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View Full Version : I want the Pacers to go after Marquis Daniels



Unclebuck
06-22-2006, 09:02 AM
I don't know how the Pacers could get him, but I want him. The Mavs don't really need him, they have Josh Howard, Stackhouse, Terry (who they will re-sign) and Devin Harris.

Daniels contract:

2007 - 5.9
2008 - 6.4
2009 - 6.9
2010 - team option 7.4

The only downside is he does appear to be injury prone, other than that (and that needs to be investigated) I think he is a perfect player for the new NBA.

This is exactly the type of player the Pacers need to be looking for. a young player who is not getting the minutes he deserves. Someone who is a little bit of a gamble, but someone who if given the chance to play major minutes can be a difference maker.

Let's talk about his game a little bit. He's not a great shooter especially from beyond about 18 feet. He does have some point guard abilities, he is excellent defensively, and he is a slasher.

You may ask what position is he supposed to play, well probably shooting guard, but he can play point guard and small forward.

He is a type of player who just needs to be on the court. Put Daniels out on the court with Granger and a quick point guard who can defend and shoot and we have a real team again.

What would the Mavs want for him. That I don't know. The Mavs won't do it, but I'd trade Peja for him. That is how good I think he's going to be. Oh he'll never be a 20 point per game scorer, or an allstar, but he'll help your team win.

Pacers need to look into this

RWB
06-22-2006, 09:11 AM
I don't pay enough attention to other teams so I can only go by what you have posted UB.

Not to be a smart###, but that seems a little steep in price for a role player don't you think?

Chauncey
06-22-2006, 09:25 AM
Can't shoot to save his life, but he knows it and drives to the basket instead. I'm a very big fan. I would have traded Shaq to Dallas if they would have given up both Daniels and Howard in the package, but they wouldn't.

FrenchConnection
06-22-2006, 09:26 AM
I really don't want Daniels. In game 5, he just looked lost out there. As I developed an active interest in the series due to my budding hatred of Dwayne Wade, I really was cringing everytime Daniels was on the floor. He just does not seem to know where he is supposed to be.

Unclebuck
06-22-2006, 09:39 AM
I really don't want Daniels. In game 5, he just looked lost out there. As I developed an active interest in the series due to my budding hatred of Dwayne Wade, I really was cringing everytime Daniels was on the floor. He just does not seem to know where he is supposed to be.



You are correct, he didn't play well in game 5 , but he played well in game 6. Look, considering he hadn't played much at all and then to throw him out there, you can't expect him to play great. But his defense on Wade was as good as anyone the Mavs had and I saw some point guard skills from him.

I've liked his game for a couple of seasons now. The only thing that concerns me is his injuries. I need to look into that more.

Anthem
06-22-2006, 09:42 AM
Austin and the #17 works for Daniels and Pavel. Think there's anybody the Mavs want at #17?

Austin can do everything Keith Van Horne can do, which means they don't have to sign a backup PF.

Kegboy
06-22-2006, 09:47 AM
Austin and the #17 works for Daniels and Pavel. Think there's anybody the Mavs want at #17?

Austin can do everything Keith Van Horne can do, which means they don't have to sign a backup PF.

That would be wonderful.

Anthem
06-22-2006, 09:51 AM
That would be wonderful.
Unless they really need out from his contract in order to sign Terry, I don't think they'd do it. Surely they can get a better offer.

FrenchConnection
06-22-2006, 09:52 AM
Can we then just cut Pavel Podkolzin? He is the new Gheorghe Muresan but with less game. But just as ugly!

Anthem
06-22-2006, 10:09 AM
Can we then just cut Pavel Podkolzin? He is the new Gheorghe Muresan but with less game. But just as ugly!
You only say that because he hasn't gotten a chance to work with our big man coach... Chuck Person.

ChicagoJ
06-22-2006, 10:11 AM
-snip- I think he is a perfect player for the new NBA.

I'd rather have D. Wade. :-p

For all this talk of a "new NBA" - what won the championship? Fundamental inside-out basketball.

That will never go away - its been the same for a century. Its just that "legit" inside players are very scarce these days. But the teams that have a "legit" inside player will generally be contenders.

Slick Pinkham
06-22-2006, 10:21 AM
I'd rather have D. Wade. :-p

For all this talk of a "new NBA" - what won the championship? Fundamental inside-out basketball.

That will never go away - its been the same for a century. Its just that "legit" inside players are very scarce these days. But the teams that have a "legit" inside player will generally be contenders.

They won not as much inside-out as an inside presence and a slasher.

Wade's perimeter game has improved enormously but his bread and butter was getting into the lane and being unguardable in the era of no hand checking.

And he is the master at forcing the center to help then throwing it to the front of the rim for Shaq, though we didn't see that so much as all the inside scoops, banks, dunks, etc.

Jermaine can catch the ball and dunk it too, if ever we had a penetrator who can finish.

Unclebuck
06-22-2006, 10:21 AM
I'd rather have D. Wade. :-p

For all this talk of a "new NBA" - what won the championship? Fundamental inside-out basketball.

That will never go away - its been the same for a century. Its just that "legit" inside players are very scarce these days. But the teams that have a "legit" inside player will generally be contenders.


The Heat won not because of inside-out basketball but because of Wade.

But Jay if you think we can somehow acquire players as good as Shaq and a backup as good as Mourning, then I say great. let's go get them. But last time I checked there weren't any players like that anywhere. None that are available, so what do we do, we build the team a different way.

Skaut_Ech
06-22-2006, 10:26 AM
UB, I've been thinking the same thing all year.

RWB, he's only a role player because of their depth. Jermaine O'Neal was in the same situation with Portland, remember?

French Connection, he looked lost becasue he WAS lost, but, that's only becasue he doesn't get regular PT. His rookie year, he got spot minutes, then got to start for about 15 games as PG, when Nellie went to small ball. He put up some really big numbers, when given minutes. (How do I know this? He was on my fantasy basketball team! :blush::))

Guys, in my opinion, Marquis lost a step when Avery took over as coach. I think the combination of Avery not caring for him and being buried on the depth chart has doomed him. I've read time and again, for what that's worth, that he may be shopped.

