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View Full Version : Pacers tell Mardy Collins he is on their radar at 17



Frank Slade
06-26-2006, 09:21 AM
Posted on Mon, Jun. 26, 2006

homegrown star: Temple's Collins logs workout mileage.
By Mike Jensen

Inquirer Staff Writer


The mock NBA drafts have former Temple guard Mardy Collins all over the first round, from the late lottery to the last picks of the round.

Judging by the feedback Collins has been getting, those mock drafts probably have it right. He figures he could go anywhere in that range.

Recent weeks have been stressful ones, Collins said, because he has been flying all over the country, working out for as many NBA teams as possible, trying to answer any questions they have about his game.

"It's real tiring," Collins said last week in a telephone interview from Indianapolis, after working out with the Indiana Pacers. "You're in a different city every day."

Sort of like the NBA itself... .

"Except those guys aren't in coach class - my knee banging up against the back of the chair in front of me," Collins said.

He wasn't complaining. He knows that one of the chief purposes of these workouts is to test players, find out how competitive they are under difficult conditions, in addition to getting to know them as people and seeing their conditioning.

Collins, who played at Simon Gratz High, averaged 16.8 points per game as a Temple senior and led the Owls with an average of 4.0 assists.

As a 6-foot-6 guard, he feels confident that he has impressed a lot of teams with his man-to-man defending, against both big and small guards. Another asset is how strong he is with the ball.

The biggest questions? His shooting and quickness.

Collins knows that. He figured that of the 10 workouts he had taken part in to that point, he had shot well in four. In others, he was so-so from the outside, Collins said, although he believes that in virtually all of them he demonstrated his ability to get to the basket and to make good decisions.

The scouting reports from his Temple games will show all that, and his Owls coaches believed that Collins had one of the highest basketball IQs they had ever seen.

How all that fits in, Collins can't know before Wednesday's draft. The teams have a battery of questions for him. When those are done, they typically ask whether Collins has any questions. He usually asks where they see him fitting in on their team. That's what he asked last week of Larry Bird, the Pacers' president of basketball operations, and Rick Carlisle, Indiana's coach.


The bottom line: Their answers tell him he will be in the NBA next year. He won't be taking commercial flights.

"They said I'm definitely on their radar for the 17th pick," Collins said.

Philadelphia Enquirer (http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/sports/14901876.htm)

indygeezer
06-26-2006, 09:31 AM
This from NBA Draft.net


Mardy Collins
Birthdate: 8/4/84
NBA Position: PG/SG
College: Temple
Class: Senior
Ht: 6-6
Wt: 205
Hometown: Philadelphia, PA
High School: Simon Gratz
Team Site Profile 2005
Stats

NBA Comparison: Aaron McKie

Strengths: At 6-6 he's got the ability to run the show from the point guard position ... Very smooth offensive abilities ... Plays a controlled game, doesn't try to be too flashy or make spectacular plays, keeps it simple and effective ... Excellent vision and passing ... Shooting mechanics and fundamentals are very good ... Good ball handler ... Long arms help out with closing passing lanes and getting to the rim ... Good defender coming out of the Temple system which emphasizes defense ... Excellent at anticipating passes, ball hawking style ... Great team player, excellent versatility ... Extremely durable player, plays almost 40 minutes every game, and rarely if ever misses a start.
Weaknesses: Never a bigtime scorer, although the Temple system limits him somewhat in that regard ... Shooting %s have never been great from outside, although these numbers get hurt by collapsing defenses and forced shots taken with the shot clock running low ... Lacks a very athletic body, especially on appearance ... Not a very physical player, should use his size advantage better offensively ... Not a huge leaper, lacks great explosiveness or a devastating first step ... Upside is decent, but not off the charts ... One of those guys who is solid in a number of areas, but fails to stand out in any one area ... Must become better at moving without the ball, can be a little too ball dependant ... Free throw shooting is below average ...

-Aran Smith 1/2/06

NOTE the comment I bolded!

