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View Full Version : Great comments by Rick Carlisle tonight on his radio show



Unclebuck
03-17-2005, 07:41 PM
Rick was talking about all the players being out this year.

To paraphrase what he said.

"The combination of Artest and Jermaine form a Shaq like dominance on the court"


I loved hearing him say that. That is the best way to descibe it. Because you don't trade Shaq and you don't trade one-half of a tandem that forms a Shaq like dominance.

If you ask me Artest and J.O are the best tandem in the NBA. if they don't get along, too bad, make them get along. I guarantee that combo WILL WIN A CHAMPIONSHIP.

Rick said that even with J.O the Pacers are still only a .500, he said that is how important Artest is.

Do you realize J.O and Artest have only played 6 games together this season.
They are 5-1 or make that 6-0, because the Pacers really won the Sixers game during that stretch.

Unclebuck
03-17-2005, 07:43 PM
Rick just said they could really use DH, but he's got a knee problem, they hope to get him back in a week or so

Suaveness
03-17-2005, 07:47 PM
Yay for Rick saying that

Hoop
03-17-2005, 07:52 PM
I agree Buck, I sure hope we get the chance to try and make it work next season. We could be a much better team than the one that won 61 games last season.

Now, I kinda hope JO doesn't come back the rest of this season, nothing against JO, I love him. I'd just like for our role players to make the playoffs without him and gain some real crunch time experience. It can only help us in the long run.

SoupIsGood
03-17-2005, 07:54 PM
I don't agree, neither of them are near the presence that Shaq is offensively. (Or on the boards, for that matter)

But even if they were, does it matter when one is always hurt and shooting fades, while the other is halfway insane?

Unclebuck
03-17-2005, 07:55 PM
Rick just foreshadowed next season.

He said if everyone were healthy, The starting lineup would be

Tinsley
Reggie
Artest
J.O
Dale

So if Reggie retires, we;ll see who starts in his spot.

I get the impression that Rick loves Dale and what he brings

Peck
03-17-2005, 07:57 PM
So what you are saying then is that Rick just admitted that Jermaine O'Neal is the most over paid player in the NBA?

Los Angeles
03-17-2005, 08:05 PM
Soup, you crack me up sometimes.

Brutal, man. But I gotta love it!

Indyfan
03-17-2005, 08:08 PM
I missed the first segment, but I heard Rick say that Artest won't be back this season when responding to one of the callers, did they talk about that in the first segment at all? Rick sounded pretty emphatic about it so I wondered if they have made any formal statements about it.

Peck, Rick also said that having Ron without JO would be the same result. Not sure that makes JO the most overpaid player in the NBA. The two of them together just make them both that much more effective.

It makes you think of what could have been to hear him saying who would be starting and who we would have off the bench if everyone was healthy and not suspended! But then we have to wake up and realize we still don't have our 2 best players for the rest of the season, and Tins is out for some more time still. It is amazing that we win any games at all.

Unclebuck
03-17-2005, 08:16 PM
So what you are saying then is that Rick just admitted that Jermaine O'Neal is the most over paid player in the NBA?


Peck, he said Dale is starting next season. Be happy

ChicagoJ
03-17-2005, 08:20 PM
Assuming somebody doesn't offer Dale enough money to bolt...

UB, are you offering money-back guarantees?

:D

Peck
03-17-2005, 08:20 PM
Peck, he said Dale is starting next season. Be happy

Yeah yeah your right. You'll have to forgive me, I'm new to this sunshine stuff. :sunshine:

Ragnar
03-17-2005, 08:23 PM
I would not say Jermaine is horribly overpaid. He is a starter who can score 25 ppg and grab 10 rpg. Thats worth a lot. It is not his fault that Rick wants the slow it down toss it into Jermaine offense. I would say that when Ron is playing he is horribly underpaid. Of course he needs to actually play for that distinction.

But I agree the two of them are a great tandem add Jamaal, Dale and Jack and I am salivating at what they can do on the floor together. I think that would be the best starting 5 in the NBA. Add Jeff, Fred, David and J.J. coming off the bench and you have a pretty damn good rotation.

If we do anything this off season it should be to try and package Austin (I love him too but he needs a change of scenery) with Scott and try and get a pg in return who can back up Jamaal. We need to dump A.J. and Eddie and get two new ones since Fred will probably get a lot of minutes at the 2 with Reggie retiring and Jack having a propensity to foul.

