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View Full Version : Any chance people will give me a mulligan



Diamond Dave
02-15-2006, 01:15 PM
Hey guys, I just made an honest mistake by letting Grant Hill go after having hung onto him all season long. With the injuries to JO and Austin I thought I needed to do something to get anybody who could play.

I did not realize that Grant Hill was back. After all this time, and it was just a miserable coincidence that I decided today, after all this time waiting and hoping to let him go.

Basically I'm making my plea that I should be allowed to have him back, as I dropped him oh about 3 hours ago.

Would everyone be okay if I just got him back?

sweabs
02-15-2006, 01:19 PM
I posted in the other thread that I think it would only be fair.

Honest mistake on your part. And in a lot of other leagues, players of Hill's calibur are often on "do not drop" lists that prohibit you from putting them on waivers in the first place.

With playoffs winding down, and everyone in a close battle to take home the trophy, it doesn't seem fair that someone get a player of Hill's calibur for free as a result of your honest mistake. God knows you put up with his injuries for far too long in the first place to begin with.

I think you should get him back.

MagicRat
02-15-2006, 01:28 PM
I heard he wants to be a part of the MagicRats' playoff push and requested to be released..........

Diamond Dave
02-15-2006, 01:31 PM
This whole situation just sucks, and to top it off I picked up Pat Garrity in his place who will now get any time since Hill is back.

Gyron
02-15-2006, 01:32 PM
My brother's friend's cousin told my sister that he heard on the Radio that he wanted to be picked up by the Huntersville team.....But I can't tell you what radio station or in what city.

p.s. Im ok with you keeping him.

Doug
02-15-2006, 01:54 PM
You deliberately dropped him, right? Not accidentially put him on the bottom trying to rearrange you roster.

IMO, he stays on waivers.

It shouldn't affect the playoff balance too much, as it's worst-to-first in the waiver order.

Diamond Dave
02-15-2006, 02:01 PM
It shouldn't affect the playoff balance too much, as it's worst-to-first in the waiver order.


Except mine of course.

sweabs
02-15-2006, 02:06 PM
You deliberately dropped him, right? Not accidentially put him on the bottom trying to rearrange you roster.

IMO, he stays on waivers.

It shouldn't affect the playoff balance too much, as it's worst-to-first in the waiver order.

It's still unfair that someone out there gets a high-calibur player for free as the result of an honest mistake.

It's a matter of keeping the league fair and competitive. Here's the chance to set a precedent. What if he dropped Jermaine? Or what if I decided to drop Elton Brand because I knew he wasn't playing for a few games where I needed points right away? You can't have all-stars floating around on waivers and still keep the league honest and competitive. No one gets big-name players like that from waivers - certainly not in real life NBA, and hopefully we can agree not in fantasy b-ball.

Diamond Dave
02-15-2006, 02:10 PM
It's still unfair that someone out there gets a high-calibur player for free as the result of an honest mistake.

It's a matter of keeping the league fair and competitive. Here's the chance to set a precedent. What if he dropped Jermaine? Or what if I decided to drop Elton Brand because I knew he wasn't playing for a few games where I needed points right away? You can't have all-stars floating around on waivers and still keep the league honest and competitive. No one gets big-name players like that from waivers - certainly not in real life NBA, and hopefully we can agree not in fantasy b-ball.

Well I understand that I should not be allowed to drop a player for a few games, then claim rights to him if he comes back.

However thats not what I'm doing. I dropped this guy this morning, after he has started playing. He just hadn't played long enough for me to notice in my box scores. I held on to this guy throughout his entire injury, just to have this happen.

sweabs
02-15-2006, 02:17 PM
Well I understand that I should not be allowed to drop a player for a few games, then claim rights to him if he comes back.

However thats not what I'm doing. I dropped this guy this morning, after he has started playing. He just hadn't played long enough for me to notice in my box scores. I held on to this guy throughout his entire injury, just to have this happen.

No, I wasn't accusing you of doing that. I understand and can sympathize with your situation.

Doug
02-15-2006, 02:23 PM
It's still unfair that someone out there gets a high-calibur player for free as the result of an honest mistake.

It's a matter of keeping the league fair and competitive. Here's the chance to set a precedent. What if he dropped Jermaine? Or what if I decided to drop Elton Brand because I knew he wasn't playing for a few games where I needed points right away? You can't have all-stars floating around on waivers and still keep the league honest and competitive. No one gets big-name players like that from waivers - certainly not in real life NBA, and hopefully we can agree not in fantasy b-ball.

I understand what you are saying. I don't want the league to allow people to dump players (or make bogus trades) that throw off the balance of power.

Both your Brand and JO examples significantly more disruptive that what happened.