FrenchConnection
06-26-2006, 09:36 AM
I think that Mardy Collins would be a good pick-up at the 17 if Rondo is already gone. A PG with good size could help off-set starting Fred at the 2, where the two players could switch on the defensive end. If you were to get a pre-injury Aaron McKie at the #17 in such a weak draft, I think that you did pretty well.

Kaufman
06-26-2006, 10:07 AM
This is a standard answer the Pacers give everyone they work out.

FrenchConnection
06-26-2006, 10:11 AM
You are right Kaufman. They probably told him that so that he would leak the information. This is probably a smoke screen, but I do like Collins as a player. He was held back a bit by the system at Temple.

Hicks
06-26-2006, 10:20 AM
I think Collins sounds like a good draft choice. I don't believe this news means we'll take him, but we should at least be considering him. Having a truly strong defensive PG, and a big one no less, could do wonders for us.

Chauncey
06-26-2006, 10:35 AM
He reminds me of another Temple guy, Eddie Jones. Not on the same scale athletically as Eddie was coming out of college (someone find the clip of the fingerroll from 18 feet or the dunk over 2 people from the free throw line), but he's very similar.

Every player at Temple ends up being a good defender and Collins has Eddie's size and long arms as well.

Robertmto
06-26-2006, 11:00 AM
Is that the same Gratz High School that Rasheed went to?

owl
06-26-2006, 11:39 AM
I doubt the Pacers take Collins. He is slow and this team is slow enough
on the perimeter.


owl

Jon Theodore
06-26-2006, 11:54 AM
A point guard who is slow and can't shoot...yeah we really need ANOTHER one of those. :laugh:

Trader Joe
06-26-2006, 11:58 AM
"Pacers tell Mardy Collins he is on their radar at 17."

Translated:

"Sorry, Mardy there is no chance in hell we are taking you, but you make a damn good smoke screen."

Just say no to Mardy his stock has dropped like a rock. Anyone's who is compared to Aaron McKie is not someone I want around.

rel
06-26-2006, 12:12 PM
i'd be somewhat disappointed if we selected Collins

there are other prospects i'd have selected before Collins

Slick Pinkham
06-26-2006, 12:23 PM
Anyone's who is compared to Aaron McKie is not someone I want around.

I can tell you are 18 from that comment.

He's had a 12 year career cut short by injuries, but at his peak a few years ago was a top 6th man and a very solid draft pick at (ironically) the 17th pick of the 1994 draft.

The Pacers could and a lot of other teams could do a lot worse than pick somebody like a healthy Aaron McKie.

:twocents:

Steve McQueen
06-26-2006, 12:26 PM
Actually, asides from that nice little run he had with Philly back in the early 2000's, Aaron McKie has pretty much sucked ***.

Stryder
06-26-2006, 12:30 PM
Actually, asides from that nice little run he had with Philly back in the early 2000's, Aaron McKie has pretty much sucked ***.

Actually, he is a lot better than most players.

Slick Pinkham
06-26-2006, 12:33 PM
Somebody please make a list of #17 picks in the NBA draft over the past 20 years and we can line them up by skill levels.

I guarantee you that McKie will be nowhere near the back.

I'm not saying he was great, but it's pretty rare to get an all-star or even a high-impact starter with the #17 pick.


Players picked BEFORE Aaron McKie in 1994:

6 PHI Sharone Wright Clemson
11 SEA Carlos Rogers Tennessee State
12 MIA Khalid Reeves Arizona
14 NJN Yinka Dare George Washington
16 GSW Clifford Rozier

Jon Theodore
06-26-2006, 12:42 PM
mckie did have one very good year that i can remember

Steve McQueen
06-26-2006, 12:48 PM
Actually, he is a lot better than most players.
You wouldn't happen to be related to Mr. McKie would you? What has he ever done prior to, or after, his stint in Philly? I don't even recall what teams hes played on the past few years....I think he was with the Lakers this past season?