What impresses me about Marquis is that he has a complete game. He playes good D, is a good ball handler and can slash or jump shoot. Not too great on the threeball, though.

I think he's one of those surprise players you're going to read about. He'll get traded to some team and get a chance to shine.

I hope it's us. :cloud9:

I personally think there's a deal that can be made. I can see a strong arguement being made for a Marquis for Austin package. They need a veteran and three point shooting and with Van Horn being injured so much and not that great of a defender, they may like the idea of Austin behind Dirk.

I think this is a guy who we can realistically get and I would really want. I'm with ya UB. You want to bring the picket signs for in front of Conseco, or should I?

Unclebuck
06-22-2006, 10:26 AM
Austin and the #17 works for Daniels and Pavel. Think there's anybody the Mavs want at #17?

Austin can do everything Keith Van Horne can do, which means they don't have to sign a backup PF.



I think the Mavs think more highly of Daniels than that and so does the rest of the league. But I could be wrong



I think this is a guy who we can realistically get and I would really want. I'm with ya UB. You want to bring the picket signs for in front of Conseco, or should I?


Well I will if the weather cools off a little. I guess I'm just a fair weather fan afterall

PacerFan31
06-22-2006, 10:26 AM
I've also wanted Daniels, I've said the same thing over at RealGM before.

Anthem
06-22-2006, 10:37 AM
I think the Mavs think more highly of Daniels than that and so does the rest of the league.
Well, I agree. But I don't see any other package that would really work for us.

Question: Would you be comfortable with Daniels as a third guard in a 3-guard rotation? Playing both backup point and backup SG?

Unclebuck
06-22-2006, 10:47 AM
Question: Would you be comfortable with Daniels as a third guard in a 3-guard rotation? Playing both backup point and backup SG?


That would be fine, but I think he's too good not to play at least 32 minutes per game

bulletproof
06-22-2006, 10:54 AM
I personally think there's a deal that can be made. I can see a strong arguement being made for a Marquis for Austin package. They need a veteran and three point shooting and with Van Horn being injured so much and not that great of a defender, they may like the idea of Austin behind Dirk.

Sounds like you're describing Cro.

Skaut_Ech
06-22-2006, 11:06 AM
Sounds like you're describing Cro.

LOL, True. Lemme say, better D than Van Horn and a better three point shot, who is not injured as much.

ABADays
06-22-2006, 11:22 AM
The only thing is he is injury prone :-o :eek: :yikes:

clemdogg
06-22-2006, 11:27 AM
Unclebuck started a thread calling for the Pacers to get Marquis Daniels. I totally agree with that. The thing is that I saw about 4 or 5 Dallas players during the Finals that I fell in love with. I would LOVE to get Terry, but that won't happen. I would even love to Harris, but I would settle for Daniels. The Mavs can't keep all three.

But speaking of a big body to play alongside JO? How bout Diop? This guy is a former lottery pick, and he can play. He hustles, plays d, and can move around and finish around the hoop. Like Unclebuck said, I don't know how we could make it happen because they are overstocked at positions from our trading block - pg, sg. What do you guys think?

rel
06-22-2006, 11:35 AM
what about a stephen jackson swap?

i've seen this jackson for daniels proposition brought up in RealGM and thought i'd put it out there

Steve McQueen
06-22-2006, 11:35 AM
It's just a situation of overzealous fans falling in love with players. Diop is terrible, he's Harrison minus any semblance of an offensive game.

Slick Pinkham
06-22-2006, 11:37 AM
DH > Diop

D-BONE
06-22-2006, 11:41 AM
Go after Marquis Daniels? YES! YES! YES! YES! YES! YES! YES! YES!

ChicagoJ
06-22-2006, 11:41 AM
Absolutely. We've already got a guy that could turn into a top-tier C in "the new NBA". (Although, yes, that's a bad indictment of the overall quality of big-men today.)

D-BONE
06-22-2006, 11:46 AM
It's just a situation of overzealous fans falling in love with players. Diop is terrible, he's Harrison minus any semblance of an offensive game.

Yes to the offensive comparison, but less foul prone, more mature, and harder working IMO.

Hopefully David can overcome his difficulties with more experience, but I don't see why Diop wouldn't qualify as this defensive minded banger that's often trumpted as being the missing element to help JO.

I suppose the point is moot b/c I don't think Dallas is in a rush to move Diop anyway.

clemdogg
06-22-2006, 11:47 AM
None of us really know how good DH can be because HE CAN'T STAY ON THE FLOOR. He's got mental problems man. For everything we were discussing yesterday as far as needing mental toughness to do well in the league, how can anyone tell me DH has it?


Yes to the offensive comparison, but less foul prone, more mature, and harder working IMO.

Hopefully David can overcome his difficulties with more experience, but I don't see why Diop wouldn't qualify as this defensive minded banger that's often trumpted as being the missing element to help JO.

I suppose the point is moot b/c I don't think Dallas is in a rush to move Diop anyway.

Thats exaclty correct.

ChicagoJ
06-22-2006, 11:54 AM
Nah, he's got foul-problems. And a coach that fouls him out with just four fouls (two each half).

Let him play through the frustration and getting to know the refs, and some of the other baggage should go away. It happens to every young C, and the only cure is playing time and the confidence that comes with it.

Leisure Suit Larry
06-22-2006, 12:02 PM
Why stop at Daniels and Diop. How about that German fellow, he looks like he can play. This trade works:

AJ + Jackson + Cro for the German fellow + Diop

We can only do this trade if my Wade trade doesn't go through for some reason because AJ is the centerpiece of that deal.

Young
06-22-2006, 12:07 PM
I wouldn't mind a swap of Stephen Jackson for Marquis Daniels and I think it makes sense for Dallas.

