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Will Galen
02-11-2006, 05:36 AM
http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060211/SPORTS04/602110481

Trade deadline looms

Pacers president Larry Bird likes what he has seen of his team of late. Whether that convinces him not to make a move before the Feb. 23 trade deadline remains to be seen.

"I like the way we're playing," Bird said before Friday's win. "Not just because we're winning games, but because of the way we're moving the ball. It seems like we're coming together. We'll win a lot of games doing that."

Which isn't to say he wouldn't make a trade.

"If there's a move out there we think can help us, we'll try to do something," he said. "If not, we'll stay with our guys."
-------------

Nothing we didn't already know, or surmise.

Bball
02-11-2006, 05:43 AM
Once again, Bird makes a comment that seems at odds with Carlisle's plans/desire/M.O....



"I like the way we're playing," Bird said before Friday's win. "Not just because we're winning games, but because of the way we're moving the ball. It seems like we're coming together. We'll win a lot of games doing that."

-Bball

Shack80
02-11-2006, 06:17 AM
I like he sounds of that. I love the ball the pacers are playing right now. I have a lot of faith in this organization, and I think we are in the midst of big changes for the better.

Pacers#1Fan
02-11-2006, 10:19 AM
I just pray to God that we don't go back to that stall ball offense when JO comes back.

denyfizle
02-11-2006, 11:51 AM
I say trade Jack while his value is at an all-time high!!! Package him with JT. We can also trade Fred for Pietrus now rather than lose him to free agency.

CableKC
02-11-2006, 11:52 AM
If we do not make any moves for the rest of this season........given that certain players will expire or come off the books ( Pollard, Gill and Bender )....will we be in any financial position to offer ( much less match ) Freddie and/or Peja the type of contract that they will likely command ( without the Simons opening up the wallets significantly )?

I correct in assuming that:

(A) Bird/Walsh convinces ownership to do the right thing and actually open up the wallets to pay Freddie and/or Peja

or

(B) Given that there already is a reluctance from ownership to pay too much Luxury tax....it means that the Pacers will only match any offer for Freddie ( the lower priced Pacer Free Agent ), do the unexpected and only resign Peja ( but letting Freddie go in a S&T ) or ( worse ) do S&T for both Freddie and Peja ( which I don't like...but have a feeling that is what is going to happen ).

Am I missing something here?

You guys know more then I do based off of recent Pacer history....but has the Simons historically "matched" any contract offer and paid an up-and-coming Pacer Free Agent that was likely going to command a decent contract on the Free Agent Market?

The only 2 Free Agent situations that I can immediately recall is "Brad Miller for Pollard" and the "JJ for 2nd round draft picks"......whereas any Pacer that they felt was worth keeping was kept through Contract extensions ( like JONeal, Tinsley, Artest, etc...pls correct me if I am wrong ).

I don't like it........but given that we are already likely going to be very close if not over the salary cap.....something has to give.

Jermaniac
02-11-2006, 12:07 PM
I say trade Jack while his value is at an all-time high!!! Package him with JT. We can also trade Fred for Pietrus now rather than lose him to free agency.What makes you think the Warriors will do that?

Jermaniac
02-11-2006, 12:07 PM
I just pray to God that we don't go back to that stall ball offense when JO comes back.If he goes back to that offense once JO comes back then he needs to be fired right after the game.

Moses
02-11-2006, 12:13 PM
Just for the record, Bender does not come off of the books after this season.......
If I've read right, Now that he has retired his salary wont count against the luxury tax.

able
02-11-2006, 12:24 PM
I have really no idea how many times and how many ppl have to tell you this:

JB is NOT retiring, he can not play anymore due to injuries

This results in the following:

1: Insurance covers his salary
2: Pacers applied for Cap/LT relief for his salary based on this, if given (likely) he will NOT count against the cap/LT this season and next
3: Pacers CAN also apply for a "permanent injury exception" and have HALF JB's salary available to sign another player.

The Pacers are unlikely to use the 3rd option because that would ADD again to the LT position.

Jose Slaughter
02-11-2006, 12:49 PM
Considering how long the Pacers have been rumored to be after Peja, I don't see them letting him get away.

It might cost us Jones but I think that'll be the price they're willing to pay.

owl
02-11-2006, 01:45 PM
I have really no idea how many times and how many ppl have to tell you this:

JB is NOT retiring, he can not play anymore due to injuries

This results in the following:

1: Insurance covers his salary
2: Pacers applied for Cap/LT relief for his salary based on this, if given (likely) he will NOT count against the cap/LT this season and next
3: Pacers CAN also apply for a "permanent injury exception" and have HALF JB's salary available to sign another player.