Unclebuck
06-26-2006, 12:56 PM
OK since PT asked here it is

2004 - Josh Smith
2003 - Zarko Cabarkapa
2002 - Juan Dixon
2001 - Michael Bradley
2000 - Desmond Mason
1999 - Cal Bowdler
1998 - Nesterovic
1997 - Johnny Taylor
1996 - JO
1995 - Bob Sura
1994 - McKie
1993 - Greg Graham
1992 - Doug Christie
1991 - Victor Alexander
1990 - Jerrod Mustaf


History shows draft picks are always over valued prior to the draft. At 17 if you can get a guy who is in the league for 10 years and starts for one or two years, you have a great pick

Slick Pinkham
06-26-2006, 01:02 PM
JO, Josh Smith, Juan Dixon, Desmond Mason, Sura, Christie, and maybe Rasho would be above McKie.


So he's 8th on the 15 man list, so Aaron McKie is about the average you would expect for a #17 pick.

That's not getting me all excited going into Wednesday.

Young
06-26-2006, 01:03 PM
Ok who a player is compared to means nothing! Freaking Luke Ridnour was compared to John Stockton just because both are short and white. Luke doesn't player like Stockton. Don't pay attention to comparrisons!

With that said, I still wouldn't want Collins. A good defender and durable but I feel like we need some speed on the perminter. The fact that Collins is so durable makes him intriguing IMO.

Kaufman
06-26-2006, 01:53 PM
When I talked to the Pacers a few weeks ago they told me that I too was on the radar screen...

Trader Joe
06-26-2006, 01:57 PM
I can tell you are 18 from that comment.

He's had a 12 year career cut short by injuries, but at his peak a few years ago was a top 6th man and a very solid draft pick at (ironically) the 17th pick of the 1994 draft.

The Pacers could and a lot of other teams could do a lot worse than pick somebody like a healthy Aaron McKie.

:twocents:

Let me rephrase, I think there are better prospects than Collins. Personally I just think it is unwise to use a first rounder on a guy you know will at best be McKie. Collins is not what we need. We need speed and athleticism. Diaz, Douby, S. Williams etc. are all guys I would take before McKie. Trust me I remember seeing McKie in Philly and I was not all that impressed.

Pacersfan.
06-26-2006, 02:29 PM
Pacers seem to have good luck with players picked at the 17th spot....JO...Granger.

FrenchConnection
06-26-2006, 02:46 PM
OK since PT asked here it is

2004 - Josh Smith
2003 - Zarko Cabarkapa
2002 - Juan Dixon
2001 - Michael Bradley
2000 - Desmond Mason
1999 - Cal Bowdler
1998 - Nesterovic
1997 - Johnny Taylor
1996 - JO
1995 - Bob Sura
1994 - McKie
1993 - Greg Graham
1992 - Doug Christie
1991 - Victor Alexander
1990 - Jerrod Mustaf


History shows draft picks are always over valued prior to the draft. At 17 if you can get a guy who is in the league for 10 years and starts for one or two years, you have a great pick

UB, you are spot on here. Prospects get ranked against each other, so when the draft is especially weak the players look much better than they actually are. What compounds this fact is that in weak draft years, college basketball is usually at a downpoint in terms of talent (hence the weak draft), which makes it harder to get handle on players' skill level. If you can get a guy that outlives his rookie contract due do a strenght in one area of the game (exceptional shooter, great defender, etc...) in this draft at the #17, then you have done your homework. The majority of the 2006 first round will be in Europe in three years.

blanket
06-26-2006, 03:02 PM
The majority of the 2006 first round will be in Europe in three years.

