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View Full Version : The Official Pacers vs. Bulls Post-Game Thread (Pacers lose, 102-96)



Shade
04-04-2006, 10:49 PM
This has got to be the biggest bunch of underachieving chokers since...well...since ever. 29-6 Bulls run to end the game.

I'm completely done with this team. It's time to call a mulligan and reshuffle.

:puke:

Brian
04-04-2006, 10:50 PM
This has got to be the biggest bunch of underachieving chokers since...well...since ever. 29-6 Bulls run to end the game.

I'm completely done with this team. It's time to call a mulligan and reshuffle.

:puke:


I am with you 110%.

Lord Helmet
04-04-2006, 10:51 PM
Choke. Choke. Choke.

Suaveness
04-04-2006, 10:52 PM
I only listened to the last 4 min and I got pissed off. They should be ashamed of themselves. They are a disgrace to the NBA.

Ragnar
04-04-2006, 10:52 PM
Rick lost this game. He needs to be fired tonight. They should have done it months ago but the least they could do is remedy the situation now.

OnlyPacersLeft
04-04-2006, 10:52 PM
they choked harder than a slut on a d...nevermind....
this team sucks! what else can we say?

Brian
04-04-2006, 10:53 PM
PS..Im glad I quit tivo'ng games.Now I have more room for "Bonds On Bonds".

owl
04-04-2006, 10:53 PM
It took some effort to lose that game. To bad they could not put that
effort and smarts to winning.


owl

Aw Heck
04-04-2006, 10:53 PM
So, a 5 game losing streak. Sadly, this isn't our longest losing streak this season. They had a 6 game losing streak back in January. But I guess we can match that tomorrow night.

What's the point of making the playoffs? They're just going to get swept. There's no pride in that.

pacers11789
04-04-2006, 10:54 PM
The bull's announcer's were going crazy saying bull's win bull's win!!!...The bull's didn't win it the pacer's lost it.

Jon Theodore
04-04-2006, 10:54 PM
i was rooting for the bulls. I really wanted them to lose.

It's official, I can no longer root for a team with Jermaine O'neal, TInsley, and Sjax. I am officially declaring my de fandom of pacers. It is a very sad day, but this team is a joke to me.

Jermaine, you are the worst player to be called a leader in the history of the entire existence of the word leader.

#31
04-04-2006, 10:54 PM
Doesnt this game remind you of one of the Vintage Reggie vs Knicks game? But Gordon vs Pacers? PACERS HAS JUST BEEN SHOWN WHAT THEY DONT HAVE, CLUTCH / HEART / SOUL.

sweabs
04-04-2006, 10:54 PM
Please understand that I am not trying to place this loss solely at the feet of Jermaine.

But come on.

Is this what we get from our franchise player for millions and millions of dollars? You would think that one of the top power forwards in the game would have an absolute field-day against the smallest team in the league.

Once again, there is plenty of blame to go around after tonight's loss - just as there is for any other loss. But it always seems to be the same old story. Same guys, same problems, same *****, different year.

owl
04-04-2006, 10:55 PM
I am beginning to wonder with the slow footedness of this team
if Peja should be re-signed. I have never seen a much slower team.
They were completely out-quicked.


owl

317Kim
04-04-2006, 10:55 PM
I dont know weather to laugh or cry. I have to FINALLY admit that yes, my favorite team in the world just sucks. :sigh: :kickcan:

Fireball Kid
04-04-2006, 10:56 PM
This team seems to have lost all its heart and soul.

Unclebuck
04-04-2006, 10:57 PM
To blame Rick is assinine.

This started with that loss in Milwaukee way back in November, and for whatever reason that game more than any other this season set the tone.

I do wonder how many "lucky" three point shots opponents have hit against the pacers late in games. Mo Williams, Ben Gordon, Manu, and I know there were several others.

The sad part is for much of the game tonight the Pacers played very well, with great energy, efoort and enthusiasm.

This loss will linger and impact the game tomorrow night

Brian
04-04-2006, 10:57 PM
This team has do-do where their hearts should be.

Ragnar
04-04-2006, 10:57 PM
i was rooting for the bulls. I really wanted them to lose.

It's official, I can no longer root for a team with Jermaine O'neal, TInsley, and Sjax. I am officially declaring my de fandom of pacers. It is a very sad day, but this team is a joke to me.

Jermaine, you are the worst player to be called a leader in the history of the entire existence of the word leader.

I am not sure you can blame Jamaal for Rick leaving AJ in, or Jack who was hot but could not get the ball in the 4th to save our game. Jermaine played well as did Jeff. Rick is entirely responsible for this loss.

burnzone
04-04-2006, 10:58 PM
This is unacceptable.

It's one thing if you just get beat by the better team, but still give it 110%, and lay it all out on the floor.

But to have a 17 point lead in the 4th, and let it slip, in the way they did, is f***ing ridiculous.

