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NZPacer
12-18-2005, 03:26 AM
http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051218/COLUMNISTS01/512180504/1088/SPORTS04

Bob Kravitz
Trade this guy and let us get on with our lives

I believe I speak for a large segment of humanity, and most Indiana Pacers fans, when I ask the following question:

Huh?
Donnie Walsh would cut off the nose to spite the face, let Ron Artest rot in hoops purgatory while his short-handed team kills itself trying to earn a fifth seed in the Eastern Conference?
Tell me Walsh is just using that as a public ploy to get some kind of leverage. Tell me that's not an option. Tell me that was just frustration talking.
Artest was the catalyst who ruined last season. How could management let Artest do it for a second straight year?
If the Pacers punish Artest by giving him the Terrell Owens treatment, they will also punish the people who least deserve to pay for Artest's missteps -- his (former) Indiana teammates.
"If (Artest) stays on the inactive list, how does that help us?'' Jermaine O'Neal said late Friday night, long after his team had beaten the Utah Jazz at the Fieldhouse. "I respect everything Donnie does. I respect how he runs the organization, his decision-making, and he's one of the guys who says something, and his word is good. But not trading him doesn't help us. Bring us somebody who can make us better. Give us something we can look forward to.
"If he's on the inactive list, he's still damaging the team we have now, and that's not right.''
At times, O'Neal's well-intentioned forays into team management are misguided. For example, his desire to pursue Bonzi Wells ignores the fact he was such a bad actor in Memphis that the Grizzlies basically fired him in the middle of the playoffs. On this issue, though, he couldn't be more correct.
Nobody is insisting Walsh should make a deal in the next 10 minutes. But he's got to make a deal, even if -- even though -- he's not going to get fair value. What kind of value does he get if he leaves Artest on the inactive list? Management's disappointment and anger are understandable, and it might feel good to make Artest sit for a second straight year. But ultimately, who gets hurt here?
The Indiana Pacers.
The guys who (literally) already have taken punches for the guy who abandoned them.
They deserve a deal.
And they deserve one sooner rather than later.
"As long as (Artest) is around here, we'll never be able to put this behind us,'' O'Neal said. "There are always going to be interviews, stories, 'Should he come back? Will he come back?' Now, he's going on local TV and all the radio stations, talking about this. We've had enough of it already. It's time to move on.''
Everybody knows that Walsh -- and, presumably, Larry Bird, although he's in Europe now -- have no leverage. And they're trying to get Artest for a smelly jock and a case of Gatorade. Sometimes, though, you've got to hold your breath and do what has to be done.
This is a salvaging job. This is getting Scot Pollard rather than lose Brad Miller for nothing. Management made a terrible mistake by holding onto Artest as long as it did; the greater mistake would be to compound it by holding on to him in the dubious hope his value will increase down the line.
They know they need another low-post presence, a guy who can play a number of different positions. But what they're going to get is a body or two. And whatever they get in return won't be nearly enough to make up for the fact that in the past two years, the Pacers have not only lost Artest, but lost Brad Miller, Reggie Miller and Jonathan Bender for next to nothing.
"I still think a Bonzi or an Al Harrington would be the best way to go,'' O'Neal said. "Nothing against (Peja) Stojakovic, but I don't know how his game would play in this (Eastern) conference.''
Just get somebody.
And get him soon.
Let's make this clear, in case it wasn't clear already: The door to Artest's return to the Indiana Pacers is shut. It's deadbolted. It's slammed, sealed, hermetically sealed and Super Glued.
Artest can tell us he now wants to come back, and nothing is going to change.
The divorce is final. It's just a matter of paperwork now.
The truth is, and has been for quite some time now, the players do not want him. They haven't for a long time.
"Addition by subtraction,'' Austin Croshere called it. "Now, not having to deal with him, it's really a welcome sigh of relief."
O'Neal, who has tried over the years to make Artest part of the Pacers' family, is adamant, and he can't be blamed.
"We can never play together,'' he said. "If he came back somehow, it would be him or me.''
And Rick Carlisle, too.
After all of the foolishness, all of the madness, all of the miscalculations by a front office that should have known better, there is only one thing worse than a bad deal.
That's no deal.


Bob Kravitz is a columnist for The Indianapolis Star. Call him at (317) 444-6643 or e-mail bob.kravitz@indystar.com.