I'm not a big fan of the talent in this year's draft, but I'd definitely take you up on that bet. :signit:

JayRedd
06-26-2006, 03:10 PM
<TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=3 width="92%" border=0><TBODY><TR vAlign=top><TD>For those of you interested in comparisons of the Mardy Collins comparison to Aaron Mckie, here is the list of which players McKie most closely compared to each year from www.basketball-reference.com (http://www.basketball-reference.com)



Most Similar Season at Age
23. Bernard Thompson (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/t/thompbe01.html) (944)
24. Alvin Williams (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/willial02.html) (955)
25. Elston Turner (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/t/turneel01.html) (941)
26. David Wingate (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/wingada01.html) (940)
27. Kelly Tripucka (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/t/tripuke01.html) (936)
28. Vern Fleming (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/f/flemive01.html) (927)
29. Charlie Scott (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/scottch01.html) (942)
30. Doc Rivers (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/riverdo01.html) (937)
31. Chris Ford (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/f/fordch01.html) (944)
32. T.R. Dunn (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/dunntr01.html) (885)

<SMALL> </SMALL>
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

FrenchConnection
06-26-2006, 03:19 PM
I'm not a big fan of the talent in this year's draft, but I'd definitely take you up on that bet. :signit:

Did I say that that I was accepting bets? I was exagerating. The lottery picks will stick as six men on playoff teams or starters on bad teams, while other will find a career as role players or defenders. I would bet that if you were to average the number of players still on NBA rosters five years after they are drafted from the past ten drafts, that the number of failures in this draft will beat that average hands down.

I am just making the point that if you get anything in this draft if you are not picking in the lottery you have done a great job. My point is that we start to like this group of players. What happens is that they become like a bunch of new toys that we can discuss for about three weeks leading up to the draft. It helps kill the long off season. In fact, if I had a pick 20 or lower, I would be looking to trade into upper third of the second round. Those players could be just as good and you don't have to pay them if they don't pan out.


<table border="0" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" width="92%"><tbody><tr valign="top"><td>For those of you interested in comparisons of the Mardy Collins comparison to Aaron Mckie, here is the list of which players McKie most closely compared to each year from www.basketball-reference.com (http://www.basketball-reference.com)



Most Similar Season at Age
23. Bernard Thompson (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/t/thompbe01.html) (944)
24. Alvin Williams (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/willial02.html) (955)
25. Elston Turner (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/t/turneel01.html) (941)
26. David Wingate (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/wingada01.html) (940)
27. Kelly Tripucka (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/t/tripuke01.html) (936)
28. Vern Fleming (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/f/flemive01.html) (927)
29. Charlie Scott (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/scottch01.html) (942)
30. Doc Rivers (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/riverdo01.html) (937)
31. Chris Ford (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/f/fordch01.html) (944)
32. T.R. Dunn (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/dunntr01.html) (885)

<small></small>
</td></tr></tbody></table>

Doesn't look good. But hoopshype compares Collins to Jaric, and since i would never compare Jaric to McKie, I think that the comparisons are not accurate in any way. I still hope that either Rondo, Sefelosha, Ager, Shannon Brown or Reddick are on the board. One of those has to be available so I think that Collins is a long shot.

ChicagoJ
06-26-2006, 03:34 PM
I like Aaron McKie. Our team could use an Aaron McKie or two. And we're talking about the 17th pick in a weak draft.

I should just stay out of this thread.

fwpacerfan
06-26-2006, 03:41 PM
This from NBA Draft.net


Mardy Collins
Birthdate: 8/4/84
NBA Position: PG/SG
College: Temple
Class: Senior
Ht: 6-6
Wt: 205
Hometown: Philadelphia, PA
High School: Simon Gratz
Team Site Profile 2005
Stats