I'll give Chicago credit, they're a scrappy team, and they fought to deserve this win.

But the Pacers got lazy when they had that lead, and starting settling for jumpshots, and didn't rotate defensively, and just got out hustled.

When people wonder why Indiana fans are so hard on their team, and boo, it's not that they're hard on the team for no reason, it's because the Pacers show an obvious lack of heart, effort, and consistency, and those are 3 major things that are hard as hell to palate as a Pacers fan.

I know not every team is going to win 60 games, and dominate, but damn, if they would just be consistent, and give maximum effort, and show that they care about the name on the front of their jersey, then the times we lose, would be a lot easier to accept.

Obviously, we all know big changes are going to be made in the next offseason, I just hope they can get this thing straightened out sooner than later.

obnoxiousmodesty
04-04-2006, 10:58 PM
The worst part is that as this season progresses, the losses bother me less and less.

Southside_Pacer
04-04-2006, 10:58 PM
Pretty much it's time to think about who actually WILL be here compared to who won't be....

Ragnar
04-04-2006, 10:59 PM
To blame Rick is assinine.

This started with that loss in Milwaukee way back in November, and for whatever reason that game more than any other this season set the tone.

I do wonder how many "lucky" three point shots opponents have hit against the pacers late in games. Mo Williams, Ben Gordon, Manu, and I know there were several others.

The sad part is for much of the game tonight the Pacers played very well, with great energy, efoort and enthusiasm.

This loss will linger and impact the game tomorrow night

Sorry UB I cant see how you cant see it. Rick let the Bulls back into a game we were winning running away. AJ and Sarunas should not have been in there after the 8:30 mark Rick is the one who left them in not the other players. You dont let a young team back into a game on their home court you just dont do it.

sweabs
04-04-2006, 10:59 PM
I do wonder how many "lucky" three point shots opponents have hit against the pacers late in games.

You know as well as I do that the Pacers have themselves to blame for that.

Those "lucky" three pointers come with momentum. And it's the Pacers who give teams that extra drive and energy down the course of games. They set themselves up for these types of losses. Then, those shots suddenly don't become "lucky" but more or less expected.

317Kim
04-04-2006, 10:59 PM
The worst part is that as this season progresses, the losses bother me less and less.

Same here. It went from an 85% impact to a 23.2% impact.

Unclebuck
04-04-2006, 10:59 PM
I am not sure you can blame Jamaal for Rick leaving AJ in, or Jack who was hot but could not get the ball in the 4th to save our game. Jermaine played well as did Jeff. Rick is entirely responsible for this loss.



Rick tried to bring Jamaal back in, but he trhwos the ball away and then flops leaving Ben wild open, Rick had no choice but to put AJ back in. Don't forget AJ did steal the ball from Ben twice in the 4th quarter.

Stryder
04-04-2006, 11:00 PM
In the business of the game, the coach gets the axe.

I think it is time for Mr. Carlisle to go...

Fireball Kid
04-04-2006, 11:00 PM
i was rooting for the bulls. I really wanted them to lose.

It's official, I can no longer root for a team with Jermaine O'neal, TInsley, and Sjax. I am officially declaring my de fandom of pacers. It is a very sad day, but this team is a joke to me.

Jermaine, you are the worst player to be called a leader in the history of the entire existence of the word leader.

I'm with you Jon. I do not enjoy watching this team. Its just a bunch of individuals thrown together creating a pile of crap.

Bird, if your reading this, keep Granger, Harrison, Saras, Foster, Pollard and Croshere. Trade everyone else.

P.S. Get rid of Rick too.

Ragnar
04-04-2006, 11:00 PM
But the Pacers got lazy when they had that lead, and starting settling for jumpshots, and didn't rotate defensively, and just got out hustled.



Dont blame the bench for being in the game when they had no business being in the game blame the coach.

#31
04-04-2006, 11:01 PM
Whats up with you people? The problem was not Pacers, they didnt "choke" even if they made some shots they wouldnt win! The Difference was GORDON, he took over the game and NOTHING could stop him.

Unfortunatly the only player Pacers have like that is working for TNT now...

Unclebuck
04-04-2006, 11:02 PM
Sorry UB I cant see how you cant see it. Rick let the Bulls back into a game we were winning running away. AJ and Sarunas should not have been in there after the 8:30 mark Rick is the one who left them in not the other players. You dont let a young team back into a game on their home court you just dont do it.



Wait a minute, weren't AJ and Saras on the court in the first half when the pacers made their 15-2 run and weren't they in the game at the start of the 4th when an 11 point mead ballooned to 17. Why do we sometimes want the coach to go wioth the hot hand and other times we don't.

This isn't about Rick, this is about criticizing coaches when it is completely unwarranted.

4040
04-04-2006, 11:03 PM
I'll join you in the avatar change Pacers_Gurl.