I don't know that they will be paying Terry the money he will want, and they do need a scorer with Terry and Stackhouse having uncertain futures. The Mavs could use Jackson's scoring and it's not like they used MD much.

Now what they would want for Diop...I don't know. I don't see why they would trade Diop, he's a cheap productive center. He played some good defense on Duncan and Shaq, IMO. Diop is still only like 24 so he will still only get better. He averaged almost 2 blocks a game in under 20 minuates per contest this year. I wish we could get that out of our centers.

But yeah, I wouldn't mind swaping Stephen Jackson for Marquis Daniels. I don't see why Dallas would trade Diop, but yes I think they would give us Daniels.

SoupIsGood
06-22-2006, 12:07 PM
This is exactly the type of player the Pacers need to be looking for. a young player who is not getting the minutes he deserves. Someone who is a little bit of a gamble, but someone who if given the chance to play major minutes can be a difference maker.



:harrison:

vapacersfan
06-22-2006, 12:09 PM
:harrison:

No, he said a "difference maker" ;)

Steve McQueen
06-22-2006, 12:11 PM
Yes to the offensive comparison, but less foul prone, more mature, and harder working IMO.

Hopefully David can overcome his difficulties with more experience, but I don't see why Diop wouldn't qualify as this defensive minded banger that's often trumpted as being the missing element to help JO.

I suppose the point is moot b/c I don't think Dallas is in a rush to move Diop anyway.
More mature and harder working maybe, but Diop is just as foul prone as Harrison.

SoupIsGood
06-22-2006, 12:19 PM
Harder working? Methinks not.

Diop was fat as hell and did nothing over in Cleveland for years.

Young
06-22-2006, 12:21 PM
Harder working? Methinks not.

Diop was fat as hell and did nothing over in Cleveland for years.

He was like 18 when he came into the league with the Cavs.

While Diop didn't do anything for the Cavs, what has Harrison done for the Pacers?

ChicagoJ
06-22-2006, 12:24 PM
If Harrison hasn't done anything for the Pacers, I look to the coach that is holding him back.

Harrison has absolutely dominated the paint - at both ends of the court - during stretches of games.

Yes - he's got to learn to NOT use his hands. He needs playing time. And a big-man coach.

Steve McQueen
06-22-2006, 12:25 PM
He was like 18 when he came into the league with the Cavs.

While Diop didn't do anything for the Cavs, what has Harrison done for the Pacers?
Not cost them the 8th pick in the draft?

Diop's offensive game makes Ben Wallace look like Kevin McHale.

SoupIsGood
06-22-2006, 12:26 PM
He was like 18 when he came into the league with the Cavs.

While Diop didn't do anything for the Cavs, what has Harrison done for the Pacers?

A heck of a lot more than Diop ever did with the Cavs.

Being 18 excuses him from getting himself in shape? David went to work and got himself in shape after one year, as soon as he knew what it'd take to be in NBA shape.

CableKC
06-22-2006, 12:41 PM
It's just a situation of overzealous fans falling in love with players. Diop is terrible, he's Harrison minus any semblance of an offensive game.

Harrison's offense >>>>>>> Diop's offense
Diop's defense >>>>>>> Harrison's defense

Diop has been credited for bringing on a decent defensive mentality inside the paint for the Mavs alongside Dampier.

If Harrison can develop his defensive skills....which I think he is capable of...given another 2 or 3 years......then he would be more then just an offensive "1-trick" pony....just like Diop is ( and most likely ) will be only defensive "1-trick" pony.

Steve McQueen
06-22-2006, 12:51 PM
Harrison's offense >>>>>>> Diop's offense
Diop's defense >>>>>>> Harrison's defense

Diop has been credited for bringing on a decent defensive mentality inside the paint for the Mavs alongside Dampier.

If Harrison can develop his defensive skills....which I think he is capable of...given another 2 or 3 years......then he would be more then just an offensive "1-trick" pony....just like Diop is ( and most likely ) will be only defensive "1-trick" pony.
I'd say it's more like....

Harrisons offense >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Diops offense

Diops defense >>> Harrisons defense

Diop is garbage, I can't believe there's actually people talking about bringing him here. I bet there were also a lot of Nazr Mohammed fan boys after the Spurs championship last season. :laugh:

CableKC
06-22-2006, 01:00 PM
I'd say it's more like....

Harrisons offense >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Diops offense

Diops defense >>> Harrisons defense

Diop is garbage, I can't believe there's actually people talking about bringing him here. I bet there were also a lot of Nazr Mohammed fan boys after the Spurs championship last season. :laugh:

If Harrison can figure out a way to stay out of foul trouble....I can see him become more of the type of player that Diop is to Dirk....a guy that can help control the paint due to his size, can rebound and block shots.....difference being that he will have an offensive game that can complement JONeal.

Also...there is no way that Avery Johnson or the Mavs will let Diop go. Diop is more of a role-player that hovers around the paint to get rebounds, block out players and ( on the defensive end ) block shots. It allows Dirk to roam beyond the low-post so that he can take his patented mid-range to high post jumpshots.....I feel that Diop may not be a complete Big Man ( clearly a one-dimensional player ) but I think he complements Dirk very well.

Young
06-22-2006, 01:06 PM
A heck of a lot more than Diop ever did with the Cavs.

Being 18 excuses him from getting himself in shape? David went to work and got himself in shape after one year, as soon as he knew what it'd take to be in NBA shape.

No it doesn't excuse Diop from being in shape. But I think that is a big reason why he didn't produce for the Cavs.

I don't see what Diop didn't do for the Cavs has to do with him now.



Harrison has absolutely dominated the paint - at both ends of the court - during stretches of games.

Harrison has dominated? WTF you can't be serious. I know you said during stretches, but by that do you mean one play here in there? Maybe we are watching different games or something because I don't see Harrison dominated during stretches of games.

Look, David could end up being a solid player. But some of you seriously overrate him. Maybe I underrate him though, but DH is seriously overratted around here.

