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cramerica
05-13-2005, 08:54 AM
And he also questions the timing of the interview.


"If only Ron Artest were here . . . Could you imagine this Detroit series with Ron Artest? . . . It sure would be different if Ron were playing."

Enough.

There are a number of reasons we need to shut up about Ron Artest, who is having as much influence on this Pistons-Pacers series as the Mohawks of John Edwards and David Harrison.

First, this is a series, even without Artest. The matchups page says it shouldn't be a series and common sense says it shouldn't be a series. But after Wednesday's victory in Auburn Hills, Mich., the Pacers can put the defending champs on the ropes tonight in Game 3 at Conseco Fieldhouse. Pistons coach Larry Brown is said to be so upset, he's ready to blame the Olympic selection committee. (Just kidding.)

Second, I'm not convinced Artest would have survived this season long enough to be a factor in the playoffs. If the meltdown hadn't happened Nov. 19, it was going to happen Dec. 22, or Jan. 18, or (pick your date). Remember, this season began with Artest's bizarre I-want-some-time-off request and the resulting suspension. Later came the Throwdown in Motown.

What was next?

With Artest, you never knew.

But you knew there would be a next time.

Third, I'm not convinced the Pacers would be making this run even if Artest were in the lineup. On paper, yes, Artest makes the Pacers a title contender. But his suspension changed the emotional dynamics of that locker room, leaving a team that became mentally stronger and more united than ever before. With Artest gone, Reggie Miller was allowed to reprise his 1994 role on a nightly basis, and a bunch of kids, most of them named Jones, got serious playing time and produced.

I bring up the Artest issue now because Artest is back in the news.

He recently was profiled by Gentlemen's Quarterly. Then, two days ago, ESPN ran its two-part interview with Artest. And that was just the beginning. Artest's new Nashville, Tenn.-based management team has him doing this Ron Across America Tour, in which Artest dresses nicely, smiles broadly and says mea culpas until he turns blue in the face.

As we've long known, Artest is an absolute master at expressing contrition.

Now, I don't take issue with Artest's desire to repair his image, although he'd help himself most by staying out of trouble for an entire year.

I take issue with the timing.

It's the playoffs. It's time to be concentrating on basketball. Specifically, it's time to be concentrating on Pacers basketball, and the best story in this year's NBA. The whole idea was to leave the brawl behind. But heeeeeere's Ronnie, smiling for those cameras, reshaping his image, doing everything but shilling for the Whizzinator.

Why?

And why now?

Why would his new management folks deem it to be in Artest's best interest to get him out there doing damage control? Is he suddenly going to grace the front of a Wheaties box? Will it help CD sales? What's the point?

As for the timing, well, if I were a member of the Pacers' organization, I would be appalled and angry.

Here's the guy who put his team's season in jeopardy and now, as his Pacers make this playoff run, he's out there selfishly trying to convince corporate America he's really a nice guy who's misunderstood.

All of this tells me something else: The idea of trading him, even if it means coming away with less than equal value, makes more sense than ever. We are seeing for ourselves that he is not indispensable. The Pacers won 44 regular-season games and have reached the second round of the playoffs. And they have done it despite losing 435 games worth of suspensions and injuries.

They may have lost scoring, rebounding and defense, but they gained something intangible and powerful, something that is helping them to achieve beyond all expectations.

Publicly, the players and management types all say they're supporting Artest and believe the year out of basketball will result in a transformation. Maybe it's all a ploy to convince potential trade suitors that he's centered and better than ever. More likely, though, they say it because they truly believe it.

Which makes me wonder which side is guilty of failing to think straight.

Think the 10th guy on the bench would be enjoying such patience and compassion? Do they really think he's going to go from hellion to St. Francis of Assisi?

I hope he found a certain sense of peace during these long days away from competitive basketball.

I hope he can come back, here or somewhere else, and show people he's a great basketball player and not a damaged soul who happens to be a great talent when he's right.

I honestly, fervently hope I'm wrong about his capacity for change, and that his fans are justified in their loud and often angry support.

Right now, though, I just don't need to see Artest on my TV, telling me he's going to return a changed man. Don't tell me. Show me. Show everybody.

In the meantime, there's one heck of a playoff series we need to be covering.

Bob Kravitz is a columnist for The Indianapolis Star. Call him at (317) 444-6643 or e-mail bob.kravitz@indystar.com.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050513/SPORTS04/505130521/1088

sixthman
05-13-2005, 08:59 AM
I question the timing of Bob's column, too.