Ragnar
04-04-2006, 11:03 PM
Rick tried to bring Jamaal back in, but he trhwos the ball away and then flops leaving Ben wild open, Rick had no choice but to put AJ back in. Don't forget AJ did steal the ball from Ben twice in the 4th quarter.

I supose you did not see the far more than 2 times AJ thew the ball away or the inability to get the ball to open players? Rick made a stupid mistake and he lost this game you are just too loyal to see it. You watch these games with a filter on.

Understand I am not just talking about him not putting Tinsley back in at the 8:30 mark. I am talking about not putting the starters ALL OF THEM back in when he should have. Playing AJ and Sarunas out of position when it would have been easy to play them at their natural positions and of course yanking Tinsley over anything yet he leaves AJ in even when he starts making ally oop passes to the other team!!!

Unclebuck
04-04-2006, 11:04 PM
I have no problem with the Pacers effort tonight, I thought it was very good. That was not the problem tonight.


Does anyone think Jamaal deserves to stay in the game after what he did right when he came back into the game

Ragnar: you suggest I have a filter on when I watch the games. Unbelieveable !

Ragnar
04-04-2006, 11:04 PM
Wait a minute, weren't AJ and Saras on the court in the first half when the pacers made their 15-2 run and weren't they in the game at the start of the 4th when an 11 point mead ballooned to 17. Why do we sometimes want the coach to go wioth the hot hand and other times we don't.

This isn't about Rick, this is about criticizing coaches when it is completely unwarranted.

Its one thing for a bench to make a run against the other teams bench but when the other coach is smart enough to put their starters back in and start to run then ours should also have the good sense to put his starters back in. How can you not see that?

tora tora
04-04-2006, 11:04 PM
This team doesn't suck, the coaching staff does. Period.

Stryder
04-04-2006, 11:04 PM
Wait a minute, weren't AJ and Saras on the court in the first half when the pacers made their 15-2 run and weren't they in the game at the start of the 4th when an 11 point mead ballooned to 17. Why do we sometimes want the coach to go wioth the hot hand and other times we don't.

This isn't about Rick, this is about criticizing coaches when it is completely unwarranted.

So, at what point then, will it be warranted?

burnzone
04-04-2006, 11:05 PM
But the Pacers got lazy when they had that lead, and starting settling for jumpshots, and didn't rotate defensively, and just got out hustled.

Dont blame the bench for being in the game when they had no business being in the game blame the coach.


Uh, I'm not sure if you were meaning to quote something else, but I didn't think that particular statement in my post said anything at all about the bench, or who was in the game, or anything about the coach at all.

When I talked about feeling like they got lazy when they ahd the lead, I just mean as far as just 'going through the motions', and not making any effort to get good shots, or get to the line.

grace
04-04-2006, 11:05 PM
Don't forget AJ did steal the ball from Ben twice in the 4th quarter.

I'm a big a fan of AJ as anybody but all I can remember is him not being able to get the ball inbounds. :sad:

Jermaniac
04-04-2006, 11:06 PM
COUGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
COUGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH I CANT BREATHE

Shade
04-04-2006, 11:06 PM
They just asked Reggie his thoughts on tonight's game. He had this to say:

http://hk.geocities.com/miller_reggie08/miller_with_no_ball08.jpg

#31
04-04-2006, 11:07 PM
I'll join you in the avatar change Pacers_Gurl.

WORD! How bout mine? From the man himself! :D

Ragnar
04-04-2006, 11:08 PM
Uh, I'm not sure if you were meaning to quote something else, but I didn't think that particular statement in my post said anything at all about the bench, or who was in the game, or anything about the coach at all.

When I talked about feeling like they got lazy when they ahd the lead, I just mean as far as just 'going through the motions', and not making any effort to get good shots, or get to the line.

The bench players were in and played well against Chicago's bench. But when Skiles had the brains to re insert his starters thats when the Pacers started losing it. Since you were refering to the point that they were losing the lead I just wanted to point out that it was our bench losing that lead against their starters. Yes we have a decent bench but you cant expect them to beat other teams starters.

In short the other teams D ratcheted up because they re inserted the starters its not that the players on the floor got lazy.

317Kim
04-04-2006, 11:09 PM
I'll join you in the avatar change Pacers_Gurl.


WORD! How bout mine? From the man himself!

Atleast I dont feel alone anymore. :)

I just don't see what's going on. We're 3 games under .500 and riding a 5 game losing streak. This game was one of the most important games down the stretch and we had a 17 pt lead....but only to see it decrease each possession. From 17 to 11 to 4 to them taking the lead. That one 3 that Ben Gordon shot with 1 left on the shot clock just left me in awe. The 3 that good ol Feisty hit also left me in awe but with us down 2 with JO at the line with less than a minute left me nervous and after my buddy missed both and we were down 3 was when I knew it was GAME OVER. The last three Ben made was just to seal it up and more for us to soak in.
I don't get it. I probably never will.

OH YEAH GETTING OUTSCORED 31-15 in the 4th is just :puke:

BASURA Y MIERDA.