Unclebuck
03-17-2005, 08:28 PM
Assuming somebody doesn't offer Dale enough money to bolt...

UB, are you offering money-back guarantees?

:D


If they are kept together for the next 5 seasons, and don't win the NBA championship, I'll (let me think what will I do) pay for the whole forum party myself, I'll do a lot more than that, can't think of anything, but I'll do something

Hicks
03-17-2005, 08:39 PM
Assuming somebody doesn't offer Dale enough money to bolt...:D

:thumbsdown: :tongue:

I hightly doubt it. Before he even returned, for years he'd made it known he wanted to come home. He's clearly very happy with the team he chose to sign with, and has already stated at least once that 1) He plans to retire a Pacer (in a few years) and 2) It won't be hard to negotiate a contract.

The biggest chance of him not being here came just before he signed, when his motivation was a title chase. He still chose us.

I'd say it's 90+% likely he's a Pacer for the rest of his days in the NBA.

ChicagoJ
03-17-2005, 08:59 PM
I agree, but he's always been about the Benjamins in the past.

If somebody sees his resurgence and thinks he's still got something in the tank... he's just driving up his own value right now and he's going to take the deal from whomever offers him the most money.

Based on what we've seen in the last two weeks, I think somebody will offer him the MLE or its equivalent under the new CBA. And we don't have his "Bird rights".

MagicRat
03-17-2005, 09:07 PM
http://prometheus.able-towers.com/~magicrat/carlisle031705.wma (http://prometheus.able-towers.com/%7Emagicrat/carlisle031705.wma)

beast23
03-17-2005, 10:05 PM
If they are kept together for the next 5 seasons, and don't win the NBA championship, I'll (let me think what will I do) pay for the whole forum party myself, I'll do a lot more than that, can't think of anything, but I'll do somethingI'd say that sounds reasonable. About the time that DD retires, Harrison should be ready to take over.

Other players coming off the payroll in the next two years are Bender, Croshere and Pollard. Those expiring contracts should be able to bring back a decent backup or two in return.

Harmonica
03-17-2005, 10:07 PM
Rick just foreshadowed next season.

He said if everyone were healthy, The starting lineup would be

Tinsley
Reggie
Artest
J.O
Dale


Rick has little say in what the front office ultimately does and if Donnie and Larry don't make a Herculean effort to trade Ron in the off-season, they're crazier than he is. Although I doubt any other GM in the league is crazy enough to take a chance on him. We just may be stuck with him.

indytoad
03-17-2005, 10:10 PM
I agree, but he's always been about the Benjamins in the past.

If somebody sees his resurgence and thinks he's still got something in the tank... he's just driving up his own value right now and he's going to take the deal from whomever offers him the most money.

Based on what we've seen in the last two weeks, I think somebody will offer him the MLE or its equivalent under the new CBA. And we don't have his "Bird rights".

You probably shouldn't say that kind of stuff with Peck around...

IndyToad
Is now "Idle"

Unclebuck
03-17-2005, 10:13 PM
Rick has little say in what the front office ultimately does and if Donnie and Larry don't make a Herculean effort to trade Ron in the off-season, they're crazier than he is. Although I doubt any other GM in the league is crazy enough to take a chance on him. We just may be stuck with him.


Is Artest a gamble. Obviously he is. Is he a gamble worth taking. I say yes without question. The risk is worth the reward and the reward is a championship.

That is why I was amazed and delighted by Rick's comments tonight about how the combo of J.O. and Artest formed a Shaq like dominance on the court. That is an incredible statement for a coach to make. Seems to me a coach who can't wait to get rid of Artest, simply does not make comments like that.

Harmonica
03-17-2005, 10:17 PM
That is why I was amazed and delighted by Rick's comments tonight about how the combo of J.O. and Artest formed a Shaq like dominance on the court. That is an incredible statement for a coach to make. Seems to me a coach who can't wait to get rid of Artest, simply does not make comments like that.

Well, thankfully he isn't the GM. And you may be right. Ron can't destroy the team any more than he already has. Or can he?

skyfire
03-17-2005, 10:18 PM
I agree, but he's always been about the Benjamins in the past.

If somebody sees his resurgence and thinks he's still got something in the tank... he's just driving up his own value right now and he's going to take the deal from whomever offers him the most money.

Based on what we've seen in the last two weeks, I think somebody will offer him the MLE or its equivalent under the new CBA. And we don't have his "Bird rights".