Dollar to a doughnut this is his response to Artest's media relations people not catering to the locals.

naptownmenace
05-13-2005, 09:06 AM
Right now, though, I just don't need to see Artest on my TV, telling me he's going to return a changed man. Don't tell me. Show me. Show everybody.

In the meantime, there's one heck of a playoff series we need to be covering.


The above is the only point I can take away from that article and to be honest... I agree with him.

Talk is cheap. I want Artest show us rather than tell us.

cramerica
05-13-2005, 09:12 AM
I question the timing of Bob's column, too.

Dollar to a doughnut this is his response to Artest's media relations people not catering to the locals.
That's what I was thinking. RATS doesn't like when they don't get what they want.

Unclebuck
05-13-2005, 09:14 AM
The above is the only point I can take away from that article and to be honest... I agree with him.

Talk is cheap. I want Artest show us rather than tell us.


Yes and that is the exact same comment that Ron made in the interview.

Spicoli
05-13-2005, 09:23 AM
Artest is in a no-win situation. If he had stayed silent all through the season and playoffs, I have no doubt Kravitz would be writing a column chastising Ron for not making any public remarks and blah blah blah blah blah.

He's just looking to stir ***** up, per the usual.

bread
05-13-2005, 09:36 AM
I thought it was funny that he's writing this long article about Artest while the Pacers are playing Detroit complaining about too much media attention on Artest while the Pacers are playing Detroit. :rolleyes: Dope. Did he think there wouldn't be more media interest in Ron if/when this series happened?


Obviously he is mad because Ron's new management team won't let him talk to Ron. I personally don't understand them not letting the local media talk to Ron either. OTOH, since he has yet to utter a single good word about Ron I can understand if they don't let Kravitz talk to him. Ron might go "Palace" on his a$$!!:devil:

Los Angeles
05-13-2005, 09:38 AM
:lurk:

BillS
05-13-2005, 09:41 AM
If Kravitz really felt that Artest needs to be ignored, he could have written his column about those playoffs he so snidely implies aren't being covered.

Rather than being angry at Ron, I wouldn't be surprised if the Pacers PR folks are helping to push some of this. The better Ron looks, the more likely either he is accepted while playing for the Pacers or he is easier to trade this summer. Given that second point, you'd think Bobby would be jumping with glee at the activity.

If we weren't playing Detroit, no one would be concerned about Ron at this point. Since the attention started with the continual re-hash of the brawl, it is only right that the PR machine use this to repair and rehabilitate.

Harmonica
05-13-2005, 09:46 AM
I question the timing of Bob's column, too.

Dollar to a doughnut this is his response to Artest's media relations people not catering to the locals.

"Hmm, what am I going to write my article on today? That Artest interview on ESPN? Nah. Not juicy enough. I know! I'll write about little fluffy clouds."

Kravitz gets paid to comment on all things Pacers. This certainly falls in that category. What do you expect him to write about? Same goes for ESPN. Networks have always done human interest stories around teams that are in the playoffs.



Okay people, there's nothing to see here, let's move along now.

Alabama-Redneck
05-13-2005, 09:55 AM
The above is the only point I can take away from that article and to be honest... I agree with him.

Talk is cheap. I want Artest show us rather than tell us.

You might tell that to Stern since he is the one that will not let Ron play basketball. How else can he show he is better ? :rolleyes:

:cool:

DisplacedKnick
05-13-2005, 09:59 AM
Artest is in a no-win situation. If he had stayed silent all through the season and playoffs, I have no doubt Kravitz would be writing a column chastising Ron for not making any public remarks and blah blah blah blah blah.



He already did - remember the article where he called on Ron to apologize to Reggie?

I don't really disagree with anything Kravitz wrote - I just don't get the timing. Plus when he basically says, "let's talk about the series instead of Artest" my response is, "Take your own advice, dummy."

Looks like something he wrote just to publish the number of words he needs to justify his salary.

sc
05-13-2005, 10:19 AM
In all reality after seeing the interview do you feel confident with Artest on the team.

To me it made it him look more like a maniac.

Harmonica
05-13-2005, 10:20 AM
Looks like something he wrote just to publish the number of words he needs to justify his salary.

I believe they call it a job.

Spicoli
05-13-2005, 10:30 AM
He already did - remember the article where he called on Ron to apologize to Reggie?

I don't really disagree with anything Kravitz wrote - I just don't get the timing. Plus when he basically says, "let's talk about the series instead of Artest" my response is, "Take your own advice, dummy."

Looks like something he wrote just to publish the number of words he needs to justify his salary.


You're right, he already did.