Unclebuck
06-22-2006, 01:14 PM
How in the world this thread turned into a David Harrison thread, I'll never know

Since86
06-22-2006, 01:19 PM
Harrison has dominated? WTF you can't be serious. I know you said during stretches, but by that do you mean one play here in there? Maybe we are watching different games or something because I don't see Harrison dominated during stretches of games.

Look, David could end up being a solid player. But some of you seriously overrate him. Maybe I underrate him though, but DH is seriously overratted around here.

Harrison dominated the last regular season game they had against the Cavs.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=260301027

"After moonlighting with middle-age hacks the night before, David Harrison played through a gimpy ankle to give the undermanned Indiana Pacers a lift."

First line of the espn game recap.

purdue101
06-22-2006, 01:23 PM
marquis daniels would be a solid pickup. the perfect compliment to peja on the wing is a guy who can slash and defend, which fits daniels to a T.

pietrus and hassell are two other guys i believe would be a good fit.

i doubt dallas would want jax as they have a good core of perimeter players. foster is a guy they maybe interested in though. i believe his salary matches daniels too.

vapacersfan
06-22-2006, 01:24 PM
If Harrison hasn't done anything for the Pacers, I look to the coach that is holding him back.

Harrison has absolutely dominated the paint - at both ends of the court - during stretches of games.

Yes - he's got to learn to NOT use his hands. He needs playing time. And a big-man coach.

I have not been overly impressed with him, FWIW.

Later in the year I liked his offensive game, but unlike others I refuse to put all the blame on his coach/coaches.

He has a lot of potential, but so did Bender.

Steve McQueen
06-22-2006, 01:25 PM
Actually, I had a list of some of Harrisons games throughout the season, and there were many where he dominated in limited minutes.

A game against the Wizards, a couple of games vs Detroit etc.

Fireball Kid
06-22-2006, 02:26 PM
Marquis Daniels for Stephen Jackson? Hmm. I'd have to think about that one.:chin:

Arcadian
06-22-2006, 02:29 PM
I like Daniels. He is a good defender who gives a team a lot of match up options.

ChicagoJ
06-22-2006, 02:34 PM
The regular season game in New Jersey comes to mind - Mark Jackson was raving about Harrison during the Nets' telecast. Marv Albert even jokingly told Jackson that Harrison might be the best #13 in Pacers' history.

And then, a few plays later, was the spectacular block of RJ's dunk attempt.

I thought David dominated the game during the third quarter of Game #4 of the playoffs, getting 10 FT attempts (although he shot a horrible %, negating his positive impact on the game.)

Harrison and Granger were the two best players on the court during the second half of the Detroit game.

As a rookie, ahem, second-year center, his "domination" comes in short bursts - three or four minutes here, five minutes there. But opposing coaches feel compelled to adjust up to him, because if they try to play small and quick he abuses them - especially at the offense end of the court.


In order to understand/ appreciate a post player, you've got to watch the post player for the entire possession and not the ball. When David's in the game, I often can't tell you where the ball is, because I'm watching the center matchup. There have been many times where David has established superior position yet his teammates don't get him the ball.

D-BONE
06-22-2006, 02:38 PM
I'd say it's more like....

Harrisons offense >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Diops offense

Diops defense >>> Harrisons defense

Diop is garbage, I can't believe there's actually people talking about bringing him here. I bet there were also a lot of Nazr Mohammed fan boys after the Spurs championship last season. :laugh:

All-Star Cs they'll never be, but I hardly think they qualify as garbage. Especially in light of repeated calls for a a defensive-minded big man to take pressure of JO.

Either of these guys would be good to split minutes with DH in the pivot since they all have a degree of foul attraction and DH is still developing. I'm talking hypothetically b/c neither one do I expect to see in a Pacers uni.

Point being they are valuable players within their limitations. DH has the talent to eventually surpass both, but only time will tell if he will actually realizes that potential.

ChicagoJ
06-22-2006, 02:47 PM
How in the world this thread turned into a David Harrison thread, I'll never know

Somebody threw out the Diop suggestion, which would be a downgrade from Harrison.

Unclebuck
06-22-2006, 02:58 PM
Somebody threw out the Diop suggestion, which would be a downgrade from Harrison.

it would really?

Suaveness
06-22-2006, 03:20 PM
it would really?

I'd say so. But then again, I don't think either are that good (Harrison has the possibility), so it's like choosing the lesser of two evils.

Mourning
06-22-2006, 03:38 PM
Someone posted a Foster for Daniels deal. I would do that. I would actually add a 2nd rounder if they would want that.

Draft someone who can play PF or C and I think we could be on our way to restoring our strength as a pretender team and hopefully when the right decisions choices are made after that a contender team. Yes, I think Daniels could be that important, BUT like UB said his injuries are a serious concern.

Regards,

Mourning :cool:

Trader Joe
06-22-2006, 04:21 PM
Jackson for Daniels is perfect for us. Daniels is younger more athletic better handles. Give him Jack's amount of shots per game and he will get 16-18 points easily.

SoupIsGood
06-22-2006, 05:43 PM
How in the world this thread turned into a David Harrison thread, I'll never know

Well I have wanted Daniels for a long time. He would go a long way towards solving our guard issues.
Dunno how we get him though.

FrenchConnection
06-22-2006, 05:46 PM
Jackson for Daniels is perfect for us. Daniels is younger more athletic better handles. Give him Jack's amount of shots per game and he will get 16-18 points easily.

But the main problem with Jack is the number of shots. We need someone that can get 16-18 with about 2/3 of the shots that Jack takes.

SoupIsGood
06-22-2006, 05:47 PM
I don't see what Diop didn't do for the Cavs has to do with him now.





I was proving that Diop is not the harder worker.

Although I like Diop too, liked him with the Cavs even, even though he blew.

We need another big center to play 24 minutes a game. I think David can play 24 minutes a game next year. We need another. I don't really care if they are foul prone, as long as they play physical and are allowed to play with a few fouls.