He has been earning fat sacks of cash from his last contract but chose to take 1/3 of his remaining money so he could come here. I reckon if the Pacers offer a few mill for 2-3 years then he'd be here without doubt. I hope so anyways, I cant wait to see Tins/Jax/Ron/JO/DD taking the court.

Jermaniac
03-17-2005, 10:23 PM
Man I cant wait to see how great our D will be with DD and Ron playing alongside each other :drool:

SoupIsGood
03-17-2005, 11:07 PM
If kittens were cows, I'd have one hell of a problem sitting here in my lap.

Jose Slaughter
03-17-2005, 11:22 PM
Rick was talking about all the players being out this year.

To paraphrase what he said.

"The combination of Artest and Jermaine form a Shaq like dominance on the court"


I loved hearing him say that. That is the best way to descibe it. Because you don't trade Shaq and you don't trade one-half of a tandem that forms a Shaq like dominance.

If you ask me Artest and J.O are the best tandem in the NBA. if they don't get along, too bad, make them get along. I guarantee that combo WILL WIN A CHAMPIONSHIP.

Rick said that even with J.O the Pacers are still only a .500, he said that is how important Artest is.

Do you realize J.O and Artest have only played 6 games together this season.
They are 5-1 or make that 6-0, because the Pacers really won the Sixers game during that stretch.

Because you don't trade Shaq

UB, I respect ya ta death & I'm right there with ya on Ronnie, but I think you might want to review some the transactions from last summer.

Anthem
03-18-2005, 12:08 AM
Oh, they traded him. But who got the better of that deal?

I said Miami gave up too much, but I think I was wrong.

skyfire
03-18-2005, 02:33 AM
LA got some fine players out of that trade but they dont come close to equaling the effect that Shaq has on the game. Odom is definately not having the season he had last year, while Shaq is on track for MVP. I'd say Miami likes how the deal ended up.

SkipperZ
03-18-2005, 06:30 AM
So what you are saying then is that Rick just admitted that Jermaine O'Neal is the most over paid player in the NBA?


Kobe makes just as much, and the lakers after losing shaq became a .500 team. But you would be hard pressed to find an unbiased someone who honestly thinks Kobe is overpaid.

Also, the idea of JO Artest DD on the court at the same time makes me wet my boxers. If we could only get Reggie to come back, the idea of an 8 man rotation of JO Artest DD Reg Tins SJax Freddie and Foster makes me damn near cry. That would be, top to bottom, bar none the most solid 8 man rotation in all of basketball this season, even moreso than the Spurs.

Bball
03-18-2005, 07:06 AM
Gambling on Artest is one thing BUT the team needs to strick a balance and have an insurance policy in place should Artest go 'Artest' at some point.

IOW, we can't put all our eggs in that basket. I don't expect us to have a starting caliber All Star SF waiting in the wings BUT I do expect us to have people on the bench who could at least 'play' if called upon and not be a project so buried on the bench that there is no way they'll be of use... or an injured overhyped overpaid bust...

-Bball

Harmonica
03-18-2005, 07:21 AM
Gambling on Artest is one thing BUT the team needs to strick a balance and have an insurance policy in place should Artest go 'Artest' at some point.

IOW, we can't put all our eggs in that basket. I don't expect us to have a starting caliber All Star SF waiting in the wings BUT I do expect us to have people on the bench who could at least 'play' if called upon and not be a project so buried on the bench that there is no way they'll be of use... or an injured overhyped overpaid bust...

-Bball

One of the few things I agree with you on as of late. (winking smiley goes here) Bird and Walsh would be absolutely bananas to rest the future of this team on Ron's shoulders.

rabid
03-18-2005, 11:54 AM
Bird and Walsh would be absolutely bananas to rest the future of this team on Ron's shoulders.

Well, it appears likely they're going to do just that...

Harmonica
03-18-2005, 02:00 PM
Well, it appears likely they're going to do just that...

I'm not convinced of that. They are rational businessmen, not emotional fanboys. If Ron's in a Pacers uniform next year, it will only be because they couldn't find someone foolish enough to take him.

brichard
03-18-2005, 03:00 PM
For the anti-Artest crowd, and believe me... Ron has earned that fan club, what are our real options with Ron? His trade value is nil, so much like Bender, I think you have to roll the dice on him for now and invest all your resources in making him the best he can be. The same people who criticize Walsh for hanging on to Artest are also the same folks saying that Dumars was a genius for signing Wallace. Both are awesome players who have had a history of being headcases. There is no such thing as a risk free risk, and that is what I think people are looking for.