What if he had traded Hill for somebody worse that Hilll, say Rasho Nesterovic (20 @ .7). Should it be recinded?

There's a whole lot of gray area here. I guess I don't really feel that it will upset the balance of power in the league, (except for DD, but he's the one who dropped him).

Note: I'm on the bubble for the playoffs, so whoever gets Hill could actually end up bumping me out. It would probably be in my best interest to roll-back the trade.

sweabs
02-15-2006, 02:30 PM
I understand what you are saying. I don't want the league to allow people to dump players (or make bogus trades) that throw off the balance of power.

Both your Brand and JO examples significantly more disruptive that what happened.

What if he had traded Hill for somebody worse that Hilll, say Rasho Nesterovic (20 @ .7). Should it be recinded?

There's a whole lot of gray area here. I guess I don't really feel that it will upset the balance of power in the league, (except for DD, but he's the one who dropped him).

Note: I'm on the bubble for the playoffs, so whoever gets Hill could actually end up bumping me out. It would probably be in my best interest to roll-back the trade.

Yes, I am of the opinion that bogus trades should be rescinded. Grant Hill for Nesterovic - no, I'm not that stingy.

But, for example - what about a trade of Grant Hill for Mamadou N'Dyiae? You bet that I'd protest that trade...because you're getting a good player for essentially nothing; and in this case, someone is getting a good player for absolutely nothing.

MagicRat
02-15-2006, 02:36 PM
and in this case, someone is getting a good player for absolutely nothing.

So whoever ends up with him gets an extra roster spot?.....:woot2:

Doug
02-15-2006, 02:37 PM
Yes, I am of the opinion that bogus trades should be rescinded. Grant Hill for Nesterovic - no, I'm not that stingy.

But, for example - what about a trade of Grant Hill for Mamadou N'Dyiae? You bet that I'd protest that trade...because you're getting a good player for essentially nothing; and in this case, someone is getting a good player for absolutely nothing.

Well, DD *thought* Grant Hill was done for the year, or at least wasn't willing to wait any longer. If N'Dyiae was getting minutes and DD thought he was better than the waivers players, why wouldn't it be a valid trade?

I'm not going to get bent of our shape one way or the other, as long as we are recinding the trade because it unbalances the league. If the owners think that it does, I'm OK with that. I'm just not convinced of it.

If we are talking about recinding the trade just to give DD "a mulligan" (and I don't think you and I are) then I think that would be a mistake.

sweabs
02-15-2006, 02:42 PM
So whoever ends up with him gets an extra roster spot?.....:woot2:

Sorry; I guess I should make myself clear.

You get a very good player for your 12th man (unless you currently have 11 players on your roster, in which there are a couple teams).

I know that I'd absolutely hate to have to replace Othella Harrington with Grant Hill......

sweabs
02-15-2006, 02:47 PM
Well, DD *thought* Grant Hill was done for the year, or at least wasn't willing to wait any longer. If N'Dyiae was getting minutes and DD thought he was better than the waivers players, why wouldn't it be a valid trade?
Because he didn't know Grant Hill is back and playing again. In which case I'm pretty sure he wouldn't want to trade a good fantasy player for nothing.


I'm not going to get bent of our shape one way or the other, as long as we are recinding the trade because it unbalances the league. If the owners think that it does, I'm OK with that. I'm just not convinced of it.
I guess we just have fundamental differences...

Jose Slaughter
02-15-2006, 03:16 PM
I'll go to the site & put the transaction up for a vote.

However using the excuse that he didn't know he was back is not enough to sway my vote.

Jose Slaughter
02-15-2006, 03:22 PM
The vote will take 24 hours so you won't get him back in time for tonights deadline. The next deadline isn't until the 21st, so worse case, you loose him for a game.

Doug
02-15-2006, 03:28 PM
I guess we just have fundamental differences...Nah, just a difference of opinion. :-)

We are agreed that the only thing we disagree on is whether or not the Hill drop is unbalancing, right?

sweabs
02-15-2006, 03:31 PM
Nah, just a difference of opinion. :-)

We are agreed that the only thing we disagree on is whether or not the Hill drop is unbalancing, right?

Exactly - that's what I'm waiting to see.

If he goes to a bad team, then I agree that it's a non- issue...but I'm just not sure where he will end up. I just don't want it to affect the balance of the league, as it seems unfair.

Doug
02-15-2006, 03:33 PM
Exactly - that's what I'm waiting to see.

If he goes to a bad team, then I agree that it's a non- issue...but I'm just not sure where he will end up. I just don't want it to affect the balance of the league, as it seems unfair.

