33 PM
I thought James White had an attitude...?

Trader Joe
10-17-2006, 08:39 PM
I don't remember a bad attitude per say, but I do remember bad work ethic being brought up.

Anthem
10-17-2006, 09:26 PM
Yeah, I'm with you Hicks. One guy in one scouting report said "attitude" and then it stuck. His coach was livid about it, and he's got no reason to lie.

I think it was a crock. All of his pre-draft and post-draft interviews showed him to be well-spoken, emotionally mature, and smart. No hint of bad attitude.

imawhat
10-17-2006, 09:52 PM
No, there were some places (scouting reports) suggesting he had a bad attitude. Definitely Shawne, not Marcus (who has/had his own negative issues).


Hicks is correct. There were reports that Shawne had a bad attitude at times.

The article was in the IndyStar, and there are quotes from Larry Bird when asked about the attitude. He said something to the effect of "I talked with Shawne's college coach and he said Shawne is a hard worker with a good attitude. I'm not sure where anyone heard he had a bad attitude".

Anthem
10-17-2006, 10:40 PM
I thought James White had an attitude...?
That was the Magic's two-bit announcer... he didn't like the fact that White had the audacity to guard Morrison.

flakcatcher
10-17-2006, 11:31 PM
I think the "attitude" allegations stemmed from this draft night gem:

"I wonder, though, if he's a winner," ESPN analyst Jay Bilas said about Williams. "He's physically weak right now. He has to improve that, and he has to be more focused as a defender, as a rebounder. Right now he's only focused on scoring. Frankly, he's such a young player, he plays only when he feels like it. He's got the tools, though."

That may be true, it may not be true. But the kid certainly has an affable, easy-to-like disposition.

Peck
10-18-2006, 10:21 AM
I don't know anything about his attitude other than what I've read so far & seen in an interview on NBAtv. All of which I liked, btw.

On the other hand I really like his game. He is not nearly as far behind as we are being led to beleive.

ChicagoJ
10-18-2006, 10:25 AM
I don't know anything about his attitude other than what I've read so far & seen in an interview on NBAtv. All of which I liked, btw.

On the other hand I really like his game. He is not nearly as far behind as we are being led to beleive.

I think he still looks physically weak. And not just the 3-pointer than landed three feet short of the basket.

Reggie was skinny because he just couldn't gain weight, not because he was weak.

Speed
10-18-2006, 10:27 AM
I was really impressed with that quote today. Perfect attitude.

What's interesting is I came into this year thinking he'd be completely behind the curve unable to do anything and White would be a solid back up 2/3 in the rotation and after the first few games Williams seems way more ready than I thought (but still a long way to go) and White not even close.

Williams is much more mobile than I remember in college and much more active. I think he settled for the jumper too much in college, at times, but he hasn't done that at all so far.

disclaimer: I know it's ridiculously early.

Peck
10-18-2006, 10:44 AM
I think he still looks physically weak. And not just the 3-pointer than landed three feet short of the basket.

Reggie was skinny because he just couldn't gain weight, not because he was weak.

Jay I'm not trying to be sarcastic here I just don't know cause I haven't seen you say yet, but have you been to any of the games?

I've only been to one, I've missed the other two, but I just don't get where people say he's weak at all.

This guy has already started getting defined arms & his frame is pretty wide. I think physically he looks like a younger Stromile Swift.

I have no doubt that this guy will be a four btw he even plays in the post & is an active banger/rebounder.

I think he will get stronger & certainly he could use some more bulk, as Foster has for about 8 years, but I just don't see him as being weak.

ChicagoJ
10-18-2006, 11:09 AM
No, I haven't seen him in person yet.

Of course, I always thought Dale spent too much time "buffing" his chest and arms but not his core/ trunk/ hips/ thighs. So I may be looking at something different than you, as well.

Speed
10-18-2006, 11:25 AM
His numbers weight/height seem good, I remember the whole zero reps on his bench press, supposedly in the predraft evals, which had to be wrong, imo. To me, he seems to have frame for strength and after seeing Bender's horrific core strength as the baseline for really weak, Shawne seems really pretty good to me.

Swift, I don't see, but he's young. I see a bigger Bobby Simmons or Walt Williams, not game wise mind you, but body type/size, but I haven't seen him live until tomorrows game. I'm biased too, I can't stand Swift.

imawhat
10-18-2006, 05:56 PM
I've been trying to find some of the things I remember reading about Shawne. Here's what I've found so far...



Williams would be an "upside" pick. He has the talent to be a top-eight guy, but his mental approach is questionable.-Chad Ford Mock Draft

BigMac
10-18-2006, 10:08 PM
Don't take anything seriously during the draft, I remember hearing about Harrisons poor work ethic, and I haven't seen that. The only thing holding him back is PT('s).


But I thought the local hang out for the Pacers was Club Rio? :laugh:

(for those of you not local, PT's is another local strip club along the lines of Club Rio).

JayRedd
10-18-2006, 10:26 PM
I recall all the questions being more about "mental toughness", "willingness to work" and "lack of dedication" than about the Marcus Williams/Hassan Addams type of attitude questions.

I wonder about these quotes in another way:


"Phew," Williams said after scoring six points and committing four fouls in 14 minutes in the Pacers' 103-87 loss. "The speed is tremendous. The strength is something else, too. It's men out there. There are guys who have arms bigger than my legs."

"That's all they want to do, is help," he said. "They're always telling me things. It's not only when I mess up; it's when I do something right. That's key. I'm a competitor and I like it. "The best thing about this is I'm not feeling miserable about things. It's all a learning experience. I'm only 20 and it's a transition for me going from college to the NBA."

I know some people are advocating Shawne go down to the NBDL to work on his fundamental bball skills and the like.

But will going from Conference USA to the NBDL help him get used to this stuff? I know he won't get much time at all on an actual NBA court if he stays, but does it really help to play against worse competition than you will play against eventually? Or is just playing to play worth it?

I don't have an answer at all myself. Just wondering what yall think.

From what I've seen the NBDL has it's shares of big bodies and near NBA athletes, but the actual intensity would pale in comparison to Big East or ACC games.

Naptown_Seth
10-18-2006, 11:45 PM
I was gonna say, we were told Harrison was lazy and he's been anything but lazy.

Change the "L" to a "Cr" any it breaks down, though.

Don't worry, David. I still love ya.
I will insert the required by law response...

"You wouldn't like him when he's angry" :furious:

;)

Anthem
10-19-2006, 12:00 AM
I thought Shawne looked good in his limited minutes. He got some run at the end of the first half, and willingly ran out on the court with only garbage time left. As others have noted, he might be ready sooner than we thought.

Anthem
10-19-2006, 12:02 AM
I will insert the required by law response...

"You wouldn't like him when he's angry" :furious:

;)
Wow, Hulk had a nice Smash And One in the third quarter... brought the crowd up.

Evan_The_Dude
10-19-2006, 12:25 AM
Um, do you guys REALLY want to find out the truth behind Shawne Williams' attitude? I don't. Especially now.

Kegboy
10-19-2006, 09:24 PM
The rep on Williams was he took games off, and disappeared in big games. I never heard anything about attitude problems, unless you call a questionable work ethic an attitude problem.