If we lose Artest we have to get something in return. As Bird has said before, most of his offers before the deadline were "wanting Ronnie for nothing." Bird is confident that this will turn Artest around. Sprewell turned things around. Wallace turned things around. Will Artest get it going? It remains to be seen, but I don't see what other realistic options we have.

Gyron
03-18-2005, 03:25 PM
I don't think Spreewell is an ideal candidate for "turned things around" unfortunately.....

I mean how's he gonna feed his family on only $14 mil a year???????

3Ball
03-18-2005, 04:19 PM
Kobe makes just as much, and the lakers after losing shaq became a .500 team. But you would be hard pressed to find an unbiased someone who honestly thinks Kobe is overpaid.

Also, the idea of JO Artest DD on the court at the same time makes me wet my boxers. If we could only get Reggie to come back, the idea of an 8 man rotation of JO Artest DD Reg Tins SJax Freddie and Foster makes me damn near cry. That would be, top to bottom, bar none the most solid 8 man rotation in all of basketball this season, even moreso than the Spurs.

I guess I would say that I think every single person in the entire NBA is overpaid. Guys on a 10-day contract earn more than a 30-year high school teacher makes in a year.

Of course, I have trouble imagining how anyone in the history of the world has actually ever EARNED $1,000,000 in a year. No matter what they got paid.

shags
03-18-2005, 04:42 PM
I don't think Spreewell is an ideal candidate for "turned things around" unfortunately.....

I mean how's he gonna feed his family on only $14 mil a year???????

Sprewell had been relatively well behaved (for him) after he was suspended for choking Carlesimo, until this season. This year, he's the textbook example of how not to act in the last year of your contract. They ought to be teaching that at the seminar for NBA rookies.

Artest is never going to be a Tim Duncan or Grant Hill in terms of behavior. Sprewell's behavior post-choke is a good scenario for Pacer fans.

Anthem
03-18-2005, 04:57 PM
I'm not convinced of that. They are rational businessmen, not emotional fanboys. If Ron's in a Pacers uniform next year, it will only be because they couldn't find someone foolish enough to take him.

Donnie Walsh refused to move Croshere for salary cap space, insisting that he had to have "equal value" in return.

You think they're going to give away Artest?

Harmonica
03-18-2005, 05:30 PM
Donnie Walsh refused to move Croshere for salary cap space, insisting that he had to have "equal value" in return.

You think they're going to give away Artest?

I don't know. But you know, I had lunch yesterday with a friend I hadn't seen in awhile and after catching up, we talked about the Pacers. We both live in LA, by the way. Being a completely mature, level-headed unbiased person, I asked him what he thought of the whole thing. First he said he thought Ron deserved the punishment he received. I asked him if he thought they had to get rid of him and without hesitation he said, absolutely, they'd be crazy not to. That obviously means nothing. But hearing it from him and being a businessman himself, it simply made more sense than anything I've read on here. No disrespect intended to those who present rational arguments to the contrary, but sometimes it's refreshing and sobering to hear an outsider's objective opinion.

kerosene
03-18-2005, 05:49 PM
Harmonica makes a very good point. People here (San Francisco area) don't follow the Pacers closely so many people just buy whatever they've seen on tv about RA, but if you ask an outsider who does follow the game what they would do with him if they were in charge, the answer is almost always "get rid of him". He's shown himself to be a liability. I'm not trying to pin all of the issues the Pacers have had this season on him though, nor do I think the punishments for everyone involved were fair but that has no bearing on whether Ron is a liability or not.

If you had someone like that working for you, would you put up with the headaches that come along with it? At what point do you cut your losses? Ron needs to show that he can control himself for sustained periods of time. The Corporation knows that the stakes are high and if anything happens again they're liable to end up in a position where cutting him, trading him for scrubs or trading for another malcontent are the only options. I would guess that Ron doesn't have near the real value he had last summer; we won't be talking about players of Peja or TMacs caliber. He may have top 15, top 20 player talent but he's in the bottom 15 in terms of judgement and reliability.

And I like RA. He was probably my favorite guy on the team because of the way he plays when he's on the floor and his obvious enthusiasm for what he does.

brichard
03-18-2005, 06:18 PM
Sprewell had been relatively well behaved (for him) after he was suspended for choking Carlesimo, until this season. This year, he's the textbook example of how not to act in the last year of your contract. They ought to be teaching that at the seminar for NBA rookies.