Well, he won't get to any team above me in the standings. :D

DisplacedKnick
02-15-2006, 03:40 PM
I'm voting no. I dropped Rafer Alston because Sportsline's injury report said he wouldn't be back until early February and I was desperate to fill minutes - and then he came back something like a day or two after I dropped him - should I have been able to get him back?

sweabs
02-15-2006, 03:40 PM
By the way, Diamond Dave can't buy any luck.

I just noticed that the person he picked up in exchange for Hill, was Eduardo Najera - and I thought he was going to be out for a few weeks with injury?

Do your research, DD! :D

Diamond Dave
02-15-2006, 03:47 PM
By the way, Diamond Dave can't buy any luck.

I just noticed that the person he picked up in exchange for Hill, was Eduardo Najera - and I thought he was going to be out for a few weeks with injury?

Do your research, DD! :D

I got him briefly, then saw he was injured, so picked up Pat Garrity. All of this took place in about 8 minutes at work.

sweabs
02-15-2006, 03:51 PM
I'm voting no. I dropped Rafer Alston because Sportsline's injury report said he wouldn't be back until early February and I was desperate to fill minutes - and then he came back something like a day or two after I dropped him - should I have been able to get him back?

Meh - but when you dropped him, he was sitting around 0.65 FPPM if I recall.

The waiver-wire is supposed to work like that - pick up guys that may not be doing so well, in hopes that they improve (heck, I got Damien Wilkins that way).

Grant Hill just doesn't fit into that category for me, as no one in their right mind would drop a 0.82 FPPM player onto the waiver wire.

MagicRat
02-15-2006, 03:59 PM
Can I get a mulligan on drafting Kyle Korver? I'll take Chris Paul, please.....:cool:

Doug
02-15-2006, 04:11 PM
Can I get a mulligan on drafting Kyle Korver? I'll take Chris Paul, please.....:cool:I'd like a Chris Paul mulligan in the keeper league. I took McCants over him... I got back from Disney, saw I was on the clock, looked at the preseason scoring leaders, and took McCants. That was my research. I paniced.

I can't believe that Disney wanted me to *pay* for internet access after all the $$$$ I was dropping on a hotel room. Of course, I'm stubborn and didn't want to pay and so instead of doing my research at night after the parks closed, I didn't do any. Stupid.

MagicRat
02-15-2006, 04:25 PM
I can't believe that Disney wanted me to *pay* for internet access after all the $$$$ I was dropping on a hotel room.

Four dollar signs must mean "Deluxe Resort". I'm guessing Animal Kingdom.....

Doug
02-15-2006, 04:50 PM
Four dollar signs must mean "Deluxe Resort". I'm guessing Animal Kingdom.....

Yacht Club. We split the week. The first 3 nights we stayed at "All Star Movies" (think Motel 6 rooms, but very, very clean and a Disney theme). The pool (multiple, connected pools, really) at the Yacht club is awesome - huge with a sand bottom and a waterslide. All Star Movies was nice, especially for the price. And we spent the first three days at parks, so the motel didn't matter that much.

Shade
02-15-2006, 05:26 PM
Grant Hill? GRANT HILL?!?! I want a f@#$ing mulligan for AMARE STOUDEMIRE!!!!! :grumble:

DisplacedKnick
02-15-2006, 10:31 PM
Meh - but when you dropped him, he was sitting around 0.65 FPPM if I recall.

The waiver-wire is supposed to work like that - pick up guys that may not be doing so well, in hopes that they improve (heck, I got Damien Wilkins that way).

Grant Hill just doesn't fit into that category for me, as no one in their right mind would drop a 0.82 FPPM player onto the waiver wire.

When I dropped him I'd been sitting on him for 20 games until the report pushed his expected return date back another month. Considering I had him in the Keeper League last year where he scored .94, I didn't drop him because I expected his production to stay that low.

As for nobody dropping Grant Hill, someone did - AFTER he'd just played two games.

Sorry, but if you don't bother to check to see if a guy's playing before you drop him then no, you don't deserve to get him back.

able
02-16-2006, 05:31 AM
Y'all know I can influence this decision rather heavily right ?

Let me start by saying that I think it either shows two things (the fact it happened)
1: short on time, desperate to go into the playoffs with some sort of chance (though it is of course ultmitaly silly to not be patient after being patient for so long)
2: des-interest to do good

Now there is no way on this earth that can make me think option 2, so I'll go with the ultimate stupidity that is #1, take some free advice, when in doubt; don't move, and when short no time it only means you have no time for doubts so your decision making is much worse for wear.

I can understand people not wanting him to revert, we're all old enough to understand that if you make a mistake you have to face the consequences.
Still I prefer him going into the playoffs (chances are about 98% he'll make the playoffs) and play to potential, which means with Hill.