Jon Theodore
04-04-2006, 11:10 PM
hahahahahahahahahahahahaha why are we all here

we should all quit watching games, seriously

lets straight up boycott the pacers

I know I am

DisplacedKnick
04-04-2006, 11:11 PM
Rick Carlisle had nothing to do with the loss tonight.

This one's all on the players. Stupid decisions, quick shots, quitting on defense, can't even get the friggin' ball entered into play and bricking two FT's with less than a minutes.

AJ jacks up a quick 3 for no reason. Tinsley throws the ball away twice. Jackson quits, turning what should have been a desperation 3 by Gordon into a wide open look. And giving up offensive rebounds by the bushel. The players should be completely embarrassed at this one.

Unclebuck
04-04-2006, 11:12 PM
we should all quit watching games, seriously

lets straight up boycott the pacers

I know I am



See you later, but I'm not going anywhere

hoopsforlife
04-04-2006, 11:12 PM
Wait a minute, weren't AJ and Saras on the court in the first half when the pacers made their 15-2 run and weren't they in the game at the start of the 4th when an 11 point mead ballooned to 17. Why do we sometimes want the coach to go wioth the hot hand and other times we don't.

This isn't about Rick, this is about criticizing coaches when it is completely unwarranted.

You're right UB. This game turned for the worse when Jermaine and Tinsley came back in.

burnzone
04-04-2006, 11:13 PM
The bench players were in and played well against Chicago's bench. But when Skiles had the brains to re insert his starters thats when the Pacers started losing it. Since you were refering to the point that they were losing the lead I just wanted to point out that it was our bench losing that lead against their starters. Yes we have a decent bench but you cant expect them to beat other teams starters.

In short the other teams D ratcheted up because they re inserted the starters its not that the players on the floor got lazy.
Ok, I agree with that, I just wasn't sure what you meant, because I didnt' recall mentioning the bench.

But yes, I also feel like when we had the bench in, was when they were playing the best, and really had the intensity up, but yes they won't always be able to keep that going against another team's starters.

And then when he put the starters back in, they just seemed kind of lazy, and walking through everything, while the Bulls were clearly out hustling them at that point, and that's when it went downhill.

Plus, it seemed like at least 2 of those wide open 3's Gordon made, were partly made possible because the defender fell down, or was knocked down.

I feel like Carlisle's habit of wanting to stick with his schedule, and put the starters in at the x:00 mark of every quarter, regardless of who's playing well, may have been a big part of what happened tonight.

Shade
04-04-2006, 11:14 PM
Rick Carlisle had nothing to do with the loss tonight.

This one's all on the players. Stupid decisions, quick shots, quitting on defense, can't even get the friggin' ball entered into play and bricking two FT's with less than a minutes.

AJ jacks up a quick 3 for no reason. Tinsley throws the ball away twice. Jackson quits, turning what should have been a desperation 3 by Gordon into a wide open look. And giving up offensive rebounds by the bushel. The players should be completely embarrassed at this one.

Hey Rim, are you worried the Knicks may lose the #1 pick after picking up a couple more wins over the Pacers?

At least the Raptors will do the same, so that should offset, I guess. :shrug:

Lord Helmet
04-04-2006, 11:14 PM
Yeah, I'd have to say the players lost this game tonight. Too many quick shots and turnovers in the fourth.

stew
04-04-2006, 11:15 PM
Rick lost this game. He needs to be fired tonight. They should have done it months ago but the least they could do is remedy the situation now.

I dont think you can blame Rick on this one... He got the team prepared to play tonight... the game plan is sound, defensively they are doing pretty well until the 4th..

if you have to blame someone, you got to blame the players...

they suck big time...

harrison made some bad defensive play early into the 4th, and the 3 point play he gave up started everything for chicago...

JO, for a franchise player, he certainly cannot carry a team... missing the most important free thows of the game... missing some shots down the stretch.. letting sweetney score on you.. and did I mention he missed the most important free thows of the game...

Peja, couldnt buy a basket either... and talk around here is that he is going to get paid around 10 mil a year in his next contract...


This loss must hurt the most... not when we are trying to get a better playoff position...

#31
04-04-2006, 11:17 PM
I THINK I KNOW THE PROBLEM!! DO YOU THINK THE BASKETBALL GODS ARE PUNISHING THE PACERS FOR WHAT REGGIE HAS DONE TO THE KNICKS AND SO MANY FANS/PLAYERS/COACHES IN 20 YEARS? FIRST THEY MAKE REGGIE RETIRE, THEN THEY CREATE THE PACERS TO KNICKS? VERY SIMILAR PLAYERS TO!! ANY BELLS RINGING?

:lmao:

Ragnar
04-04-2006, 11:17 PM
Rick tried to bring Jamaal back in, but he trhwos the ball away and then flops leaving Ben wild open, Rick had no choice but to put AJ back in. Don't forget AJ did steal the ball from Ben twice in the 4th quarter.



oooooh he stole the ball twice that makes up for forgeting Jack had the hot hand or for all the other turn overs.