Artest is never going to be a Tim Duncan or Grant Hill in terms of behavior. Sprewell's behavior post-choke is a good scenario for Pacer fans.

This is well said. I'm not saying Ron is a good candidate for hall monitor, and niether is Rasheed Wallace for that matter. One thing that has been proven though, teams can win with a head case.

See:

Bulls (Rodman)
Rockets (Max)
Pistons (Rodman)
Pistons (Wallace)

Artest is going to either A) get things under control, or B) be out of the league. Either way the Pacers will find out in the next few years.

Anthem
03-18-2005, 06:39 PM
I don't know. But you know, I had lunch yesterday with a friend I hadn't seen in awhile and after catching up, we talked about the Pacers. We both live in LA, by the way. Being a completely mature, level-headed unbiased person, I asked him what he thought of the whole thing. First he said he thought Ron deserved the punishment he received. I asked him if he thought they had to get rid of him and without hesitation he said, absolutely, they'd be crazy not to. That obviously means nothing. But hearing it from him and being a businessman himself, it simply made more sense than anything I've read on here. No disrespect intended to those who present rational arguments to the contrary, but sometimes it's refreshing and sobering to hear an outsider's objective opinion.

Yeah, I read this the first time you wrote it. :flirt:

I totally understand that that's what the average guy thinks. But the average guy gets their information from ESPN. The day after the fight I was staying with my uncle, who thought the punishments were justified. But he never saw the fight or even the initial commentary. He saw it after it had been distilled down into the one shot of Artest decking the guy on the court (which I think was fully justified and he shouldn't have been punished for it). Even the cops called that one self-defense.

shags
03-18-2005, 07:59 PM
This is well said. I'm not saying Ron is a good candidate for hall monitor, and niether is Rasheed Wallace for that matter. One thing that has been proven though, teams can win with a head case.

See:

Bulls (Rodman)
Rockets (Max)
Pistons (Rodman)
Pistons (Wallace)

Artest is going to either A) get things under control, or B) be out of the league. Either way the Pacers will find out in the next few years.

You're last sentence, IMO, sums this situation up best. The reward of keeping Ron Artest outweighs the risk, in terms of compensation, of trading him. That's why I'll be stunned if the Pacers move him. Walsh is too smart for that.

And another thing is that Rodman was not a headcase during the Bad Boys championship days. He was far and away my favorite Piston of that era.

PacerMan
03-18-2005, 09:57 PM
Rick was talking about all the players being out this year.

To paraphrase what he said.

"The combination of Artest and Jermaine form a Shaq like dominance on the court"


I loved hearing him say that. That is the best way to descibe it. Because you don't trade Shaq and you don't trade one-half of a tandem that forms a Shaq like dominance.

If you ask me Artest and J.O are the best tandem in the NBA. if they don't get along, too bad, make them get along. I guarantee that combo WILL WIN A CHAMPIONSHIP.

Rick said that even with J.O the Pacers are still only a .500, he said that is how important Artest is.

Do you realize J.O and Artest have only played 6 games together this season.
They are 5-1 or make that 6-0, because the Pacers really won the Sixers game during that stretch.


Couldn't disagree more. You guys that think winning is about who has the most talent need to look around professional sports.
Chemistry and TEAM are the thing, assuming ENOUGH talent to get it done. Portland would have won several championships if it was about collecting talent.
Is Artest a great talent? Does he make an awesome combo with Jermaine?
yep to both
Is he a first class troublemaker that COST US THIS VERY REAL CHAMPIONSHIP SEASON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
***** YES HE IS!!!!!!!
Ship his *ss out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PacerMan
03-18-2005, 10:00 PM
Well, it appears likely they're going to do just that...

When I'm selling a car, I tend to point out it's best attributes.
Do you tell the potential buyer that you think the tranny's about to go? :)

PacerMan
03-18-2005, 10:01 PM
I'm not convinced of that. They are rational businessmen, not emotional fanboys. If Ron's in a Pacers uniform next year, it will only be because they couldn't find someone foolish enough to take him.

Agreed. The nutz caused all the trouble in Indy that he's going to. THey are trying to prop up his value to get some fish to bite.

PacerMan
03-18-2005, 10:03 PM
Donnie Walsh refused to move Croshere for salary cap space, insisting that he had to have "equal value" in return.

You think they're going to give away Artest?

Nope, they'll keep talking him up and wait till they get 1/2 value.

Sounds good to me.