Nene, Kendrick Perkins? We need one of them. Maybe someone else. But one more big, active body, please! Get it done Larry! :sunshine:


Edit - I would also love trading up in the draft to get that additional big guy. Trade up to around 10 or so, and take Shelden Williams. Hoohaa!! A Williams/Harrison duo at center would make me happy.

Trader Joe
06-22-2006, 05:58 PM
But the main problem with Jack is the number of shots. We need someone that can get 16-18 with about 2/3 of the shots that Jack takes.

I guess my point was I think Daniels could do that, I just never got there lol.

clemdogg
06-22-2006, 08:58 PM
Hey I got news for you guys. Besides Shaq and Elton Brand, and maybe a few others, there aren't a lot of post scorers out there who are centers. Theres been so much discussion in this forum about how JO is a great weakside blocker and needs a big body to compliment him on the blocks. I totally agree with all of that. I don't want a C to come in here and score. Besides foul trouble, that is probably the biggest reason DH isn't on the floor. You have to ask yourself...What is he going to do if JO? We can't have two players posting up at the same time, but we can have a big guy on the other block cleaning up offensive rebounds, and who can fill the void in the post when JO is off the court.

Consider the top 4 teams in the league this year. They all had a non-offensive productive C.
Dallas - Diop and Dampier
Miama - Zo
San Antonio - Nasterovic and Mohammed
Detroit - Ben Wallace

So stop complaining about offensive post skills. Just get a guy in here to rebound when JO doesn't feel like it, which is often, and a guy who can play some D and block some shots...who is MORE athletic than Duncan the way Diop did).

Anthem
06-22-2006, 09:22 PM
Hey I got news for you guys. Besides Shaq and Elton Brand, and maybe a few others, there aren't a lot of post scorers out there who are centers.
Wait... Brand is a center?

pizza guy
06-23-2006, 02:14 AM
I've thought about having Daniels here before; never mentioned it, but I did think about it. I'd like to have him, I like his game - especially if we keep Peja - I just don't think he gets a fair amount of PT. I don't know anything about his injury proneness, but if it's severe, that makes me pause.

As for the C position: get some one to backup Harrison next year, and I'll be happy.

Robertmto
06-23-2006, 03:12 AM
Alot of ppl are saying names that aren't centers that they want to play center.

Get it done Donnie!

:devil:

Unclebuck
06-23-2006, 10:05 AM
I don't want to start a new thread for this:

Bobby Jackson is a free agent. Yes he's 33 years old and injury prone, but I love his game.

Robertmto
06-23-2006, 07:14 PM
Actually, I had a list of some of Harrisons games throughout the season, and there were many where he dominated in limited minutes.

A game against the Wizards, a couple of games vs Detroit etc.

What game di dhe dominate against the Wizards?

O points and 1 rebound on Dec. 8

5 points and 1 rebound on Jan. 13

4 points and 7 rebounds on Jan. 31

12 points and 9 rebounds on March 1

none of those games were dominated by Harrison.

Mav
06-24-2006, 12:44 AM
Hello guys. I actually suggested a package involving Quis for Artest earlier this year. I don't remember the specifics but it may have included salary relief in the form of KVH. Anyway most of you seemed to want Howard instead ...

Anyway, at that time 'Quis was on a nice run....averaging about 18 pts; 6 boards and 6 assists over a period of 8 or 10 games. Avery Johnson described Quis as his "Sean Elliott" ... and there were a lot of fans who rated him HIGHER than Howard, although there aren't many who would say that today, really for two reasons. One, Howard stepped up and has established himself as a rising star in the league. And two, because Quis got hurt......again.

The good news is that Marquis Daniels is not injury prone. He's just the most unlucky player I've ever seen. This year he went down after a vicious clothesline by Kurt Thomas neary decapited him on his way toward a dunk. Then when he finally made it back his appendix blew out and he had to have surgery. When he finally made it back the Mavs had really started to play well with Adrian Griffin in the starting lineup. (Griff is bigger than Quis and he guards "big guards" better than Daniels does....) The Mavs went on a 10 or 12 game winning streak and when all was said & done Daniels told the coach to let it roll with Griffin. Quis didn't want to mess up a good thing, so he said he would come off the bench when Avery needed him. From that point on he never really got back into the regular rotation.

The ONLY reason the Mavs might move Daniels is because, at this point, they could really use a bigger and more physical defender than Daniels. It's strange but Daniels is an awesome PG defender... literally awesome (as some noted he handled Wade better than just about anyone) ... but he can't guard big guards, and that's what the Mavs need.

I would hate to see Daniels go. Stackhouse was recently quoted as saying "if Marquis played somewhere else he'd be a superstar." .... Note he didn't say "a star," he said a "superstar." And prior to Avery Johnson taking over, Don Nelson thought so too.

Now, I can't say I agree for sure, but I tell you one thing - Quis is MUCH better than what anyone has seen. He can get his shot whenever he wants it - which is very rare. He has a soft touch and is excellent around the backet. He will post you up. He will drive and pull up for an eight or twelve footer. And he is the best passer on the Mavs roster. What he won't do is hit anything over 18 feet with any regularity.

Let me know if you have any questions. I'll be pleased to answer what I can.

rel
06-24-2006, 12:49 AM
Hello guys. I actually suggested a package involving Quis for Artest earlier this year. I don't remember the specifics but it may have included salary relief in the form of KVH. Anyway most of you seemed to want Howard instead ...

Anyway, at that time 'Quis was on a nice run....averaging about 18 pts; 6 boards and 6 assists over a period of 8 or 10 games. Avery Johnson described Quis as his "Sean Elliott" ... and there were a lot of fans who rated him HIGHER than Howard, although there aren't many who would say that today, really for two reasons. One, Howard stepped up and has established himself as a rising star in the league. And two, because Quis got hurt......again.