Rick should have brought ALL the starters back in when Skiles did. Rick needs to give Tins half the laditude he gives AJ. We might have wone the game.

stew
04-04-2006, 11:22 PM
Sorry UB I cant see how you cant see it. Rick let the Bulls back into a game we were winning running away. AJ and Sarunas should not have been in there after the 8:30 mark Rick is the one who left them in not the other players. You dont let a young team back into a game on their home court you just dont do it.


I have to disagree with you on this one also..

the second unit is the one that gave us the 17 point lead in the first place...

and he is just playing the hot hand as some of you guys keep on insisting.....


regards
stew

hoopsforlife
04-04-2006, 11:25 PM
Look on the bright side people. Tinsley hit a 3 tonight. :dance:

Shade
04-04-2006, 11:25 PM
I have never been more embarassed to be a Pacers fan than I have been this year. This is just one of many, many lowlights this season.

Shade
04-04-2006, 11:25 PM
Look on the bright side people. Tinsley hit a 3 tonight. :dance:

Foster almost did, too. :eek:

Mordecaii
04-04-2006, 11:27 PM
Having watched the game, I saw one major thing that really caused the Bulls to get back into the game... REBOUNDING! The Bulls got some offensive rebounds which is really what started the shift in momentum. Harrison and Foster had some trouble getting defensive rebounds, and the Bulls non-existant interior was somehow playing better than our interior players.

I don't really blame Rick, even though I'm sure there are things he could have done better. I do blame AJ for throwing up a quick three late in the 4th quarter, not being able to throw the ball inbounds on the last play, having a couple bad turnovers, not passing when he should have, etc... I also blame Granger for NOT LOOKING TO SCORE when he should have... The guy is an awesome player, but he NEEDS to learn to be more selfish! (Wish I could say the same about Jax). Other than that, quick threes being thrown up, and mental lapses on the defensive end are what lost the game. (I thought Jax had a good game, he got hot in the 4th quarter and he didn't get the ball all that much.)

Big Smooth
04-04-2006, 11:28 PM
The blame game is easy. But I don't necessarily care who is at fault at this point, the simple fact is the Pacers are not a playoff caliber team at the moment and as such, should they back their way into the playoffs I don't plan to spend a dollar on playoff tickets unless this team shows me something between now and then, if the playoffs even happen.

But of course, I take it back. Of course I care about where the blame lies. But in the grand scheme of things, the Pacers have endured a monstrous clusterbomb of controversy and injury since we lost the 2004 ECF to Detroit. The Pacers entered the 2004-05 season looking like a true title contender who perhaps would have learned from it's battle w/Detroit and perhaps overtake them. Then comes the brawl. And then injuries. Team finishes playing inspired ball short-handed. Tinsley & JO come back at less than 100%, Pacers make inspired playoff run. Reggie retires. Pacers enter this season expected to contend for a title. Artest goes nuts again, this time for good (as far as Indiana is concerned). More injuries to JO and Tinsley.

You can probably identify a million points of blame for what has transpired. But the fact is the original plan was to win a title w/Carlisle coaching a team led mostly by Tinsley, Artest & O'Neal with other guys filling roles.

The terrain has changed.

This current group of players while talented isn't fitting together well. Does Carlisle hold some blame in that? Perhaps but not all the blame. So I guess you have these alternatives:

1) Carlisle is the problem! We have the talent, fire him & bring in a new coach!

2) Carlisle isn't the problem! It's the players! Make major personnel changes! Trade off guys like Tinsley, JO & SJax!

3) Both are the problem and both need changed.

I'm going to deal in the realm of my reality. I think the answer is on a continuum between #1 and #2 with myself leaning in the direction of #2. In other words, I place blame on both coach and players but I believe the players are the more culpable party.

I do believe Rick Carlisle is a good coach, one of the better coaches in the NBA. The mess he has had to deal with is not an easy situation. Would Larry Brown, Phil Jackson, Flip Saunders or anyone else deal more effectively with such a horrible two years of distraction and injury? Doubtful.

My conclusion: in the offseason Walsh, Bird & Carlisle need to have a serious pow-wow and determine what personnel changes need to made in order for the Pacers to be in the position to win a title again. It's not a lacking of talent right now but with Artest's departure we have been left pounding furiously at square pegs in round holes. The gameplan for the franchise has to shift accordingly.

People talk about JO being the elephant in the living room or whatever. I'll just say it now, I do not see Jermaine O'Neal as being a franchise player. That isn't meant as an insult to JO. I think he is basically a good guy and a very skilled All-Star caliber player but he is not THE FRANCHISE. I think he is a guy being placed into a role that he does not fit. Again, square pegs & round holes.