The Pacers are unlikely to use the 3rd option because that would ADD again to the LT position.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++

This is good. So then they are left with Croshere and his final year next year.
Pollard will only be back at around vets minimum. Reggie is off the books.
Croshere is unlikely to be traded as the Pacers will want his cap relief, so
Austin is here for the duration and may sign for vets minimum also after his
contract is up.


owl

rabid
02-11-2006, 01:54 PM
"If there's a move out there we think can help us, we'll try to do something," he said. "If not, we'll stay with our guys."


Just remember that this quote means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. This is a standard, canned answer that Larry and/or Donnie give out every year at this time, regardless of the status of the team.

Basically this tells us nothing.

Pacerized
02-11-2006, 03:18 PM
I have really no idea how many times and how many ppl have to tell you this:

JB is NOT retiring, he can not play anymore due to injuries

This results in the following:

1: Insurance covers his salary
2: Pacers applied for Cap/LT relief for his salary based on this, if given (likely) he will NOT count against the cap/LT this season and next
3: Pacers CAN also apply for a "permanent injury exception" and have HALF JB's salary available to sign another player.

The Pacers are unlikely to use the 3rd option because that would ADD again to the LT position.


Correct, it's highly likely the he will not count against us either this year, or next. This means no luxury tax this year, and the balls in our court for next year. With Peja, Fred, and Pollard all free agents, and coming off the books, we can do anything we want. I see the Pacer's offering Peja something less then a Max contract, and leaving the other 2 in limbo until Peja is taken care of. I don't know what everyone else thinks, but I don't see Fred getting a big offer. He's an undersized 2 guard, and they usually come cheap. If Pollard keeps playing well for the rest of the season, I don't see us keeping him. Decent free agent centers always go for more then they deserve, and we have Harrison coming along.

Will Galen
02-11-2006, 04:19 PM
Correct, it's highly likely the he will not count against us either this year, or next. This means no luxury tax this year, and the balls in our court for next year. With Peja, Fred, and Pollard all free agents, and coming off the books, we can do anything we want. I see the Pacer's offering Peja something less then a Max contract, and leaving the other 2 in limbo until Peja is taken care of. I don't know what everyone else thinks, but I don't see Fred getting a big offer. He's an undersized 2 guard, and they usually come cheap. If Pollard keeps playing well for the rest of the season, I don't see us keeping him. Decent free agent centers always go for more then they deserve, and we have Harrison coming along.

Disagree. We will probably have to pay a few million.

The luxury tax is now fixed. Teams will pay a dollar for dollar tax on any salary's over $61.7 million.

The Pacer's will pay roughly $80 million in salary's this year. We can knock off Reggie's salary of $6 million due to the amnesty cause. That puts us at roughly $74 million. We can knock off Walkers $300,000 salary because he wasn't on the roster on Jan. 10. We will also more than likely not have to pay the tax on Benders $7 million salary. That will bring us down to paying a tax on $66,599,205, if published salary's are correct. That would mean we would pay a tax of $4,899,205 million.

There's more. If you add up all the teams salary's over $61.7 million it comes to roughly $170 million. Now the NBA can take money out of that amount for what ever they want. Say they take $20 million, that means all 30 teams would split $150 million. That's $5 million per team. That would mean the Pacers would actually get some money back.

$5,000,000 1/30th share
$4,899,205 tax
__________
$100,795 money back



However, other teams also have players they don't have to pay luxury tax on. For instant, Dallas gets to knock off Michael Finley's $18 million. That means the pot to be shared will be less. So the Pacers won't get a $5 million share back. Probably 2 to 3 million.

So, as close as can be figured the Pacers are likely to have to pay a couple million, after the tax and 1/30th share are figured.

rabid
02-11-2006, 06:35 PM
So, as close as can be figured the Pacers are likely to have to pay a couple million, after the tax and 1/30th share are figured.

I thought the luxury tax $$ was distributed only to the teams who had salaries BELOW the threshold (as a reward for staying under).

Or did that change with the new CBA?

D-BONE
02-12-2006, 09:22 AM
I say trade Jack while his value is at an all-time high!!! Package him with JT. We can also trade Fred for Pietrus now rather than lose him to free agency.

Pipe dream or not, I love the sound of this. I wanted Pietrus during the Artest saga and I'd still love to get our grubby little hands on him. Young, long-distance range, and good wing defender. No scenarios for potential acqisition or fit with whatever personnel would be left around here. Just enjoying the thought (dream?) momentarily.

BBALL56HACKER
02-12-2006, 10:38 AM
O.K. Let`s look at the trade posibilty of say Jackson-J.T. for A. Miller-B. Russell (need him for deal to work). Then F.Jones for Pietrus (Pacers will loose this Jones like last years Jones-get something besides a 2nd round pick). That would be a nice addition to the back court but, we are still going to have three point guards or trade A.J. while his stock is high.
By doing these trades PACERS will actually cut payroll by another 2.2 million (then double that for luxury tax savings also). This is something that popped up by reading these post here. Now getting the other teams to agree to the deals might be a little hard, but Denver is needing a 2 guard.