The good news is that Marquis Daniels is not injury prone. He's just the most unlucky player I've ever seen. This year he went down after a vicious clothesline by Kurt Thomas neary decapited him on his way toward a dunk. Then when he finally made it back his appendix blew out and he had to have surgery. When he finally made it back the Mavs had really started to play well with Adrian Griffin in the starting lineup. (Griff is bigger than Quis and he guards "big guards" better than Daniels does....) The Mavs went on a 10 or 12 game winning streak and when all was said & done Daniels told the coach to let it roll with Griffin. Quis didn't want to mess up a good thing, so he said he would come off the bench when Avery needed him. From that point on he never really got back into the regular rotation.

The ONLY reason the Mavs might move Daniels is because, at this point, they could really use a bigger and more physical defender than Daniels. It's strange but Daniels is an awesome PG defender... literally awesome (as some noted he handled Wade better than just about anyone) ... but he can't guard big guards, and that's what the Mavs need.

I would hate to see Daniels go. Stackhouse was recently quoted as saying "if Marquis played somewhere else he'd be a superstar." .... Note he didn't say "a star," he said a "superstar." And prior to Avery Johnson taking over, Don Nelson thought so too.

Now, I can't say I agree for sure, but I tell you one thing - Quis is MUCH better than what anyone has seen. He can get his shot whenever he wants it - which is very rare. He has a soft touch and is excellent around the backet. He will post you up. He will drive and pull up for an eight or twelve footer. And he is the best passer on the Mavs roster. What he won't do is hit anything over 18 feet with any regularity.

Let me know if you have any questions. I'll be pleased to answer what I can.

as a mavs fan...would you do a Stephen Jackson & Marquis Daniels swap?

by the way, thanks for the info

Mav
06-24-2006, 01:01 AM
Probably not. Jackson didn't seem to have a great year and he finished with PER below league average ... less than 14, I think. I love Jackson's toughness but he may think he's a better player than he is. In the end I would say the attitude carries too much baggage to add to a team that may only be a piece (or a whistle) away.

Of course that's just my perception... I only saw maybe 8 or 10 Pacer games this year and I wasn't really keying on Jackson. How's his perimeter defense? I remeber - when he was a Spur - defense was a calling card.

I could be completely wrong about him... like I said, perception is that he is a hothead who might prefer to score.

Fireball Kid
06-24-2006, 02:08 AM
Now, I can't say I agree for sure, but I tell you one thing - Quis is MUCH better than what anyone has seen. He can get his shot whenever he wants it - which is very rare. He has a soft touch and is excellent around the backet. He will post you up. He will drive and pull up for an eight or twelve footer. And he is the best passer on the Mavs roster. What he won't do is hit anything over 18 feet with any regularity.


I think it was last year when we still had Finley, and Marquis was coming off a 7 game injury. It was his second game back and he damn near had a triple-double against the Sacramento Kings. He had 29 points, 9 rebounds and 8 assists. He CAN play, he just needs to stay healthy. He's not injury-prone, it's just bad luck. No way in hell do I want to give up this guy for Wacko Jacko. In a way, I would rather trade Stackhouse so Marquis could get his minutes but I don't think that's gonna happen.

D-BONE
06-24-2006, 08:09 AM
Probably not. Jackson didn't seem to have a great year and he finished with PER below league average ... less than 14, I think. I love Jackson's toughness but he may think he's a better player than he is. In the end I would say the attitude carries too much baggage to add to a team that may only be a piece (or a whistle) away.

Of course that's just my perception... I only saw maybe 8 or 10 Pacer games this year and I wasn't really keying on Jackson. How's his perimeter defense? I remeber - when he was a Spur - defense was a calling card.

I could be completely wrong about him... like I said, perception is that he is a hothead who might prefer to score.

He could help out on D. He's still strong in that area. On the other hand, your observations on his offense and attitude are correct.

I honestly think on a better team with the right coach his attitude would improve. Avery Johnson IMO would be much more likely to keep him in line and productive than a vanilla guy like Carlisle .

Of course, even if that happens, there's still the inflated offensive ego thing, which he'd have to overcome in big D. It's been suggested that it developed out of him being thrust into a high priority in the Pacer's offense due to injuries, suspensions, trades, etc.. However, seems he may have picked it up in Hotlanta.

Unclebuck
06-24-2006, 08:17 AM
as a mavs fan...would you do a Stephen Jackson & Marquis Daniels swap?

by the way, thanks for the info



I think that is insulting to the Mavs and their fans. Marq is better than that and it will take more than that to get him. But if the Mavs did go for it is a no-brainer for the Pacers.

pizza guy
06-24-2006, 05:12 PM
I wouldn't expect the Mavs to take SJax for Daniels. What may be more intriuging is a S&T Freddie Jones. I think he fits into their team better than SJax would, though Stephen is probably a better defender if that's what you're looking for.

Frank Slade
06-25-2006, 12:22 PM
Well UB it at least appears if rumors are to be believed, Daniels may be availalbe.




Colangelo has feelers out for any number of trade scenarios. He has rising free agent guard Mike James, whom the Raptors won't keep but can include in sign-and-trade deals next month, to package with the pick in potential deals. The most recent rumor, late Friday, involved James going to Dallas in a package for guard Marquis Daniels, but Colangelo wouldn't comment when reached Friday afternoon.

Philadelphia Inquirer (http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/sports/14894639.htm)

CableKC
06-25-2006, 02:33 PM
FRAK.......with Terry likely going.......Mike James may fill a similiar niche at a slightly cheaper price. Daniels could fit in well with a younger and developing Raptors lineup.

Anthem
07-01-2006, 09:17 AM
Thought this deserved a bump after the new info in this thread:

http://www.pacersdigest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22054

Dallas offered Daniels in a S&T for Mike James, and the Raptors rejected it.

I hadn't seriously considered this, but now I'm curious as to what the Mavs would want.

Would you give both Fred and AJ for Daniels?

blanket
07-01-2006, 09:51 AM
Thought this deserved a bump after the new info in this thread:

http://www.pacersdigest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22054

Dallas offered Daniels in a S&T for Mike James, and the Raptors rejected it.