Not saying I want to see him gone. Just stating that I think the Pacers have seemingly made him the de facto franchise player when in reality that role does not fit him. How you fix that situation, well I won't pretend to have the answers. Walsh/Bird get paid the big bucks to fix things, they need to get busy.

Not sure much else can be said at the moment.

317Kim
04-04-2006, 11:29 PM
Foster almost did, too. :eek:

I thought he did. ?

Unclebuck
04-04-2006, 11:30 PM
Ragnar: I just checked the play-by-play

J.O was brought back in for DH at the 7:54 mark

Jax was taken out and replaced by Peja at the 6:03 mark. Jax had played the whole second half to this point he needed a minute or two rest

Tinsley back in at the 6:03 mark.

Jax replaced at the 4:40 mark by Jax.

Ragnar: it seems to me that Rick brought the starters back in when he needed to. His it his fault they all played like crap. The only one that maybe should have come back in sooner, maybe was Foster, but Granger was going so good, I can't criticize Rick for that and jeff's my favorite player on the team.

Tim
04-04-2006, 11:34 PM
The problem really is the players do not believe they can win.

They have had this problem all season and it really started before the brawl last season.

Shade
04-04-2006, 11:34 PM
I thought he did. ?

I don't think it was a 3, just a long 2.

brichard
04-04-2006, 11:35 PM
Rick Carlisle had nothing to do with the loss tonight.

This one's all on the players. Stupid decisions, quick shots, quitting on defense, can't even get the friggin' ball entered into play and bricking two FT's with less than a minutes.

AJ jacks up a quick 3 for no reason. Tinsley throws the ball away twice. Jackson quits, turning what should have been a desperation 3 by Gordon into a wide open look. And giving up offensive rebounds by the bushel. The players should be completely embarrassed at this one.


Ding Ding Ding!

Sometimes I love having fans of other teams on our board, and this is one of those times. We are all caught up in the emotion and we are looking for somebody to blame. We want to find the one player or coach who screwed the deal.

And personally, I don't think it comes down to foot speed. Basketball comes down to a simple understanding and execution of fundamentals. I pinpoint the 2 missed FT's by JO as the tipping point. They had some wild 3's they made, but let us not forget that Jeff Foster... yes that Jeff Foster, hit a rainbow as well.

But when you miss 2 clutch FT's on the road in the last seconds, you add energy to the crowd, which adds energy to the home team, and subsequently sucks the life out of you. We are yelling about AJ not getting in an entry pass, but who was he going to throw to? Those plays are the responsibility of the players as much as it is the guy inbounding the pass.

JO challenged the team to play with heart and soul, and then he chokes big time in the waning minutes.

The basketball IQ of this team is horrible.

317Kim
04-04-2006, 11:36 PM
I don't think it was a 3, just a long 2.

Eh. I thought I heard Slick yell :boombaby: through the tv.

brichard
04-04-2006, 11:38 PM
Eh. I thought I heard Slick yell :boombaby: through the tv.

On TV they said it was his first 3 of the year unless they retracted that comment and re-scored it.

Evan_The_Dude
04-04-2006, 11:38 PM
I'm really really hoping this team doesn't make the playoffs. I jsut want this season to be over with.

317Kim
04-04-2006, 11:41 PM
On TV they said it was his first 3 of the year unless they retracted that comment and re-scored it.

:nod: It was a 3. We went from 94 to 97.

Unclebuck
04-04-2006, 11:42 PM
No one probably cares at this point, but here is when the starters were taken out in the 3rd quarter

at the 3:40 mark Tinsley and Foster were taken out. Pacers had a 5 point lead.

At the 3:06 mark Peja was taken out, Pacers had a 7 pt lead.

At the 2:30 mark J.O was taken out, Pacers had a 5 pt lead.

As I metnioned earlier, Jax was not taken out until the 6:03 mark of the 4th quarter because he was so hot.


So 4 of the 5 starters were taken out late in the 3rd with the Pacers having a 5 or 7 point lead. The bench players get the pacers a 17 point lead. Why is it so terrible for Rick to stay with the bench players as long as he could. Seems logical to me, and then once Rick saw the Bulls coming back, he put the starters back into the game, seems logical to me.

OK so it didn't work out, but Rick made the right decisions in this regard or at the very least he made reasonable decisions

sweabs
04-04-2006, 11:47 PM
I could care less, but Foster's shot was not a three.

Meh - I'll go back to sulking now.

brichard
04-05-2006, 12:04 AM
Per the box score at Pacers.com, Jeff was 0-0 from 3 pt. range.

Unclebuck
04-05-2006, 12:10 AM
Jeff's shot was a two-pointer. Al Alberts got a little carried away.

My theory on why he made that shot. (no not because of luck). He made it because he knew the shot clock was down and he absolutely had to shoot it, he didn't have to think about it.

waterjater
04-05-2006, 12:17 AM
Whats up with you people? The problem was not Pacers, they didnt "choke" even if they made some shots they wouldnt win! The Difference was GORDON, he took over the game and NOTHING could stop him.

