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View Full Version : Isn't Freddie Jones the Pacers best player right now



Unclebuck
01-20-2006, 11:47 PM
I'm too tired to really get into this right now. But as I watch the team it looks to me that Freddie is the Pacers best player. Obviously J.O. is better, but he is not playing right now.

If you look back at the past 10 games or so I don't think there is any conclusion you can draw except that Freddie is the Pacers best player.

Bball
01-20-2006, 11:49 PM
What is that saying, exactly?

Truthfully... I'm not really sure.

-Bball

Outlaw
01-20-2006, 11:50 PM
He's the hottest player over the last 10 games or so.And it is his contract year.

317Kim
01-20-2006, 11:50 PM
Fred has been playing so well just unfortunate that he missed the 3 at the end, but if he had missed the shots he made from the end of the third quarter and all fourth, then that wouldnt have mattered much anyway.

Fred's been averaging around 15.6 points off the bench this month. :)

Suaveness
01-20-2006, 11:59 PM
Fred rocks my world

317Kim
01-21-2006, 12:01 AM
:grinyes: Same here. for some reason I was thinking about him again while writing the date Friday January 20th .. FJ20..

:laugh: Sorry it just kinda popped up.

Kstat
01-21-2006, 12:04 AM
Definately.

The downside is he's gradually pricing himself out of Indiana the same way James Jones did last season.

Pacesetter
01-21-2006, 12:05 AM
Fred is really superfly in disguise! lol! :D

317Kim
01-21-2006, 12:11 AM
Yeah, restricted FA though right?

I'd be upset for monthes..maybe years..or seasons if we lose him :( I CANT EVEN WANNA THINK ABOUT THAT!

PacerMan
01-21-2006, 12:25 AM
He's the hottest player over the last 10 games or so.And it is his contract year.

Forget that contract year crap. He was our BEST guard LAST YEAR, before he got hurt at the end of the season. We beat the ****-ons WITH Freddie.

Anthem
01-21-2006, 12:27 AM
Whaddya guys think: would he be playing like this if he had a contract?

317Kim
01-21-2006, 12:30 AM
:nod: I do.

I just thought he was in the slump from preseason to the first few games of the regular season.

317Kim
01-21-2006, 12:37 AM
Alright so maybe the first 10 or so games but the good thing is that he's back to the Fred I know and love. averaging double figures off the bench and making some NBA History a few weeks ago. having 2 players score 20 off the bench or something..we did it for two games, Fred and JO then Fred and Runi.

Ragnar
01-21-2006, 12:42 AM
I agree that over the last 10 games he has been. I would not mind seeing a starting lineup of

Tins
Fred
Jack or Danny
J.O. (if he is back)
Harrison

317Kim
01-21-2006, 12:46 AM
Having Fred in the starting lineup would be great because he deserves it the only reason I'd hesitate doing that is because he seems to do better with the ball in his hands and that may or may not happen with him in the starting lineup with JO, Jack, etc .. whatever is more beneficial I guess

BlueNGold
01-21-2006, 12:50 AM
Definately.

The downside is he's gradually pricing himself out of Indiana the same way James Jones did last season.

James Jones' situation is entirely different. JJ is gone because he was likely to find himself behind at least Jax, Artest and Granger. You cannot pay someone 3 mill or more when you know (think in this case) they will sit.

Unlike JJ, Fred brings several dimensions to the team on both ends of the court that the Pacers have in no other player. First, he is perhaps the team's best defender against quick guards. Second, he is potent on offense in a variety of areas: 3pt shooting, slashing, dunking...and he is becoming more creative with his drives...he can also hit the mid range jumper. But more than anything, he is showing consistent production and that is really getting the Pacers' attention. IMO, that is why Carlisle is saying FJ is considered a starter.

...and the Pacers have to recognize that FJ has been held back by several things including depth at SG when Reggie was here, Fred's own injuries...and of course the Ron Artest saga that has made it difficult for all of the players.

BlueNGold
01-21-2006, 12:54 AM
Whaddya guys think: would he be playing like this if he had a contract?
No. ...and I think the fact he is playing for a contract relieves him somewhat from the Ron Artest trade distraction. FJ has his work cut out and is going to work regardless where he ends up. Everyone else is just wondering where they might land....

Pacers#1Fan
01-21-2006, 01:07 AM
I've said it before and I'll say it again, Fred is a PIMP.

Antonio
01-21-2006, 02:13 AM
Fred Jones is a very good player. He's versatile, moreover he could be a leader, more than Jackson when JO is away, on the last game over the Cavs Pacers came back thanks to him, he was the best player on Seattle game, we won over the Warriors thanks to his baskets on the 4th quarter.
Besides, Sarunas and him, when they play together are very good! I think we should trade Jackson and AJ to start Jones and Jasikevicius as guards.