The funny thing about Kravitz is that he gets paid to be opinionated . . . but the majority of the time I don't think HE even believes the side he is defending. He just picks the view that is most likely to stir it up and runs with it.

Kravitz is a good writer. I would just enjoy his writing more if I felt he actually believed his opinions instead of flip flopping all the time.

:badger:

Since86
05-13-2005, 11:17 AM
First, this is a series, even without Artest. The matchups page says it shouldn't be a series and common sense says it shouldn't be a series. But after Wednesday's victory in Auburn Hills, Mich., the Pacers can put the defending champs on the ropes tonight in Game 3 at Conseco Fieldhouse. Pistons coach Larry Brown is said to be so upset, he's ready to blame the Olympic selection committee. (Just kidding.)


Wow, he really changed his tune quickly. Wasn't it the day Sun/Mon when he said the Pacers would get "smoked?"

Diamond Dave
05-13-2005, 11:24 AM
While I'll agree in theory, about trading Artest that is. However Kravitz can't seem to write about anything else. I used to enjoy his articles, but now he is a one trick pony whose act has grown stale to me.

DisplacedKnick
05-13-2005, 11:33 AM
You're right, he already did.

The funny thing about Kravitz is that he gets paid to be opinionated . . . but the majority of the time I don't think HE even believes the side he is defending. He just picks the view that is most likely to stir it up and runs with it.

Kravitz is a good writer. I would just enjoy his writing more if I felt he actually believed his opinions instead of flip flopping all the time.

:badger:

I'm not even sure it's what he believes - I think he just likes to take a position opposite what most everyone else thinks.

Frex, last year when the Pacers were winning 61 games, he went out of his way to talk about weaknesses in the team. This year - and pretty early - he talked about how good this could be for the team in a lot of ways.

I'd call it "Devil's Advocate Journalism."

It's OK. Most of the ESPN reporters are worse.

Anthem
05-13-2005, 12:11 PM
I question the timing of Bob's column, too.

Dollar to a doughnut this is his response to Artest's media relations people not catering to the locals.

Agreed. Absolutely right.

I don't question the timing of his firm at all. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if they kept him out of the media expressly so he'd be "fresh" for a Pacers-Pistons matchup. They're going to be showing clips of Ron Artest, guys. It's either Ron in a suit talking nice or Ron in a uniform going into the stands.

RWB
05-13-2005, 12:28 PM
Bob's 15 minutes are up. He's been seen twice now on television and didn't make the impact he thought he would. Sorry Bob, no "Around The Horn" for you so go back into your bedroom and tear down that Woody poster you worship.

PacerMan
05-13-2005, 12:35 PM
In all reality after seeing the interview do you feel confident with Artest on the team.

To me it made it him look more like a maniac.

agreed

Anthem
05-13-2005, 01:04 PM
agreed

Yeah, but we all know if Jermaine and Jax both broke their legs next year and Ron single-handedly lead us to a championship, your first reaction would be "Trade him now while his value is high!"

Bball
05-13-2005, 01:11 PM
I think I've seen at least 3 sep complaints in this thread with Kravitz and each one conflicts with the other.

-Bball

Anthem
05-13-2005, 02:00 PM
I think I've seen at least 3 sep complaints in this thread with Kravitz and each one conflicts with the other.

You're gonna have to clarify for me. The primary 3 complaints I see are:

1. He's pissy because the local media didn't get dibs.
2. He doesn't follow his own advice re: ignoring Artest.
3. He writes opinions, but doesn't actually seem to hold them himself or remember what he's said in the past. He's pretty much always willing to take a shot at something, regardless of whether it needs shooting.

I see no conflict between these three. What objections are you referring to, and how do they conflict with each other?

t1hs0n
05-13-2005, 02:44 PM
I don't like that he has become the mouthpiece for this city. He works for a large media company and his own agenda, not for Indy.

aceace
05-13-2005, 03:45 PM
I don't like that he has become the mouthpiece for this city. He works for a large media company and his own agenda, not for Indy.

So very true. Newspaper sales nationwide are suffering tremendously some of the major ones are done 10%. I know so many people that get their news from the net now. I won't and never will buy a newspaper because Krapitz might say something interesting. IMHO the Pacers want to build RA's image just in case a good deal comes across the board. He's not untradeable now when you look at what the team has accomplished. With that said I still want him here and he should get rid of that 91 jersey.

Jesus Shuttlesworth
05-13-2005, 03:54 PM
So if the Pacers were to win it all this year do you think they would trade him? I really hope they keep him. There isn't a player I'd rather have than Artest and I mean that.