Now I said I can influence this outcome, which is something I COULD do, but onoly if enough support for it exists, otherwise I remain on my "don't influence the outcome" position I have taken after being bitten by extreme bad luck.
Now I must say that I am influencing the games anyway, as I am ready to embark on a W streak closing out the season, Nazdab got away safe but another playoff contender in Habana was just clobbered by me (yes I intend to win a few more) but that is what my team should have done from day one and a natural course.

Ok how can I influence? well if I pick him up, no one else can, I will have undoubtedly the #1 rights, so now I leave it at you all:

1: I expressed interest, meaning he will end up with me (fact)
2: I keep him, and no one gets a freebie OR
3: I trade him to DD for whomever he picked up to replace Hill.

it's up to you guys to decide what I do, but I do not like the idea that any playoff contender gets this much strengthening for free anyway and I can not exclude voting behaviour to be influenced by the htought of perhaps picking him up.

Let me know.

DisplacedKnick
02-16-2006, 07:00 AM
it's up to you guys to decide what I do,

Well, I don't know about anyone else but what I think you should do is follow the voting protocol - which is WHAT the league decides should be done.

Not sure why you feel that your personal opinion would be more valid than what the league as a whole decides.

And is the rule regarding players out of playoff contention making roster moves no longer in effect?

FWIW, I don't have any interest in Hill - wouldn't take him if I could get him. I've had enough trouble filling minutes without picking him up.

As for another playoff team wanting him - why not? He's been willingly put on waivers by an owner who now says "Oops, I didn't do my homework." If someone wants him and can get him, more power to them.

Jose Slaughter
02-16-2006, 08:03 AM
Able

I don't know if has been mentioned before but once a team has been eliminated from the playoffs we ask that the owner "freeze" their roster.

I would like for you to drop your interest in Hill & allow him to go to the lowest seeded team still in the playoff chase, pending the outcome of the league vote.

Thanks for your help.

DisplacedKnick
02-16-2006, 09:17 AM
I can't believe that Disney wanted me to *pay* for internet access after all the $$$$ I was dropping on a hotel room. Of course, I'm stubborn and didn't want to pay and so instead of doing my research at night after the parks closed, I didn't do any. Stupid.

Absolutely - 20 demerits for refusing to pauper yourself for a Fantasy Game!

:-p

Doug
02-16-2006, 09:42 AM
Absolutely - 20 demerits for refusing to pauper yourself for a Fantasy Game!

:-p

Well, I did spend a fair amount of time in FantasyLand looking for the Hall of Rookies attraction. But I couldn't find it - just a bunch of stuff with Princesses and castles. If I had been able to see the animatronic Chris Paul, maybe I would have taken him.

able
02-16-2006, 12:18 PM
Well, I don't know about anyone else but what I think you should do is follow the voting protocol - which is WHAT the league decides should be done.

Not sure why you feel that your personal opinion would be more valid than what the league as a whole decides.

And is the rule regarding players out of playoff contention making roster moves no longer in effect?

FWIW, I don't have any interest in Hill - wouldn't take him if I could get him. I've had enough trouble filling minutes without picking him up.

As for another playoff team wanting him - why not? He's been willingly put on waivers by an owner who now says "Oops, I didn't do my homework." If someone wants him and can get him, more power to them.

There is no indication given, nor thought, that my opinion would have more value then that of any other owner, I just tried to offer a perhaps more "PC" solution, some ppl vote on the bases of prinicipal but are prepared to offer a way out this way.

I was not aware of the rule of roster freeze, had I been I would have worded the proposal differently.

I have dropped the interest of course.

Jose Slaughter
02-16-2006, 12:51 PM
As is the case with every little bump in the road that has happened in this league, it has been worked out smoothly.

If we didn't the quality people that we do, this wouldn't be the case.

Thanks everyone

DisplacedKnick
02-16-2006, 03:35 PM
There is no indication given, nor thought, that my opinion would have more value then that of any other owner, I just tried to offer a perhaps more "PC" solution, some ppl vote on the bases of prinicipal but are prepared to offer a way out this way.

I was not aware of the rule of roster freeze, had I been I would have worded the proposal differently.

I have dropped the interest of course.

No problem - and I apologize if I came across as combative.

able
02-16-2006, 04:21 PM
No problem - and I apologize if I came across as combative.
Thank you kind sir, would it be needed it would have been graciously accepted, but I took no offence :)

Gyron
02-16-2006, 04:23 PM
http://www.peterpaulandmary.com/music/20-13.htm

Slick Pinkham
02-16-2006, 05:37 PM
the tribe has spoken...