Unfortunatly the only player Pacers have like that is working for TNT now...

I didn't see the game nor did I tivo it, nor do I really care anymore.

BUT, if we blew a 26 point lead, it was a helluva a lot more to do with the Pacers than Gordon going off. Gordon doesn't defend all 5 Pacers by himself.

The only way to lose a game where you are up by 20 is to stop scoring and Rick is masterful at putting players together when up by 20 or more that CAN'T stop the other team and CAN'T SCORE Either. How does an NBA team not score enough points to maintain a 26 point lead??

My obsession with the Pacers ended with Reggie's jersey being retired. I'll keep track, but I'm not going to waste my time on this collection of players.

Water

waterjater
04-05-2006, 12:20 AM
i was rooting for the bulls. I really wanted them to lose.

It's official, I can no longer root for a team with Jermaine O'neal, TInsley, and Sjax. I am officially declaring my de fandom of pacers. It is a very sad day, but this team is a joke to me.

Jermaine, you are the worst player to be called a leader in the history of the entire existence of the word leader.

I've been very down on Jermaine as a leader for many years. We force fed leadership to a player that was "WAS" dominant 3 years ago. But JO isn't a natural leader and actually spends more time showing poor leadership then leading by example.

Water

Eraser
04-05-2006, 12:46 AM
oooooh he stole the ball twice that makes up for forgeting Jack had the hot hand or for all the other turn overs.

Rick should have brought ALL the starters back in when Skiles did. Rick needs to give Tins half the laditude he gives AJ. We might have wone the game.


Here's another opinion that backs up most of what Ragnar is saying.

Everybody deserves blame, but the buck stops with the coach. To not include Rick in the blame of such a horrid loss, is really what's unbelievable.

It's certainly not like it's the first time Rick has shown his coaching weaknesses...mainly in not knowing how to use the players he's got.

Will Galen
04-05-2006, 12:51 AM
My thoughts}

The Pacers just haven't got the speed in the backcourt to play good defense when it counts.

Plus they haven't decided on who's going to be clutch and take the important shots.

Give me the Pacers front court and the Bulls back court and we'll have a pretty good team.

I look for a mad Pacers team tomorrow!

Oh yeah, that clutch shot by Jeff was nothing but net. I thought at first it was Peja.

ChicagoJ
04-05-2006, 01:03 AM
The wheels have come off the bus at 70 miles per hour.

Look out below!

Will we win another game this season?

CableKC
04-05-2006, 01:14 AM
Unbelievable.......not only do the Bucks and Sixers lose.....the Bulls now are 1.5 games behind us.

I don't know what the problem is anymore...there is no doubt that there will have to be major changes this offseason.

Lord Helmet
04-05-2006, 01:32 AM
The wheels have come off the bus at 70 miles per hour.

Look out below!

Will we win another game this season?
We're spiraling out of control! This is fun! :lol:

:suicide:

Eindar
04-05-2006, 05:26 AM
This team should be dismantled this season. J.O. must be traded. Anyone who is a bad locker room guy should be traded (maybe Jackson, maybe Harrison, maybe Tinsley). Anyone who is a bad example on the court, or jaws too much with the refs, or breaks plays should be traded (J.O., Jackson, Tinsley).

Once all that is accomplished, we need to look at our team. If there is a coach out there that's as good as Carlisle (Stan Van Gundy), we fire Rick Carlisle and tell him thanks for his time. If the team is in danger of having present and future draft picks benched in favor of has-been and never-was players so that Rick can eke out another 3 wins per season, we must fire Rick Carlisle, regardless of who is available, as long as they are willing to play the youngsters.

If we don't go into full-bore rebuilding mode this off-season, I may stop watching games. This isn't even like the Isiah Thomas 2nd half meltdown, because at least then, you could point to the multiple deaths within the team, and Isiah still didn't keep his job. Rick can't point to anything in the last 10 games, other than the ineptitude of the team, and his inability to reach them. The only way I want Rick back next year is if we trade off most of the "problem" players, and get back more veterans, so that Rick isn't tempted to stunt our rookies' growth, and gets a fresh start with new players.

I thought Larry Bird was being a little stupid when he spoke of the 3 year rule and players tuning out the coach. Well, he's looking like a genius right about now.

D-BONE
04-05-2006, 06:33 AM
This season has turned into a complete fiasco! A joke! My reactions to the game and previous posts in this thread:

-To implicate either just the players or just the coach is downright shortsighted. When the performance is this painfully embarrasing everyone should be under the gun.

-JO will never be a superstar nor a true leader on our team.

-We have 4 PGs and none of them is good enough to be a starting-calibur guy in the league.

-Peja is overrated. He is a slow, one-dimensional player who has yet to show me any grit. (Hmm sounds like I could be describing any number or our guys.) I am hopeful he is not back next year and Granger takes over the 3.