Hicks
05-13-2005, 03:58 PM
Definitely they would. I think they will anyway, so it's probably inconsequential.

PacerMan
05-14-2005, 12:43 AM
Yeah, but we all know if Jermaine and Jax both broke their legs next year and Ron single-handedly lead us to a championship, your first reaction would be "Trade him now while his value is high!"

Right, so what's your point? :)




actually, not at all correct. My WHOLE dislike of Ron has to do with my valuing TEAM above all. And my belief that Ron will never understand/play within the framework of TEAM above all.
Thus, they will never win it all with Ron playing as a Pacer. (JMO obviously)
IF the miracle happened, I would be MOST happy to welcome his reclaimed soul back into the fold. Pains me greatly to see his great talent wasted.

Anthem
05-14-2005, 03:39 AM
Definitely they would. I think they will anyway, so it's probably inconsequential.

Would you trade Ron and Jeff for Lamar Odom?

Mushmouth
05-14-2005, 03:51 AM
Please folks - no, we aren't trading Ron. It's game 4 of the semi's, and Ron is not an issue. We get pissed when people talk about Phil Jackson , Knicks, Lakers, in the offseason, lets all stay that way when we talk about next year.

Ron is back - that's how it is GOING TO BE.

I have a beer for every person who thinks I'm wrong at the first game I go to in Indy next year.

Sign up here.

that's my last Ron-Ron post til post-season

skyfire
05-14-2005, 06:27 AM
Would you trade Ron and Jeff for Lamar Odom?

With the way that Jeff is playing atm, he would be the best backup bigman in the NBA.

I'd much prefer Ron, Bender and #17 pick for Odom and a final yr contract.
I'd also much prefer not to trade Ron, but if it had to be done then Odom would be a very good substitute for Ron. I hate to think of Ron in a Lakers uniform tho *shudder*

Dunno if the Lakers would be willing to take Ron tho, they seem more than some other teams, required to justify their trades to their fickle fanbase. I thought Kobe and Butler was working relatively well for the few games they were playing together, much better than Kobe and Odom anyways. Not sure if they would be willing to take on another SF who needs his share of the ball after their failed experiment with Odom.

PacerMan
05-14-2005, 11:08 AM
Please folks - no, we aren't trading Ron. It's game 4 of the semi's, and Ron is not an issue. We get pissed when people talk about Phil Jackson , Knicks, Lakers, in the offseason, lets all stay that way when we talk about next year.

Ron is back - that's how it is GOING TO BE.

I have a beer for every person who thinks I'm wrong at the first game I go to in Indy next year.

Sign up here.

that's my last Ron-Ron post til post-season

I"ll have a Bud lite!!!!!!!!!

PacerMan
05-14-2005, 11:09 AM
With the way that Jeff is playing atm, he would be the best backup bigman in the NBA.

I'd much prefer Ron, Bender and #17 pick for Odom and a final yr contract.
I'd also much prefer not to trade Ron, but if it had to be done then Odom would be a very good substitute for Ron. I hate to think of Ron in a Lakers uniform tho *shudder*

Dunno if the Lakers would be willing to take Ron tho, they seem more than some other teams, required to justify their trades to their fickle fanbase. I thought Kobe and Butler was working relatively well for the few games they were playing together, much better than Kobe and Odom anyways. Not sure if they would be willing to take on another SF who needs his share of the ball after their failed experiment with Odom.

Those both seem like too much to give for Odom.

Anthem
05-14-2005, 12:07 PM
Those both seem like too much to give for Odom.

Let me get this straight.... You hate Ron and think he's got negative value, but bundling him with Bender and getting Odom is too much?

Hicks
05-14-2005, 01:13 PM
Would you trade Ron and Jeff for Lamar Odom?

If only you'd have asked me that BEFORE Jeff turned into the hero of this series.

But yeah, I probably still would. Odom's best at PF anyway, as evidence I submit his year in Miami at the 4, and no Jeff means he has a great chance to do that. You could either start him with JO at 5, or more likely, make him our own McDyess of sorts. That's a hell of a 6th man.

Anthem
05-14-2005, 01:30 PM
If only you'd have asked me that BEFORE Jeff turned into the hero of this series.

But yeah, I probably still would. Odom's best at PF anyway, as evidence I submit his year in Miami at the 4, and no Jeff means he has a great chance to do that. You could either start him with JO at 5, or more likely, make him our own McDyess of sorts. That's a hell of a 6th man.

Well, if we got Odom I'd expect him to play at the 3 instead of the 4. Otherwise we're lacking at the swing spot and we'd have to go get somebody else.