Anthem
01-21-2006, 02:36 AM
I think we should trade Jackson and AJ to start Jones and Jasikevicius as guards.
Ouch. I can't imagine the pain.

I like Fred and Saras a lot. But if we trade Jax and AJ, we better get a starter in the backcourt.

Fireball Kid
01-21-2006, 02:53 AM
Fred Jones is a very good player. He's versatile, moreover he could be a leader, more than Jackson when JO is away, on the last game over the Cavs Pacers came back thanks to him, he was the best player on Seattle game, we won over the Warriors thanks to his baskets on the 4th quarter.
Besides, Sarunas and him, when they play together are very good! I think we should trade Jackson and AJ to start Jones and Jasikevicius as guards.

If we trade "Wacko Jacko" and "AJ wannabe Styles" so Jones and Saras can start, whose gonna come off the bench?

CableKC
01-21-2006, 03:16 AM
If anything.....Freddie has been one of the more consistent scorers on the team. Since Tinsley has been out....he's been shooting 46% from the field with 14.1ppg in 29mpg mainly as a 3rd scoring option on the team. Not bad. If given more touches...he seems to produce.

Jose Slaughter
01-21-2006, 03:40 AM
James Jones' situation is entirely different. JJ is gone because he was likely to find himself behind at least Jax, Artest and Granger. You cannot pay someone 3 mill or more when you know (think in this case) they will sit.

Unlike JJ, Fred brings several dimensions to the team on both ends of the court that the Pacers have in no other player. First, he is perhaps the team's best defender against quick guards. Second, he is potent on offense in a variety of areas: 3pt shooting, slashing, dunking...and he is becoming more creative with his drives...he can also hit the mid range jumper. But more than anything, he is showing consistent production and that is really getting the Pacers' attention. IMO, that is why Carlisle is saying FJ is considered a starter.

...and the Pacers have to recognize that FJ has been held back by several things including depth at SG when Reggie was here, Fred's own injuries...and of course the Ron Artest saga that has made it difficult for all of the players.

I mentioned most of what you said at the forum party a few weeks back.

Jones is playing more like he did prior to breaking his finger last season. Coupled with what have mentioned as well as my dislike for Jackson, I would be starting Jones.

Plus I would be working just as hard to trade Jackson as I am to move Artest, but thats another thread.

timmanis2000
01-21-2006, 03:43 AM
<TABLE id=HB_Mail_Container height="100%" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0 UNSELECTABLE="on"><TBODY><TR height="100%" width="100%" UNSELECTABLE="on"><TD id=HB_Focus_Element vAlign=top width="100%" background="" height=250 UNSELECTABLE="off">Fred has played some great ball lately.</TD></TR><TR UNSELECTABLE="on" hb_tag="1"><TD style="FONT-SIZE: 1pt" height=1 UNSELECTABLE="on">
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Raskolnikov
01-21-2006, 04:17 AM
I agree that over the last 10 games he has been. I would not mind seeing a starting lineup of

Tins
Fred
Jack or Danny
J.O. (if he is back)
Harrison
If we let Danny and Fred start, Jack maybe can get back to what he was initially traded for: being the 6th man.

Btw, nice avatar, Ragnar!

Antonio
01-21-2006, 08:03 AM
If we trade "Wacko Jacko" and "AJ wannabe Styles" so Jones and Saras can start, whose gonna come off the bench?
New younger players...

indygeezer
01-21-2006, 08:16 AM
Oh great, a 6'2" starting SG...now that makes alot of sense doesn't it?

I'll grant that he's really developed his game since the brawl but, take away his hops and what have you left...an undersized average gaurd. That is what you risk trading away Jax and starting FJ in his place.

Unclebuck
01-21-2006, 09:43 AM
Oh great, a 6'2" starting SG...now that makes alot of sense doesn't it?

I'll grant that he's really developed his game since the brawl but, take away his hops and what have you left...an undersized average gaurd. That is what you risk trading away Jax and starting FJ in his place.

The size issue is very overrated, I just don't see that as much of an issue. Sure I wish he were 4 inches taller, but his lack of height should not prohibitive.


Jax is an average guard, he's not a top shooting guard in the NBA. So there is no risk at all by trading Jax away.

Yes Fred can jump, and that helps his game. But he's also very quick and strong. He's now the Pacers best perimeter defender. He is really good at keeping guys in front of him.

The problem with Fred starting has nothing to do with him not being good enough, and it has nothing to do with his lack of size. He just does not fit in well with Tinsley and J.O. When Freddie is on the court with those two guys that limits him, and he essentially becomes a spot up shooter.

Cro is better with J.O. and Jamaal, while Fred is better with either Saras or AJ and Jeff.

BlueNGold
01-21-2006, 09:45 AM
I think RC would be wise to keep FJ regardless of his height. Will he accept a well paid 6th man role? Does it really matter if we put him in the starting lineup...if we have someone else who can step in to guard Michael Redd? Fred is going to be a mismatch against almost anyone we face. He is a very good player now and might turn the corner and be a great one.

indygeezer
01-21-2006, 10:25 AM
The size issue is very overrated, I just don't see that as much of an issue. Sure I wish he were 4 inches taller, but his lack of height should not prohibitive.


Jax is an average guard, he's not a top shooting guard in the NBA. So there is no risk at all by trading Jax away.

Yes Fred can jump, and that helps his game. But he's also very quick and strong. He's now the Pacers best perimeter defender. He is really good at keeping guys in front of him.

The problem with Fred starting has nothing to do with him not being good enough, and it has nothing to do with his lack of size. He just does not fit in well with Tinsley and J.O. When Freddie is on the court with those two guys that limits him, and he essentially becomes a spot up shooter.

Cro is better with J.O. and Jamaal, while Fred is better with either Saras or AJ and Jeff.


So do you want him guarding the Rip Hamilton's and Michael Finley's night after night?

Unclebuck
01-21-2006, 11:32 AM
So do you want him guarding the Rip Hamilton's and Michael Finley's night after night?



Finley doesn't worry me. Rip worries me no matter who we put on him. Fred does a decent job on him.

Fred is better against those smaller shooting guards and bigger point guards who love to penetrate.

PacerMan
01-21-2006, 12:24 PM
Finley doesn't worry me. Rip worries me no matter who we put on him. Fred does a decent job on him.

Fred is better against those smaller shooting guards and bigger point guards who love to penetrade.

Fred has done yeomans work against Hamilton in the past. ANd numbers don't tell the story. Remember one game where Hamilton had 20 but almost everyone was an slop shot. Double pump, falling backwards, etc because Fred was IN HIS FACE every time. Thats all you can do. A really good offensive player is just going to be unstoppable from time to time, no matter who's guarding them.
We may well have beaten the ****-ons TWO years ago if Fred was available, when Reggie was hobbled. He was playing VERYYYYYYYYYYYY well at the end of the season .

Tim
01-21-2006, 06:20 PM
Whaddya guys think: would he be playing like this if he had a contract?

With everything else equal probably.

Tim
01-21-2006, 06:29 PM
Fred looks better because he has to do more since we are short handed.

Not long ago I was pretty high on Fred but took him off my Do Not Trade list because some errors he keeps making and didn't seem to progress over the summer.

I wouldn't mind seeing hm stay but I think he might end up going back West.

Bball
01-21-2006, 06:39 PM
Fred looks better because he has to do more since we are short handed.

Not long ago I was pretty high on Fred but took him off my Do Not Trade list because some errors he keeps making and didn't seem to progress over the summer.

I wouldn't mind seeing hm stay but I think he might end up going back West.


You don't like the jump before he passes with no idea what he's going to do with the ball?

-Bball

Roy Munson
01-21-2006, 07:31 PM
You don't like the jump before he passes with no idea what he's going to do with the ball?

-Bball

You act like he does this all the time. Why don't you take a look at his turnover stats. He doesn't get very many. His assist to turnover ratio is a solid 1.6 - 1, which is fourth on the team behind the three point guards. It is much better than SJax at 0.9 - 1.

I think you're being unfair to Freddy by insinuating that he is wild and careless from the ball. Far from it, he does a good job taking care of the ball.

LuckyMcPhearson
01-21-2006, 09:25 PM
Whaddya guys think: would he be playing like this if he had a contract?

No doubt about it. Freddie had his breakout season last year. I don't think his play has anything to do with contract status but rather just the natural process of improving as a player and being given a bigger role on the team.

Anthem
01-21-2006, 09:33 PM
You act like he does this all the time. Why don't you take a look at his turnover stats. He doesn't get very many. His assist to turnover ratio is a solid 1.6 - 1, which is fourth on the team behind the three point guards. It is much better than SJax at 0.9 - 1.

I think you're being unfair to Freddy by insinuating that he is wild and careless from the ball. Far from it, he does a good job taking care of the ball.
Just about all of his turnovers come from the move Bball described. His A/T would soar if he cut that out.