-The team needs a major overhaul this summer that includes change of players and coach. It's so rotten now they need to exorcise this whole core. What has this group really ever done w/ the exception of 04?( which looks more and more each day like it was heavily dependent on Reggie and Artest.) Nothing but underachieve and choke.

Please don't be fooled if they make some late-season spurt or recovery, or even an unexpected playoff run. The team as currently assembled is summed up in one word: FAILURE. I find all aspects of their performance, frankly, insulting to the fans and franchise.

DisplacedKnick
04-05-2006, 06:47 AM
Will we win another game this season?

Not to worry - you play us next week.

DisplacedKnick
04-05-2006, 06:48 AM
Hey Rim, are you worried the Knicks may lose the #1 pick after picking up a couple more wins over the Pacers?


Uh, due to the brilliance of our GM, we don't have that pick. The team that beat you last night does.

ssmall
04-05-2006, 06:55 AM
Well the fact im not a knicks fan can cheer me up a bit. I hate our team since our starters came back. Everyone was wondering what will hapen when they return, well thats what, we stink as much as a team can stink.

RWB
04-05-2006, 08:13 AM
Here's another opinion that backs up most of what Ragnar is saying.

Everybody deserves blame, but the buck stops with the coach. To not include Rick in the blame of such a horrid loss, is really what's unbelievable.

It's certainly not like it's the first time Rick has shown his coaching weaknesses...mainly in not knowing how to use the players he's got.



Sign me up for this group. No leadership on the floor and no (gameday) leadership coming from the suits.

Putnam
04-05-2006, 08:37 AM
I am beginning to wonder with the slow footedness of this team
if Peja should be re-signed. I have never seen a much slower team.
They were completely out-quicked.


owl


Right. And look back at the Phoenix loss, where it was evident that the Pacers can't run. It is one thing for a coach to design an offense around ball control and a halfcourt offense. If that is your strength, then it could make sense. But when a team simply can't run, as the Pacers can't, it is proof of bad coaching (and more).

I'm not agreeing with the comment about Peja. The whole team is too slow. Losing Peja would only mean a slow team without an outside shooter.

Putnam
04-05-2006, 08:43 AM
The sad part is for much of the game tonight the Pacers played very well, with great energy, efoort and enthusiasm.


They played well for three quarters plus four minutes, to be precise. Come on now, Uncle Buck. It takes 48 minutes times five players to win a game, and it always will. The Pacers didn't give 48 times 5.

Kestas
04-05-2006, 08:45 AM
Having watched the game, I saw one major thing that really caused the Bulls to get back into the game... REBOUNDING!

I agree. Nocioni got 11 rebounds, while no one in the Pacers got more than 7. this team needs a real old school center (as most other NBA teams do by the way).

regarding Carlisle, I think his destiny is decided already and only a mirracle can change it.

regarding Gordon, I think he surely was the main factor behind the good offensive performance by Bulls in the last quarter. that was his night, this happens all the time. however, he surely couldn't be the reason why Pacers suddenly lost all of their offense during the same period.

Indyfan
04-05-2006, 09:06 AM
Right. And look back at the Phoenix loss, where it was
evident that the Pacers can't run. It is one thing for a coach to design an offense around ball control and a halfcourt offense. If that is your strength, then it could make sense. But when a team simply can't run, as the Pacers can't, it is proof of bad coaching (and more).

I'm not agreeing with the comment about Peja. The whole team is too slow. Losing Peja would only mean a slow team without an outside shooter.

Coach has never designed this team to be a run and gun team, he has always said they look for opportunities to run if they are there, otherwise they look to play half court offense with ball movement, etc. If he calls too many plays everyone is all over him for it, the micromanager...if he gives the team more freedom to make decisions then he is a bad coach for not seeing we aren't a run team.

These players are a mess, they don't play together, they have no chemistry, they are too worried about yapping at the refs, they have huge mental lapses, and there is very little Coach can do about it. He is trying to coach this bunch of dysfunctional players, but it doesn't work. The make up of this team is on LB and DW... but Rick will be the fall guy for this mess, that is part of NBA coaching, and I think it stinks. Can't wait to see who they bring in next, but I'll tell you one thing, if the same players are here next year no coach will be able to take them to the promised land. We will see how much Rick actually did while he was here once he is gone. Great NBA coaches are few and far between.

Since86
04-05-2006, 01:35 PM
I didn't see the game nor did I tivo it, nor do I really care anymore.

You should of stopped there.

The opinions on this board very so much, you've had to choose who's account you believe, instead of staking your own claim.

BTW, the lead was NEVER 26pts, so I'm not sure who's account you've hooked on to.

grace
04-05-2006, 02:11 PM
Not to worry - you play us next week.

That's true, but you're due a victory for the month. It might as well be against the Pacers (so Isiah can point at Larry and laugh).

Jon Theodore
04-05-2006, 02:34 PM
we will lose to the knicks, count on it