I hadn't seriously considered this, but now I'm curious as to what the Mavs would want.

Would you give both Fred and AJ for Daniels?

That's probably too much to give up for him

Unclebuck
07-01-2006, 10:23 AM
I'd love a starting backcourt of Mike James and Daniels. That would be ideal. Two very good defenders. Somewhat interchangible (Daniels can run the point and James can play shooting guard).

But I think James is going back to Houston.

I'd trade Fred and AJ for Daniels. it would have to be a 3 team trade

wintermute
07-01-2006, 10:50 AM
how about a 3-way deal with toronto and dallas:

we s&t peja to toronto

toronto will s&t mike james to dallas

dallas sends us marquis daniels

this assumes that peja wants out and toronto is willing to give him the deal he wants.

this trade might need a few more pieces to make the numbers work. i know some of you would prefer to have mike james, but i'd rather have marquis myself.

while we would be giving up the best player in peja, we could do a lot worse than this deal if he walks.

Unclebuck
07-01-2006, 10:54 AM
how about a 3-way deal with toronto and dallas:

we s&t peja to toronto

toronto will s&t mike james to dallas

dallas sends us marquis daniels

this assumes that peja wants out and toronto is willing to give him the deal he wants.

this trade might need a few more pieces to make the numbers work. i know some of you would prefer to have mike james, but i'd rather have marquis myself.

while we would be giving up the best player in peja, we could do a lot worse than this deal if he walks.


I'd do that. The only thing I'd want to know is what else we could get for Peja in a sign and trade and what the Pacers are going to get for Jamaal, Jax.

But overall I'd do that three way trade.

Anthem
07-01-2006, 10:57 AM
I'd trade Fred and AJ for Daniels. it would have to be a 3 team trade
Because Dallas wouldn't want Fred or AJ?

Unclebuck
07-01-2006, 10:59 AM
Because Dallas wouldn't want Fred or AJ?


They want James, and I don't think they want AJ. Fred maybe.

Mourning
07-01-2006, 11:22 AM
how about a 3-way deal with toronto and dallas:

we s&t peja to toronto

toronto will s&t mike james to dallas

dallas sends us marquis daniels

this assumes that peja wants out and toronto is willing to give him the deal he wants.

this trade might need a few more pieces to make the numbers work. i know some of you would prefer to have mike james, but i'd rather have marquis myself.

while we would be giving up the best player in peja, we could do a lot worse than this deal if he walks.

I'm open to this one, though I think we without doubt give up the best player who has a good character aswell. I would want a little more.

Also, I would have to be pretty sure we get a 3-point shooting SG in this summer.

Let me correct myself: I would have to be pretty sure we get a GOOD 3-point shooting SG in this summer.

And as a last ALSO (;)), I would also want to know how Marquis Daniel's got his injuries and how subsceptile he is getting new ones, or otherwise put... is he injury-prone?

Regards,

Mourning :cool:

pizza guy
07-01-2006, 11:43 AM
Somewhere in this thread I think his injuries were explained. I'm too lazy to find that post, but I do remember that they weren't normal - I think one was a clothesline or something - they were freak accidents and I don't think he qualifies as injury-prone.

I would love to have Daniels here. I think a S&T with Freddie is a decent deal, but I don't know the kind of contracts we're looking at. Freddie has essentially been our 6th man, but that changed to Danny over this season. Daniels has been religated to about the 7th or 8th spot behind Stack. So both teams would be trading a good 6th man, that was simply replaced due to circumstances beyond their control. We'd get a good SG, whether we want him to start or not is debatable (I would) and Dallas would get a good back-up SG that would fit well in their up and down, transition, penetration style offense (and he's a decent defender, too).

Maybe other pieces need to be added to make it fit, but the deal boils down to Freddie for Quis, and I'd love it.

SoupIsGood
07-01-2006, 11:43 AM
how about a 3-way deal with toronto and dallas:

we s&t peja to toronto

toronto will s&t mike james to dallas

dallas sends us marquis daniels

this assumes that peja wants out and toronto is willing to give him the deal he wants.

this trade might need a few more pieces to make the numbers work. i know some of you would prefer to have mike james, but i'd rather have marquis myself.

while we would be giving up the best player in peja, we could do a lot worse than this deal if he walks.

That would be great, especially if we could squeeze a little more out of one of the teams...

SoupIsGood
07-02-2006, 01:19 PM
----------

Marquis' numbers as a starter last year:

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y173/SoupIsGood/marquis.jpg


I would really love to have this guy as our 2 guard next year. He's a solid role player.

Anthem
07-02-2006, 02:01 PM
----------

Marquis' numbers as a starter last year:

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y173/SoupIsGood/marquis.jpg


I would really love to have this guy as our 2 guard next year. He's a solid role player.
Did you look at his 3-point percentage?

SoupIsGood
07-02-2006, 02:18 PM
So what? He can't make threes, so he doesn't shoot them. Fine by me.

It'd also be an upgrade from Jack. He can't make threes but shoots them anyhow.

Anthem
07-02-2006, 02:28 PM
So what? He can't make threes, so he doesn't shoot them.
Then I don't want him as our shooting guard unless we're getting rid of Jermaine.

We need shooters... especially with Peja gone.

SoupIsGood
07-02-2006, 02:31 PM
Then I don't want him as our shooting guard unless we're getting rid of Jermaine.

We need shooters... especially with Peja gone.

What he brings in his game elsewhere makes up for not being able to shoot threes. We need people who create off the dribble even more than we need shooters.

rexnom
07-02-2006, 03:57 PM
I just want to add my approval to this. He needs saving from the Mavs's bench. That kid is way too good not to play.

Unclebuck
07-05-2006, 10:37 PM
I still cannot believe we actually got him and for Croshere.