NBA Comparison: Aaron McKie

Strengths: At 6-6 he's got the ability to run the show from the point guard position ... Very smooth offensive abilities ... Plays a controlled game, doesn't try to be too flashy or make spectacular plays, keeps it simple and effective ... Excellent vision and passing ... Shooting mechanics and fundamentals are very good ... Good ball handler ... Long arms help out with closing passing lanes and getting to the rim ... Good defender coming out of the Temple system which emphasizes defense ... Excellent at anticipating passes, ball hawking style ... Great team player, excellent versatility ... Extremely durable player, plays almost 40 minutes every game, and rarely if ever misses a start.
Weaknesses: Never a bigtime scorer, although the Temple system limits him somewhat in that regard ... Shooting %s have never been great from outside, although these numbers get hurt by collapsing defenses and forced shots taken with the shot clock running low ... Lacks a very athletic body, especially on appearance ... Not a very physical player, should use his size advantage better offensively ... Not a huge leaper, lacks great explosiveness or a devastating first step ... Upside is decent, but not off the charts ... One of those guys who is solid in a number of areas, but fails to stand out in any one area ... Must become better at moving without the ball, can be a little too ball dependant ... Free throw shooting is below average ...

-Aran Smith 1/2/06

NOTE the comment I bolded!

Not to be a naysayer but here is Jamal Tinsley's NBADraft.net bio from 2001:


NBA Comparison: Mark Jackson

Strengths: Electric ballhandler, and passer.. Very good strength and determination.. Can knock down the 3 ball or shots off the dribble.. Very good at creating for teammates, and running the show.. Excellent quickness, plays big in big games..

Weaknesses: Shot selection needs to improve.. Playing under the control at all times...

Slick Pinkham
06-26-2006, 03:43 PM
For those of you interested in comparisons of the Mardy Collins comparison to Aaron Mckie...

Their similarity scores are often crazy.

Look up Larry Bird and you will se him scored as similar to Garnett, Malone, C-Webb,

and also similar to Tom Gugliotta, Larry Kenon, Alvan Adams, and Toni Kukoc.

:crazy:

FrenchConnection
06-26-2006, 04:02 PM
Their similarity scores are often crazy.

Look up Larry Bird and you will se him scored as similar to Garnett, Malone, C-Webb,

and also similar to Tom Gugliotta, Larry Kenon, Alvan Adams, and Toni Kukoc.

:crazy:

Yeah, any forward that can shoot is compared to Larry come draft time.

Slick Pinkham
06-26-2006, 04:09 PM
but basketball-reference.com supposed makes comparisons based upon statistical analysis of the players.

If Alvan Adams is similar to Larry Bird, then I'm a lot like a duck.

Leisure Suit Larry
06-26-2006, 04:09 PM
Don't forget Keith Van Horn

Jermaniac
06-26-2006, 07:20 PM
6-6 PG, YESUR. You got to do it.

circlecitysportsfan
06-26-2006, 09:11 PM
A point guard who is slow and can't shoot...yeah we really need ANOTHER one of those. :laugh:

Word. Not interested.

Pig Nash
06-26-2006, 09:23 PM
maybe it's a smokescreen of a smokescreen. I mean that if they said that he was on the radar, nobody thinks he actually is so they don't move up and we still get him! Grasping at straws, aren't I?

BoomBaby31
06-26-2006, 09:30 PM
We better not take Mardy Collins as our 17th maybe our second round pick. I remember this guy, he doesn't push the ball well, he isn't that accurate of a shorter, and usually runs the shot clock down looking for a pass. His height is okay I guess but, please don't take him at #17 surely we take someone else. Farmer, Sergio, Rondo. REDICK PLEASE! Lol.. We aren't taking collins no way surely.

Kaufman
06-26-2006, 09:31 PM
Well I think that they tell everyone who comes in to work out that they are on the radar screen - I mean, obviously. That's why we're working them out. I don't think they are lying to say that someone is or isn't, I just think its a guaranteed thing that you're on the radar just by getting a work out...

Kegboy
06-26-2006, 09:51 PM
Some comments:

- I'd be perfectly happy if we drafted Collins, but I doubt we will.

- Larry and Rick were both at the workout? Wow, I thought they weren't talking to each other. :chuckle:

- As Chauncey said, Temple players are by and large good defenders. They also tend to be tough and smart. For their coaches to say Collins has one of the best bball-IQ's they've seen is a tremendous compliment.

- Comparing Collins to McKie is like comparing Brad Miller to Brian Cardinal. Just cause they went to the same school doesn't mean they're the same player.