Copyright 2005 IndyStar.com. All rights reserved

Harmonica
12-18-2005, 03:38 AM
Sorry Bob, none of this will work on Donnie. He'll just sniff his nose at it.

CableKC
12-18-2005, 03:46 AM
How surprising....an article about Artest from Bob Kravitz.

rabid
12-18-2005, 03:47 AM
Yeah, but look at the quotes he got.

Bball
12-18-2005, 03:51 AM
http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051218/COLUMNISTS01/512180504/1088/SPORTS04

Bob Kravitz
Trade this guy and let us get on with our lives


O'Neal, who has tried over the years to make Artest part of the Pacers' family, is adamant, and he can't be blamed.
"We can never play together,'' he said. "If he came back somehow, it would be him or me.''



"And don't fire Isiah either!"


-Bball

Evan_The_Dude
12-18-2005, 03:51 AM
I'm hoping Jax gets shipped out too. If he's on Ron's side, then he's going to go against anybody that doesn't have Ron's back, which is Croshere and O'Neal as far as we know.

NorCal_Pacerfan
12-18-2005, 03:55 AM
Sorry Bob, none of this will work on Donnie. He'll just sniff his nose at it.

I agree. He can keep his opinion. Donny and LB will handle this.
If Ron needs to sit for a while, then so be it. Don't rush into anything. The team is already better off with Ron gone.

Pingu
12-18-2005, 06:44 AM
I'm hoping Jax gets shipped out too. If he's on Ron's side, then he's going to go against anybody that doesn't have Ron's back, which is Croshere and O'Neal as far as we know.


Exactly what I thought, Jack in not on the same page as the team

Naptown Seth
12-18-2005, 08:04 AM
There's no major benefit for trading Ron anytime before Tuesday, since the Pacers next game isnt untill Wednesday. Maybe an extra day of practice or two for he new guys. But I do expect something to be done between now and he Pacers game Wednesday. It's been a week now, I think Donnie is probably working on finalizing a deal as we type.

ABADays
12-18-2005, 09:37 AM
Kravtiz left out one thing. Yes, Donnie wants to do what's right for the team - but I also sincerely believe he wants to do what's right for the fans.

Pacesetter
12-18-2005, 10:03 AM
Dear Indianapolis Star: Trade this guy (Kravitz) and let us get on with our lives!

Naptown Seth
12-18-2005, 10:28 AM
Dear Indianapolis Star: Trade this guy (Kravitz) and let us get on with our lives!
:laugh:

Pacers#1Fan
12-18-2005, 10:35 AM
Bob is correct in one aspect of this article, the only people getting hurt from Ron not getting traded are the Pacers. He didn't mention the fans but as I read in another post we're getting hurt too.

No, LB and DW aren't going to read this and run out just to make a trade. Kravitz is a little full of himself, we all know that.

Mr. Kravitz,
Stop with the futile attempts at trying to run this team through a newspaper. I know it's your job but come on. It's getting really tired.

mboyle1313
12-18-2005, 10:37 AM
Pacer Addicts,

As always, I find myself amused/baffled over the animosity towards Kravitz. We've had this discussion before, so no real need to rehash, but I am curious as to what it is some of you find so antagonizizng about the current column.

MJB

Naptown Seth
12-18-2005, 10:44 AM
I.M.O, most sports writers aren't liked by the fans because they give their honest, open-minded opinion instead of looking at everything with optimism like most fans do. In return the fans see this as "bashing the team" and take it overly personal.

Pacers#1Fan
12-18-2005, 10:45 AM
With Bob it's the same thing every article. He thinks he is the all knowing God of Indiana sports. It just gets a little old. I will say he makes some solid points every so often. He seems to bash the Pacers more than compliment.

heywoode
12-18-2005, 10:48 AM
I never saw the previous discussions regarding Kravitz, so I don't know what has or has not been stated already. Although I've never had a problem with him, I'm guessing that before this recent Artest episode, Kravitz may have been viewed as a bit antagonistic towards the beloved Ronnie. Now that he has burned his last bridge, Kravitz is still railing on him, and even though people now mostly agree with him, it is hard to get beyond that past animosity.

I have no problem admitting that, with 20/20 hindsight, Bob has been right all along.

aceace
12-18-2005, 10:52 AM
Sarunas Jasikevicius noted that the Pacers have been more cohesive since Artest left the lineup -- first with a wrist injury and then with his trade demand -- regardless of whether it's because of Artest's absence or because the team has stepped up their effort in the face of adversity.
"This team is as tight as it's been all year," Jasikevicius said. "We're playing like one group, sharing the ball well and helping each other defensively and the results are here.
"We've been put in a difficult situation, but it looks like the Pacers are a better team when they're dealing with adversity. Things are much better now in Pacerland."


The above is the most important part of the Star newspaper this Sunday. its part of the "Artest wants to stay in Indy".

bread
12-18-2005, 10:55 AM
Although I don't agree completely, I don't see anything wrong with what he's saying. In fact, others on here have said pretty much the same thing this past week. Most of us want him gone as soon as possible, and obiviously Kravitz is in that group. That's his opinion.

One statement I don't agree with is that the Pacers are only hurting themselves. The way I see it, he's not doing anything for us, but he's not helping anyone else either. :twocents:

pizza guy
12-18-2005, 12:26 PM
Yeah, I'm not sure what in this article was so upsetting. I know, Krapitz isn't usually my favorite writer either, but there was nothing wrong with this article. Read the thing instead of just his name.

Of course, next week, when the trade is done, he'll be ragging on management for the bad trade that didn't return Artest's value. That's Krapitz.

Jermaniac
12-18-2005, 12:31 PM
He does need to hurry up and trade him. Like Jermaine said its not helping the team out at all letting Ron just sit at home. Get some players here who want to play.

ChicagoJ
12-18-2005, 01:17 PM
Pacer Addicts,

As always, I find myself amused/baffled over the animosity towards Kravitz. We've had this discussion before, so no real need to rehash, but I am curious as to what it is some of you find so antagonizizng about the current column.

MJB


"Some men you just can't reach..."

You know, its the typical "shoot the messenger" mentatality in Pacerland. Bob happens to be right on this one topic (and it may be the only topic he's ever been right on, but that's not the point...) And he is a bit abrasive, especially since he's earned the "I told you so" attitude.


The truth is, and has been for quite some time now, the players do not want him. They haven't for a long time.

"Addition by subtraction,'' Austin Croshere called it. "Now, not having to deal with him, it's really a welcome sigh of relief."

O'Neal, who has tried over the years to make Artest part of the Pacers' family, is adamant, and he can't be blamed.

"We can never play together,'' he said. "If he came back somehow, it would be him or me.''


That's some strong stuff right there.

Unclebuck
12-18-2005, 01:18 PM
Would everyone just take a breath. The trading discussions just started in earnest less than 5 days ago, give the man some time.

And please Kravitz, you are not stupid enough to believe that Ron is going to sit on the inactive list. No one is that stupid. I find entertaining, but he's also dumb if he truly believes what he writes half the time.

PacerMan
12-18-2005, 03:52 PM
I agree with totally with Kravitz. :)

And I'm loving these quotes from the players for those of you that used to argue that the the players had no problem with Artest... LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

denyfizle
12-18-2005, 06:50 PM
Dear Indianapolis Star: Trade this guy (Kravitz) and let us get on with our lives!


and yeah a sweaty jock strap and a bottle of gatorade in return are more than enough!

denyfizle
12-18-2005, 06:51 PM
I'm hoping Jax gets shipped out too. If he's on Ron's side, then he's going to go against anybody that doesn't have Ron's back, which is Croshere and O'Neal as far as we know.

wurd! we can ship out DH too. time to take out the weeds and change our image.

Pacesetter
12-18-2005, 08:50 PM
Pacer Addicts,

As always, I find myself amused/baffled over the animosity towards Kravitz. We've had this discussion before, so no real need to rehash, but I am curious as to what it is some of you find so antagonizizng about the current column.

MJB

No animosity, Mark. We all know Ron's got to go, but that takes time. The last thing the Pacers front office needs is a journeyman writer telling them when they should pull the trigger. Artest is gone, what happens next is moot. Beating Donnie Walsh up over it is unnecessary. Donnie's lost his butt on Artest, and he's trying to come out of it all with something. Kravitz ought to go and seek out Donnie to find out his side of this situation and put that in print for his readers. That would be refreshing, and I would enjoy reading something like that - something that focuses on factual information. I don't think many folks are having a hard time getting on with "their lives" as he put it!

I think Kravitz could be a terrific writer. I really do.

(P.S. You have to agree my touch up on his headline was pretty good ... ;) :D )