The Mavs will have to send us something else to make the salaries work

vapacersfan
07-05-2006, 10:39 PM
So Donnie, any chance you can get me a job as a intern next year ;)


Great call UB. I would buy you a beer, but I'm not 21 and it would be warm by the time it got to you :)

Skaut_Ech
07-05-2006, 10:47 PM
UB, I've been thinking the same thing all year.

RWB, he's only a role player because of their depth. Jermaine O'Neal was in the same situation with Portland, remember?

French Connection, he looked lost becasue he WAS lost, but, that's only becasue he doesn't get regular PT. His rookie year, he got spot minutes, then got to start for about 15 games as PG, when Nellie went to small ball. He put up some really big numbers, when given minutes. (How do I know this? He was on my fantasy basketball team! :blush::))

Guys, in my opinion, Marquis lost a step when Avery took over as coach. I think the combination of Avery not caring for him and being buried on the depth chart has doomed him. I've read time and again, for what that's worth, that he may be shopped.

What impresses me about Marquis is that he has a complete game. He playes good D, is a good ball handler and can slash or jump shoot. Not too great on the threeball, though.

I think he's one of those surprise players you're going to read about. He'll get traded to some team and get a chance to shine.

I hope it's us. :cloud9:

I personally think there's a deal that can be made. I can see a strong arguement being made for a Marquis for Austin package. They need a veteran and three point shooting and with Van Horn being injured so much and not that great of a defender, they may like the idea of Austin behind Dirk.

I think this is a guy who we can realistically get and I would really want. I'm with ya UB. You want to bring the picket signs for in front of Conseco, or should I?

Can't I get some love, too!!

SoupIsGood
07-05-2006, 10:49 PM
Can't I get some love, too!!

:love:



;)

Unclebuck
07-05-2006, 10:51 PM
Skaut, I knew someone in here thought we could get Daniels for Cro, and I must admit until about 20 minutes ago I thought you were somwhere between crazy and insane

Slick Pinkham
07-05-2006, 10:57 PM
Can't I get some love, too!!

:buddies:



Now tell us who we can get for Jax!

Unclebuck
07-05-2006, 11:03 PM
OK, I'm starting a new thread, titled I want the Pacers to go after _______. name the player

It worked on Daniels, it could work again

Suaveness
07-05-2006, 11:03 PM
OK, I'm starting a new thread, titled [b] I want the Pacers to go after _______. name the player

Dwayne Wade. Just do it.

SoupIsGood
07-05-2006, 11:05 PM
OK, I'm starting a new thread, titled I want the Pacers to go after _______. name the player

It worked on Daniels, it could work again

Mike James?

Kegboy
07-05-2006, 11:17 PM
Mike James?

LeBron James.

dynamis22
07-05-2006, 11:25 PM
OK, I'm starting a new thread, titled I want the Pacers to go after _______. name the player


Brevin Knight

Kid Minneapolis
07-06-2006, 12:14 AM
Nice call, Unclebuck.

Robertmto
07-06-2006, 12:16 AM
Mid 90's MJ

Pacersfan.
07-06-2006, 12:23 AM
This proves that Pacers' officials look at these forums ;)

sixthman
07-06-2006, 01:13 AM
Can't I get some love, too!!

Wonderful call. When I read that before, I think I remember rolling the old eyes and saying, "No way, Jose".

Congrats on the post.

SoupIsGood
08-03-2006, 03:07 AM
I just finished watching 'Quis play 43 minutes of basketball (game recording), and I'm even more intrigued by what he brings to our team.

I kind of wonder if we shouldn't just make him our starting PG. He's not a pure point guard, but that doesn't mean he can't be a succesful point guard. I dunno. If I, at this point, had to choose between counting on Tinsley to be healthy and happy, or instead starting 'Quis at PG and just telling him to do his thing out there, I would probably choose 'Quis and just see how things go.

I need to think about this a little more though. Rawle, Josh, and Darrell also all played in the game I watched. I'll post more thoughts about in more detail sometime I think, maybe in a week or so.

Skaut_Ech
08-03-2006, 07:19 AM
I don't think i want him playing the Pg with any regularity, BUT I wouldn't mind seeing him do a lot of the ballhandling from the SG position *which leads back into that discussion we all had about Saras and MD being on the court at the same time probably being the a likely sympatico relationship).

MAke sure you get back to us with your impressions of Rawles and Josh. I'm curious to get your opinions. I know quite a few folks were calling them "scrubs", but I think both guys can be keepers.

SoupIsGood
08-03-2006, 09:03 AM
I don't think i want him playing the Pg with any regularity, BUT I wouldn't mind seeing him do a lot of the ballhandling from the SG position *which leads back into that discussion we all had about Saras and MD being on the court at the same time probably being the a likely sympatico relationship).

MAke sure you get back to us with your impressions of Rawles and Josh. I'm curious to get your opinions. I know quite a few folks were calling them "scrubs", but I think both guys can be keepers.

Well, ideally that is what I want to. But - let's assume both Jax and Tins are gone eventually (and dear god I hope that's a safe assumption).

That means that Daniels is starting for us at one of the guard spots, as I think he should be. However, if we want to play him as a 2, that means that Larry/Donnie have got to somehow find a way to bring in a quality 1, whereas bringing in a quality 2 and moving 'Quis to PG might be an easier thing to accomplish.


But, I dunno, I still haven't thought this over a whole lot. In 5 days or so I'll probably give the game another look and write more about the 4 Mavies.

Edit - some other quicks thought:

I can't even begin to describe how refreshing it was to watch Marquis play. He never even thought about shooting a three, or shooting outside of 15 feet even. Every time he had the ball and did something with it, he slithered his way at least to the FT line and would work from there. Sometimes he popped up a slight fade, sometimes he kicked it out to an open teammate, or sometimes he just took it to the hole. I know this is no amazing observation, it's just great to see someone who isn't tempted by the stupid outside shot.


Also, Powle seems like a guy with good lower body strength for his size/height. His legs looked like tree trunks compared to JO's (which may not be saying much, lol)