- I haven't Ignored anybody in ages, but I'm tempted to with the youngin's who equate McKie with the broken down version of the last couple years. Go back and watch the Pacers-Philly series in '99, '00, and '01. No team back then fielded a better defensive wing than Lynch and McKie.

SoupIsGood
06-26-2006, 10:40 PM
He supposedly has a great basketball IQ. If that's true, then he's not a bad pick at all. I just think some better players might be available for us. He's probably a safe pick though.

Anthem
06-26-2006, 11:58 PM
My biggest issue with taking collins at #17 is that he's projected to go later than that.

I'd love to trade down with New Jersey, if they'd do it.

Evan_The_Dude
06-27-2006, 12:36 AM
Does it really matter who we draft? We're all going to over rate and convince ourselves to believe how good or great whoever we pick will be anyway. Yep, I know I'll be one of them too...

SOS, different year.

D-BONE
06-27-2006, 07:28 AM
- I haven't Ignored anybody in ages, but I'm tempted to with the youngin's who equate McKie with the broken down version of the last couple years. Go back and watch the Pacers-Philly series in '99, '00, and '01. No team back then fielded a better defensive wing than Lynch and McKie.

In addition to great D, McKie developed reasonable 3pt shooting and, most of all, was very team oriented (i.e. accepted and played his role to a T). Certainly no superstar but not a bad piece to add to a team.


does it really matter who we draft? We're all going to over rate and convince ourselves to believe how good or great whoever we pick will be anyway. Yep, I know I'll be one of them too...

This, of course, is human nature. Going along with what I stated above and what you state, I'm looking more for someone who can be a solid contributor, not necessarily a big star. That would suffice and probably be more likely at our draft position. If we get more than I expect (like last year for example), then it's just icing on the cake.



My biggest issue with taking collins at #17 is that he's projected to go later than that.

I'd love to trade down with New Jersey, if they'd do it.

Given the unpredictability yet seeming depth of this draft, I think staying put or your suggestion is a good strategy. Unless something surefire comes along as far as moving up. What do you think this trade might entail? Just a straight up swap of picks or could other pieces change hands?

Hicks
06-27-2006, 07:30 AM
Yeah, because we really over-rated Granger.....

Stryder
06-27-2006, 08:24 AM
Yeah, because we really over-rated Granger.....

I don't think he was referring to Granger...

*Cough*Bender*Cough*

Anthem
06-27-2006, 08:32 AM
Given the unpredictability yet seeming depth of this draft, I think staying put or your suggestion is a good strategy. Unless something surefire comes along as far as moving up. What do you think this trade might entail? Just a straight up swap of picks or could other pieces change hands?
I don't know. Jersey and Pheonix both have 2 late first-rounders and might want to try moving up. It really looks like there will be high-quality guys all the way through the first round. If the guy Bird wants is taken, I'd love to see us talk about trading down and getting more picks.

ChicagoJ
06-27-2006, 12:27 PM
I don't know. Jersey and Pheonix both have 2 late first-rounders and might want to try moving up. It really looks like there will be high-quality guys all the way through the first round. If the guy Bird wants is taken, I'd love to see us talk about trading down and getting more picks.

That's a great idea.

Probably means it won't happen.

Here's another suggestion: let's trade the #17 and SJax for the #21 from Phoenix. :D

grace
06-27-2006, 12:43 PM
*Cough*Bender*Cough*

:rolleyes: :punch:

Next person who disses Bender gets kicked in the privates.

That :deadhorse has been pulverized into dust.

Kegboy
06-27-2006, 07:23 PM
Here's another suggestion: let's trade the #17 and SJax for the #21 from Phoenix. :D

:laugh: :applaud:

Frank Slade
06-27-2006, 07:27 PM
That's a great idea.

Probably means it won't happen.

Here's another suggestion: let's trade the #17 and SJax for the #21 from Phoenix. :D

As long we get their 2011 2nd rounder I am in !:cool: